jj421

I agree with GeneralDisorder. A cone washer from the dealership doesn't cost that much; only $16 or so from the dealership nearest to me. I mean, that's a lot for such a small part, I'd say. But considering how if it fails like it did on my car, it could render your car immobile (especially if you don't have 4WD). So the price is definitely worth it. And I think that any work you do to the cone washer is only temporary, much like retorquing the axle nut every week. Now, in that sense, messing with my current cone washer is not an option, because I don't have a grinder, files, or anything, haha. What I think would've been a better option, and definitely an option for those people in the Midwest, is order the parts from http://www.subaruparts.com. Just enter the part number (dealership told me the cone washer was #623024020 and the spring washer was #623204080) and you can order them online. The parts are cheaper, but you gotta pay shipping, and it'll probably take two weeks to get 'em. Even if it's okay to drive with it in 4WD, I'm not gonna do it. I don't have to drive it anywhere. It's not like it's the only car in the family. If it was my sole mode of transportation, then sure. But I've got another car to drive to/from work. I really don't understand why dealerships don't have at least one cone washer in stock. I can understand if not many people come in asking for two, but at least keep one in stock! I don't know.... Hopefully the parts will come in on Monday, and hopefully I'll be able to get a hub or two (might as well replace both hubs) from the Pick-N-Pull tomorrow.

Okay, sweet. That's what I thought. I've read here on the forums somewhere that no matter how much grinding or repair to the cone washer, there is no way to repair it. In fact, here is the quote from GeneralDisorder: Oh, plus I don't have a grinder, so that would be useless. :-p

Yeah, I'm definitely not gonna drive with it in 4WD. In fact, the car hasn't even been started since Saturday. I should go out and start her up to see if the engine still works. :-p I miss the "purr" of that EA82, hahaha. Well, in theroy, I should replace my bearings. I have a brand new set of wheel bearings sitting in my garage. I was gonna do them when I replaced my passenger side axle a few months ago, but the axle was a huge hassle for me and I didn't feel like doing the bearings at that time. Plus, I don't really have the right tools or knowledge to do my bearings. I'll do them if I ever get someone to help me, but yeah, haha. Okay, looks like I don't need to worry about the axle, which is good. I don't have the time, money, or energy to replace that (although it'd be A LOT easier replacing an axle for a second time, since I'd know what in the world I'd be doing). I just gotta hope the Pick-N-Pull has a good hub. Looks like the nearest one to me has one Loyale and one GL-10, and that's it. Passenger and driver side hubs are the same, correct? I don't see why they'd be different. Just asking in case both those cars only have passenger side hubs left on 'em.

I definitely don't want to buy a hub from the dealer then.... As far as cone washers go, I'm just gonna get them from the dealer. Brand new. Ya know, if Subaru screws up again and I don't get them on Monday, I will demand to get them for free, since I will have then been waiting over a week for what was originally told to me to take two days. I'd go looking for cone washers at the Pick-N-Pull, but last time I was there, everybody already took all of 'em. And the cars that had cone washers still on them, I couldn't get the axle nut off because the wheel would turn when I try to loosen it (even with the parking brake engaged). Plus, I don't wanna accidentally grab a bad cone washer, even though it looked okay. The cone and spring washers gonna get new; the hub I will get used. I don't wanna pay an outrageous price from the dealership for a hub if there are perfectly good ones sitting in the junkyard for a fraction of the price.

My car is part time 4WD, so yeah, I could put it in 4WD and move it. I'll probably do that when I go to fix it. I guess I will head to the Pick-N-Pull and grab a good looking hub. Last time I check O'Reilly's website, you couldn't order a hub, so I'm thinking, is that a dealer only part too? If so, I definitely would only buy it new if there's a reason you shouldn't get a used hub. I was hoping I wouldn't need a new hub, but I guess it's not too bad. I gotta get some other things from the Pick-N-Pull anyways. This just makes it worth the drive out there. Hopefully I won't need an axle too (or at least the outer part, but isn't just easier to replace the whole thing?).

Thanks for your input. I think what I might do is if I get bored this weekend, go to the Pick-N-Pull and grab me a hub and axle or something. It's kinda hard for me to inspect it because the tow truck driver dropped my car on a somewhat steep hill, with soft gravel and not much room to maneuver. So jacking up the car probably wouldn't be the safest thing in the world. I was planning on putting the new cone washer on and just see if it works. If it doesn't then I guess I'm gonna get some things from the junkyard.

