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I have never worried about the flammability of any automotive refrigerant I've used. They don't ignite as easily as people think and certainly are far less dangerous than the 20-30 gallons of gasoline in my fuel tank. Some people who have complained about the dangers of using 6-8 ounces of ES-12a or HC-12a seem to forget there an thousands of motor vehicles running around with huge LP tanks onboard. Good substitute refrigerants that are banned from automotive use are due to highly paid lobbyist in our political system, not because the danger is real. Ever notice that when a refrigerant patent is about to expire a new one comes along that is freshly patented and protected from competition?

Absolutely. Nobody here thinks any less of you for asking. For my part, I too first came here with a "stupid question" that I couldn't get a straight answer to elsewhere, and I stayed because this is where I found clarity. So forget the greasy kid stuff. Get over your nerves and do it the way they tell you to do it. If you start winging it, that's when you're going to be stepping outside of established parameters and getting into trouble.

Perhaps, but if so it sounds like a stupid shortcut to me.

B and I met travelvw last Friday in Missouri for some trail riding and camping. Within an hour we got to a paved stream crossing. Got enough water in the car the power locks on the Outback stopped working. Did some trail riding that night, saw some small waterfalls. Travelvw got stuck in a mud hole in his Marty McFly Toyota so I drove around and pulled him out. Didn't seem to hurt anything, he said later it was just an inch below the doors and trans/tcase vents. Camped out on a little hilltop, it was warm at night and rained quite a bit very early in the morning. The next day we followed travelvw around. Saw more little waterfalls and some excellent views. He talked us into trying one rocky climb that we probably would have just driven around on our own. I was able to get most of the way up the hard way in low with center diff locked but the ledges were spaced just right so I'd get all four wheels stuck in muddy ditches and couldn't quite make it all the way. Took an easier line and was able to make it up. B tried it in the Forester with the dual range a couple times, couldn't get quite as far, and took the bypass. Went to an old school bus that's been parked for a long time. Went to a campsite along a big stream and parked the cars, travelvw's friend R showed up and we all rode in travelvw's truck across the stream and a little farther down the trail to a cool waterfall. While we were walking around I saw a baby snapping turtle floating helplessly down the stream. Thought it was a leaf at first. I was able to grab it out of the water and showed the guys. It was playing dead so I took it back to the campsite. It eventually started crawling again so B took it in the woods so we wouldn't step on it. Sunday morning we went to a trailhead and travelvw got in B's car and R got in mine. We did a loop we'd done Saturday just to show R the trails and what the cars could do. More cool rocky climbs and great views. Stopped at an old cellar to make PB&Js and check on a few things, just tightened up some bolts. Kept going and got to a badly rutted out muddy section (with an easy bypass). Travelvw was going to just drive around it but when I told him I was going to try it he had to. After about half a dozen tries he made it through. I made it most of the way through and to keep from backing up and packing my skidplates with mud travelvw pulled me the rest of the way through. Got to an old farm and a strong flowing spring and big stream. Left front corner on the Outback was starting to make a lot of clunking noise. At first it just seemed like the control arm bushing(s) was worn out but then we noticed the subframe was cracked. Turned out later the inner tie rod was worn out too. It was supposed to rain an inch the next morning so we wanted to be fairly close to gravel so it wouldn't be too challenging to get out. Travelvw found a moth with a cool paint job. Monday morning I wanted to get off the trails before it started raining so we aired up and ran from the storm. Corner was a little sketchy on hard right turns but mostly unnoticeable on tarmac. Stopped at a little city park on the way home to get out of the cars and make PB&Js. While I was making them I saw something swimming in the pond, it looked like a carp. We looked at it closer and it turned out to be a common water snake. Got some good pictures of it and saw another one swimming around too. Power locks were working again by the time we got home. Overall a great trip, no major issues, each of us only got stuck once. Lots of low range usage. Probably the trip we've done where low range was most required just to make any of the major trail loops. Used it less than 5% of the time but absolutely required many of those times. Also made it a lot easier to hit some of the steps and obstacles slower than we would have in the past to go easier on the cars. By the end of the weekend I figured out that it's difficult to unlock the center diff (all other shifting super easy) so I only locked that when I really needed it, which was quite a few times. Travelvw wants the low range and long travel but is thinking he'd add 2” of subframe and strut spacers. This would reduce a lot of rubbing, banging, and scraping on those trails. I told him just stick with his Toyota for that kind of stuff but the lift would definitely have helped our cars down there. Already welded the crossmember and removed the control arm to replace the bushings. We're planning a couple of trips to the UP in late May / early June, if anyone's interested in joining us please PM me.