suba1

…. Thanks for responding. I feel now your diagnosis; sorry to say, along with the VISCOUS coupler is in the right neighborhood. It’s a shame I was NOT more aware of the symptoms of the VISCOUS coupler as they progress over time until they developed into the present condition. And now, stressing other parts in the transmission and I firmly believe that the VISCOUS coupler is also responsible for the FAST WEAR of the clutch and replacement compared to all of my other cars with manual transmissions. :-\

…. From your perspective, you are probably right. When I bought this car, admittedly I spent more than I should have. After I bought it, I understand that Subaru gave back a $2000.00 refund to the dealers that they could use either to keep themselves or pass it along as an incentive to the customer for each sale. Needless to say, I saw none of that. In buying this car, I spent the extra money because I thought I was buying something TOUGH as the advertisements suggested. I don’t want to sound naive here but I didn’t feel it would be that misleading! What I wanted was a car that I wouldn’t have to worry about as far as the engine, transmission, and rear, from a reasonable point of view. And at that time, I felt Subaru could deliver on that. Well, to date, the car has delivered on EVERYTHING satisfactorily with some minor exceptions during the warranty period - EXCEPT for the TRANSMISSION. It has been PROBLEMATIC right from the beginning. :-\

…. Yes, I couldn’t agree with you more. And what you have said is in essence exactly what I said to the Subaru Rep. The manuals I have, point out exactly just that. Matter of fact, I have two manual which, to my surprise, don’t even show a cut-a-way view of the guts of this transmission, not even the gear section. And both of these manuals suggest or imply that the manual transmission is somewhat critical and should be treated just like an automatic by a professional and or have hands on, up-to-date experience? My feeling is now; if I had known all of this when I bought the car, I would have most likely gotten the automatic instead of the manual. As I recall, in purchasing this car with the manual transmission there was a definite delay with the purchase, I think because of the manual transmission. Most people prefer the automatic over the manual and that should have been a clue that I either missed or didn’t consider at that time. Subaru’s efforts and attention, I think, were concentrated on what they sell the most of, not the least? :-\

…. You know this modular transmission (5 speed manual) was made this way for a reason. A transmission that is cast as one unit is, I would think, a better, more stable unit than one that is divided up into sections or pieces and bolted together, especially when it is not only modular but divided in half down the middle and also bolted together. Now it may be in Subaru’s defense that the machining operations on a production scale is the lesser of the evils here, that part I don’t know and they may NOT want you to know? I would think that there is far more chance of NOT being able to HOLD all the tolerances with everything bolted up the way the transmission is presently put together. Apparently, this approach on AVERAGE has worked out well for Subaru. Any problems that they do have with those few transmissions that are problematic are so few and far between that it is insignificant as far as Subaru is concerned. I find it odd and concerning that it is quite convenient that for them that last modular unit on the end of this transmission has been engineered and built this way, containing the VISCOUS coupler; making it very convenient to change out when it goes BAD. Suggesting, of course, that these units (VISCOUS couplers) aren’t as reliable as all the hoopla in advertising would have you to believe or as is suggested. The other point here is, the customer that has a bad VISCOUS coupler is charged for its replacement. But after its replacement by way of the rear module, if it is found later that there is something else that is wrong, there is a second and more significant charge for removing the whole transmission for a second time for evaluation. Where as if the complete transmission had been removed the first time and inspected or evaluated there would have been only one charge not two disassembles and assemblies, and yes a little bit more charge but NOT the combination of both??? :-\

.... My sentiments are very close to yours. This morning when we went to church you would never know that there was a problem with the car. About six miles away some tight turns not a bit of trouble. The trouble starts when the transmission comes up to operating tempature then it starts with the clump,clump,clump in the tight and not so tight turns by the time we got back to the house. .... This is some additional information: Within the past five or six weeks or so, just after the new clutch was installed, I detected a very low audible very slight rumble going down a moderate hill on very smooth asphalt with my foot off the gas pedal at about 25 mph coming from the transmission. Didn't know quite what to think of it at first. Checked the transmission fluid level and that was OK. Then I started hearing it on very smooth road at faster speeds when I would let my foot off the gas. If I pushed the clutch in, it stopped in all circumstances. So I added a can 24 ozs. of "Lucas transmission fix", didn't notice much change. Read the container again and it suggested up to two cans, which I did. That took out 85 - 90 % of the noise. My thinking is that the VISCOUS coupler, over time, has stressed the gear box side of this modular transmission somehow causing the low audible rumble now. It has been suggested that this is just backlash wear but I am not so sure because it started pretty much suddenly? :-\

Hi and thanks for the question. As far as I know it was a NEW unit install during the warranty period by the dealer. :-\

.... Thanks for your input. I too felt you might have had a good, valid point since the ratios hadn't been a consideration up until now. Today I put the car up on the lift and used two 34 1/2" pedestals, one under the driver's side front left and the other one under passenger's side rear right and let the lift down very gently to lock both these tires from moving. Then, I chalk marked dead bottom on the passenger side front right and the driver side left rear. I then proceeded to rotate the Left rear 10 times as my wife counted off each rotation. The same thing for 20 rotations, 30 and finally 50. The results were: where the chalk mark started is exactly were it ended. So apparently there is NO Ratio mismatch. I personally felt, like you, this might show something but was just one more item to be ruled out. .... As far as mileage goes: I do my calculations with every fill-up. I have all the gas tickets. I would say my average is 24+mpg, once in a while I'll hit 25+ and very rarely 26+, and very, very rarely I'll come up with 23+ [(+) meaning that fraction part of]. I also have a bad O2 sensor under the driver's seat which I have been purposely procrastinating in replacing because I was told that my gas mileage would drop off if not replaced. So far, to my surprise, I have NOT noticed any drop in mileage or performance but I will be replacing the unit in the near future. .... But I feel you are right. This is NOT just two bad VISCOUS Couplers with a third on the way but a symptom of what is causing it? This transmission has been problematic (and expensive at that) ever since I bought the car new . How this whole thing got started was just after I bought the car, FIRST gear started jumping out of gear. The dealer mechanic told me that the nut on the tail stock hadn't been torqued at the factory and there had been some digs in the casing on the inside so they replaced the Aluminum housing as well. And that took care of the problem until the first VISCOUS coupler went out which doesn't seem like it was very long after that as I recall. So unless the job wasn't done correctly or something wasn't completed the VISCOUS coupler is suspect.

