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Everything posted by Fairtax4me
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It's not that bad as long as you set everything at the proper marks for timing belt change. The marks align the cams where they are not loaded by the valves, or at least are not loaded in such a way that they will kick out of place once the belt is removed. The DOHC engines are the only ones you really need to worry about since the cams can spin opposite directions and pin valves against valves. With the SOHC engines there's no way to do that.
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Just say goodbye to the stocker. When they start screwing up like that is isn't worth trying to repair. They are easy to remove and replace with an after market cd player. If you don't feel comfortable with matching up a few wires for a harness adapter most audio shops will offer free or discounted installation if you purchase through them. But if you have a wire stripping tool and a roll of electric tape you can install a new unit all on your own and save some moolah. Crutchfield.com has a nice fitment guide where you put in your year make and model and it will sort out what equipment will fit your vehicle.
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Already submitted. Partly what prompted the write-up. I looked in the USRM and I found nothing concerning the knock sensor. Then I tried to search for a good thread about replacement, and couldn't seem to find one. I know there are some out there, I've seen them with my own three eyes. I just can't ever seem to find the good threads when I need to reference one.
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http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?p=997387#post997387
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I know there are a few of these threads floating around but I can never find them when I need to. Seems to be like that with a lot of things. So you got a P0325. Chances are if your Subaru has over 150k miles, you're gonna have to deal with this at some point, if it's not the reason you're reading this now. But what the hell is a knock sensor, and where is it, what's wrong with it, and why is it making my engine run like crap? A knock sensor is. The knock sensor senses knock. (yeah we figured that much smartass :-p , what's a knock?) Knock or spark knock, is defined in the automotive world as Detonation. Detonation is a spontaneous combustion of the fuel/air mixture in the combustion chamber during , but not initiated by, the ignition process. Detonation occurs when the heat and/or pressure of the flame created by the ignition of gases near the spark plug, causes gases in another area of the chamber to ignite as well, but before the initial flame can advance across the combustion chamber in the manner required for proper combustion. Instead of one combustion, now you have two. This creates a massive pressure spike as the gases expand much more rapidly than intended for the design of an internal combustion engine. That spike in pressure creates a resonant "shockwave", for lack of a better term, that "rings" throughout the engine and creates a sound most refer to as a "Ping". Any damage (and there can and will be damage in certain cases) from this "shockwave" will be limited to the cylinder in which it originated, but the noise it creates, the "Ping", which is similar to a hammer strike, will pass through the entire engine, and can be clearly heard outside of the car if the "knock" is bad enough. This sound is always the same frequency, and so a knock sensor is "tuned", in a way, to "listen" for sounds within a range of frequencies in order to react to knocks and provide data, in the form of an AC voltage wave, for the cars ECU. What causes knock? Octane is a main contributor to engine knock. Octane controls gasolines ability to resist combustion. Why would you want to resist combustion of gasoline? Because with heat and compression, the fuel/air mixture inside the engine can ignite all on it's own if the octane in the fuel is insufficient to prevent combustion under the conditions created by the engine. (This is why high compression engines require higher octane fuel) In order for the engine to run properly, create as much power, and as few harmful emissions as possible, we need the gasoline to combust at the RIGHT time. Timing is everything in an engine. Spark timing is wrong, it won't run. Injection timing is wrong, it wont run. Valve timing is wrong, it won't run. Everything has to work together, in perfect timing, down to mere milliseconds, in order for the engine to run, and this includes controlling the exact time that the fuel/air mixture ignites, and how long it takes for that mixture to burn. Another major contributor to knock is spark timing advance. As the engine spins faster, the time between sparks has to be reduced in order for the spark to occur when the pistons are in the correct position for optimal power production. The cars ignition system controls this based on inputs from the ECU. The engine spins faster, so the ignition system advances the timing of the spark in order to compensate. The problem is advancing the timing too far will lead to knock under certain conditions. When the ECU gets a signal from the knock sensor that a knock has occured, it will immediately back off, or retard, the spark timing in order to prevent more knock from occuring and causing severe damage to the engine internals. What kind of damage? Mostly cracked pistons or broken spark plug electrodes, but in severe cases (such as with high HP or forced induction) it can be catastrophic fracture of piston crowns, wrist pins, or connecting rods. Cracks in the cylinder head or engine block. Or it can lead to a condition known as pre-ignition. Which generally is identified after the fact by a hole melted through the center of the piston. Ok, the crash course on knock out of the way, What exactly is wrong with this sensor that it demands my attention to replace? Most of the time, it is corrosion on or inside the sensor that is creating a false voltage reading, or no reading at all. The ECU relies on this sensor to keep the engine healthy, so if it does not receive the signal it expects from the sensor, it concludes that there must be something wrong and it will then set a code, and illuminate the CEL. However sometimes the sensor can send false data, and the ECU may not catch on right away. It may tell the ECU that knock is occuring when it is not, or that no knock is occuring even when it is. This tends to result in driveability issues ranging from random power surges during acceleration, to misfiring and even stalling of the engine in some cases, even at idle engine speed. And this can happen even with no CEL, depending the type of failure of the sensor. So what is thing thing? And where is it? Subaru Knock sensors look something like this: Depending on your year and model yours will be similar but the designs did change slightly every few years. The one pictured above fits 95 and 96 EJ22. 97 to 99 are similar but have a 2 pin plug instead of single pin. Then somewhere around 99- 2000ish the design changed to a type that has a plug directly on the sensor body. Not sure It still lives in the same place on your EJ engine though, from 1990 all the way up to at least 2008 from what I can find. It is hidden below the intake manifold at the rear of the engine. Look straight down in the hole between the throttle/cruise cable levers on the left side of the throttle body and the number 4 intake runner. It will almost certainly be covered in dirt/grease/grime and will appear to be a grey blob with a wire sticking out of the side. Now that you've found it, you have to have a 10" extension or a few extensions stacked together to get to it. It has a 12mm bolt holding it to the block. Loosen the bolt, and cram your hand down in there from the back side of the throtle body to fish the sensor out from under all the hoses and wires down there. On later models it helps to remove the air box that is attached to the TB. Unhook the wire connector by fiddling with the locking clip, and you can remove the sensor from the car. What generally goes wrong with this sensor? Most of the time the housing cracks due to heat cycling. The plastic dries out and splits like this: The one on my car also had a crack here: And two more here: Out with the old and in with the new! But wait... there's a catch! Subaru specifies the sensor be installed at a 45° angle to the centerline of the engine. The section of the sensor housing with the wire sticking out must be turned to the proper angle. Why is this important? Better sensitivity? Lower chance of inteference? Could be any number of things, but the primary reason (I beleive) is because it won't seat properly and the sensor housing will be damaged if Subaru's instructions are not adhered to. The area of the block around the sensor is not flat, there is a hump about a half inch away from the sensor mounting boss,and there is a structural ridge in the block towards the bellhousing that can also interfere with the sensor. This area is very difficult to photograph, but I have outline the areas in question in this pic: The blue area is the "hump", the red is the ridge, and the green area is the "safe zone" where the sensor housing will not be damaged. Here is an example of a sensor that was installed incorrectly: Vs one that was installed at the proper angle: (looks familiar don't it? ) The incorrectly installed sensor will eventualy fail because the housing is stretched outward at the base: This creates an area where moisture can enter the sensor. This will lead to corrosion (which you can see thre is already a small amount in the area under the plastic) which will cause the sensor to send eratic readings, or no reading at all. Plug the wire connector of your new sensor into the wire harness and fish the sensor back into the nest where it lives. Once the sensor is in place stick your hand back down in there and pull the wire end into that "safe zone" before you start tightening that bolt down. But wait... There's more!!!! You can't make the hold down bolt too tight or else it can damage the sensor. Remember where I said these things are "tuned" to listen for a certain frequency? Over-tightening the hold down bolt can deform the electric element of the sensor in such a way that it will not react to knocks the way in which it was designed. This will cause the sensor to react to different frequencies, telling the ECU that knocks may be occuring, when in fact they may not be. The ECU retards the ignition timing, so far in some cases that it causes the engine to misfire. The ECU could also go into limp mode which will severely limit power. Subaru specifies a torque of 17.3ft lbs. Which is practically nothing. "Snug" is a good way to put it, that's all you need to hold the sensor in place. Once the bolt seats to the sensor a turn of the wrist with the ratchet is plenty to hold the sensor. And you're done! Imagine that! If the code still persists there could be dirt or corrosion in the wire connector, or a break in the wiring between the sensor and the ECU. A factory service manual for your year vehicle will have specifics for troubleshooting. Replacing the sensor didn't fix your engine running issue? If the sensor was cracked it needed to be replaced anyway, so think of it as preventative maintenance. You'll have to track down the underlying problem.