.... Thanks again for everyone's input. Tires have been checked, three times for consistency 6' 10'' on the last set all four. New set just purchased for circumference more than anything else. Don't know what the tolerance is exactly but as I understand they are one of the consistently roundest tires you can buy. Air pressure is always checked every 3000 miles if not sooner. I keep a log book on this car. Outside of gas and what the dealer did everything is accounted for within reason. bheinen74 .... I couldn't agree with you more, the car now has 135,000 miles on it. I also just replaced the clutch which started slipping at 113,000 miles and I believe there is a direct relationship between VC and the fast wear of this clutch. I have another car that I put 476,000 miles on and it still has the original engine, transmission, clutch, and muffler. Now, it has a little blow-by and it leaks around the mains but it will still run. The point in mentioning this is I don't think anyone can accuse me of abusing the clutch on the Subaru when I can show evidence like this. .... I never gave any thought, since the car was bought new, to the fact that there could be a mismatch in drive ratios. The question now is: How do I prove that, and if it is so, would Subaru correct the problem as this should be their responsibility?

.... Before I bought my 2000 Outback Limited Wagon 2.5L 5 speed manual. Subaru was in the process of recovering from being flat on their back, sales were way way off and the AWD concept was pulling them out of the hole. When I first read about the VISCOUS coupler it sounded like a very simple unit with very little that could go wrong. A device that has two moving parts, front and aft, with silicone fluid filled. As the front half of the sealed unit spins it causes the silicone to harden up between the sets of fixed veins (on both halves of the unit internal) and become a solid causing the unit to turn as one. Now that sounds pretty simple and maybe I have over simplified this a bit? Now, this car is nine years old, absolutly nothing wrong with it except VC. If all goes as scheduled, this will be the third VC in this transmission. The first one went out soon after I bought the car, as I recall, and was replaced with a second one which did last a little longer than the first, but with clump, clump, clump from time to time in a sharp turn either side but NOT consistantly up until now it has become a regular thing. The point I am trying to make here is apparently it does NOT matter how new or old this unit is it can go out anytime. Why do I have such a hard time understanding something so simple and foolproof supposedly. As of yet I have not had one of these units opened they all go back to Subaru? Apparently there's no way of fixing them? .... Is there anyone here that can be informative. .... Thanks in advance :-\

Hi all, and thanks for your responses. My apologies for not getting back with you all right away, I was not well yesterday and the last thing I wanted to do, last night, was pound on a keyboard. GeneralDisorder …. This option would be OK I guess if it were my only option. My question would be: is this a direct bolt-up replacement or would I have additional changes to make? Install a pre-'96 2WD transmission and rear end or replace the transmission. Without making custom parts you won't be able to transfer power to only the front wheels. The center differential (before the VC) will just turn if it isn't connected to anything and the car will not move. GD Numbchux …. At this point, not knowing what this transmission’s future holds, I would hold off on this option for now but I am NOT apposed to doing it. you could definitely pull the rear housing off, and weld up the center diff. been done many times (usually for RWD....but the effect is the same). not for the faint of heart, though. especially when subaru made FWD 5MTs.....just grab one of those and drop it in. done and done. grossgary …. Your point is well taken, in fact that is exactly what I thought I was going to do but others have pointed out to me that I need to lock down the drive shaft after disconnecting from the differental. you may have a much simpler option that all of them did not mention and requires no transmission work at all. if the center diff is indeed shot and essentially "locked" right now then you have a very simple option. remove the rear driveshaft and run it FWD. that takes 30 minutes and you don't have to do anything to the transmission. Numbchux …. I agree with you I would not trust it either. I've never heard of one binding up enough that you could drive the car on it. and even if I had one that was totally locked, I wouldn't trust it to get me to the end of the driveway and back in 2WD. grossgary …. When I turn hard, as in parking space, to the right or left I get clump, clump, clump and now even on some mild turns after the VC is up to normal operating temperature. there are folks that i know that have been driving like that for years on a center diff with torque bind. quite a few miles and at least a couple years service on them. i'd run it. torque bind doesn't seem to go away, so it seems legit on those grounds. for the average daily driver I wouldn't worry that a hosed 5MT center diff is going to cause problems. one of the guys that is still running it is even doing it behind an H6 in RWD so it's getting some hp and torque pushed through it.

Hi, I am wondering just how difficult it would be to change my 2000 Subaru Outback Limited Wagon 2.5L from an AWD to a front wheel drive? I have a small shop (including lift) but I have never taken this manual 5 speed transmission out nor do I know much about this particular unit. All indications are that the VISCOUS coupler is shot. When I bought the car, I had need for the AWD on top of a mountain but have since moved to the flat lands and do not really need the AWD. My feeling is if I remove the drive line from the back of the transmission to the jackpot (Differnatial) or and perhaps take off the modual rear of the transmission and remove the guts (VISCOUS coupler) and replace the housing, affectively disconnecting the back wheels from the drive front wheels. Not sure just how this will work or what my approach should be and hoping someone there has gone before me in doing this kind of thing? Any help or understanding would be greatly appreciated. Thanks :-\