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Every 4 cyl '97 and later, no matter the engine, is interference. 96-99 DOHC ej25 any car, has internal HG failure issue and are susceptible to rod bearing failure due to overheating. 2000 and later SOHC ej25 any car, may have external HG leaks that can be contained using Subaru coolant conditioner.
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All you have to do to get the car out of neutral is turn the key to ON, press brake pedal, shift. The engine does not have to be running. Or if the battery is dead, you can press the shift release button in the center console. The wheels will turn. One side will go the way it is being pulled, the other side (generally the side with the least traction) will turn the opposite direction because of the action of the differential. With an automatic the rear wheels will spin regardless if the transmission is in park. They are not mechanically linked to the output shaft of the transmission if the engine is not running. All in all though, I doubt it did any damage. I've seen many a vehicle dragged onto and off of tow trucks in park and none ever had any trouble afterwards. That's not to say it's good for the park mechanism, but one time is really probably not going to hurt it.
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RIP Legacy
Fairtax4me replied to ericem's topic in 1990 to Present Legacy, Impreza, Outback, Forester, Baja, WRX&WrxSTI, SVX
OUCH! That's painful just looking at it. You sure you're not having an out of body experience? Glad to hear you're OK. This will only feed my hate for those damn minivans though (minivans in general not just Oddessy's). I swear I see more of those things causing accidents than anything else around here. What the hell is this two wrecks in the same day crap? Bad luck comes in threes, so who else got in a wreck that we have't heard about yet? -
Since this has to do with engine temperature, it could be that your Engine Coolant Temp sensor is bad. Knock sensor installation is easy to mess up. Subaru knock sensors are a fickle beast. They have to be installed with a certain orientation and the bolt can not be tightened to more than the factory torque spec or damage can occur to the sensor housing. If moisture gets inside the housing it will cause the piezo-electric component inside to corrode, causing failure of the sensor. I searched and searched last night for a knock sensor replacement thread and came up empty handed. I have a P0325 code on in the wagon I just bought so I'm going to replace the sensor with a used one I got and I will make a picture write-up detailing some of the specifics of knock sensor replacement on the EJ series engines. I should have it posted sometime this evening.
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Go get a set of 96 - 99 Legacy Outback struts and the tires will clear the spring perches. I think Forester struts will work as well but I'm not 100% on that. Stock LegO tires are 205 70 15, and plenty of people run 215 70 or 205 75s with no rubbing. Some run larger with mods to the wheel well. try looking for info in the Offroad forum. I bought a lift kit from a member who was running larger tires than that on his OBS. I don't recall the actual size but I'm pretty sure I remember him saying they were 29" overall height. And that was just with LegO struts IIRC.
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This type of behavior matches what some have described from a bad knock sensor. These rely heavily on knock sensor input to adjust ignition timing, I suspect the internals of the EJ engine must be sensitive to detonation and therefore Subaru felt it necessary to control knock at all costs. The knock sensors on these are very sensitive, yet also very fragile and susceptible to damage and corrosion. It's hidden well, but is easy to replace once identified. Vacuum leaks can also cause strange issues like this. Follow the vacuum routing diagram on the bottom of the hood and replace any hoses that are hardened, dry-rotted, or cracked.
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Engine running stand on the brake pedal repeatedly for about 20 seconds at a time for a few minutes. If you have a leak, you will feel the pedal will sink, and after repeated application, any fluid leakage should be evident on the ground or someplace on the car. Of course, having a dry place to work helps.
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Fuz Normally I would want things to be 111% perfect. Hell, I spent a solid week looking for a hose for my other car, that I still have yet to replace now three months later. There were several things I purposefully overlooked during the process in order to keep cost to a minimum. Had this been an engine I knew more about I would have tried for perfect and would have spent a small fortune in the process. But that's for next week. I'm not sure on the oil pressure. No strange noises and the light goes out immediately when starting so I assume it is OK.
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Note to self: never move to California. If you only have $1200 tied up in it I'd say it's worth it. A 95 wagon in good running shape can sell for $1000-1500 here easy. With timing parts/tires/brakes/ other new parts I've seen them listed for up to $3000, whether they sold for that I don't know, but it's surprising how well these wagons hold value sometimes.