Alright guys, since I have some time before the dealership can actually get cone washers in stock, I figured I'd hit the forums and see your guys' opinions. I've known for months that my cone washers on the front wheels of my Loyale were shot. I just never actually planned to do anything about it because the nearest Subaru dealership is a half hour drive away, and I'm lazy. :-p Anyways, last Saturday, I heard some popping noises when I let out the clutch. I pulled into a parking lot figuring my axle was coming off the transmission or something, but found nothing. As I was pulling out of the parking lot, I would let out the clutch, hear a grinding noise, and the car would barely move, it at all. After trying reverse and first gear a few times, I gave up and figured my clutch was toast. Pushed the car into a parking stall and got a ride to work. As I went to bed that night, I doubted that it was the clutch. I could put it into gear perfectly fine, and have had no sign of a slipping clutch or anything. This just randomly happened. Plus, I've never experienced a clutch failure, but I doubt it'd make that ungodly grinding. The only argument towards my clutch going out is the fact that I can no longer adjust my clutch because it's adjusted all the way (if that makes sense). So if I burn my clutch any more, I'll need a new one. So yeah, I was thinking that night that I should see about my cone washer. If there is anything I learned from my last issue, it is to stick with the simple things first. I drove out to my car in the morning to see. Took off the hubcap and the axle nut (which didn't surprise me that it was loose). What did surprise me, though, is how loose the cone washer was. It just kinda, fell out. A quick inspection revealed the gap in the cone washer was wide enough you could fit a dime in it, maybe even a penny. So, obviously, the axle and wheel are not making a connection. Got it towed home, and of course, it was Sunday, so the Subaru parts department is not open on Sundays. The next day, now Monday, I called around to local dealerships. There was one dealership that had ONE cone washer in stock, but that was down in Auburn, which is a 1.5 hour drive. I am, however, looking for two cone and two spring washers for both front wheels, so I'd still have to place an order. The only dealership with two cone washers in stock was up in Bellingham, a 2-3 hour drive. I figured it's certainly not worth the gas money (especially with a 14 MPG Ford Mustang GT) to drive out there to get the parts. It'd be more worth the wait. I went ahead and placed an order at the dealership nearest to my house and they told me it would get there on Wednesday, and that they'd call me. Wednesday, I get no call. Thursday (today), I go to the dealership and ask what's up. They said they placed the order, but Subaru never actually shipped it out. I had them call around and still no other dealerships had the parts in stock. They were unable to do expedited (overnight) shipping, so I now have to wait until next Monday for the parts. This is why I hate, and try to avoid dealerships! Good new is, however, the guy at the dealership gave me 25% off. So now the parts will cost ~$35 before tax, versus the original ~$47 before tax (high prices is another reason I hate and avoid dealerships). So yeah, sorry for the long "story," and here is the main point (I'd say) of this post. Is there a chance I have stripped the hub/axle? When I was trying to move the car, the axle was just spinning. It doesn't look like I've done any damage, but can you guys tell? Oh, and here is a photo of my previous cone and spring washer. You can see the gap in the cone washer and the spring washer looks like it's been flattened out. Yeah, again, sorry for the long post. Just to finish this post off, I will post some pictures of what I saw at the dealership today. This is a perfect condition, inside and out, second generation Brat.

Hahaha, well, you did tell me so. I just didn't believe it. I never take things personally; don't worry about it.

No, the corrosion on my battery is not new. It hasn't become any more corroded since I bought the car. The stuff that's on there is old stuff that's been on there for a while. But I understand what you're saying. Considering I open the hood probably a minimum of twice a week, it won't be hard to keep an eye on it, haha. That's why I wasn't thinking this problem was caused by my battery or wire, because the terminal hasn't become any more corroded over time.

My battery is not leaking. It's only about six months old or so, and the terminals were like that when I bought the car. The previous owner had left the car sitting unattended for a few months before selling, and that caused the previous battery to go bad. I will try cleaning it though. I'm glad the solution was so simple. Thanks again for everything you guys.

Well guys, thanks for all your help! I managed to get my car to start. As was stated earlier, it was indeed a problem with the connection. All I had to do was hit the positive terminal on the battery a few times, knock some battery acid off of it, and it started like normal. Ya know, the old fashioned way? Hit it until it works! There surely is no greater sound then that of your engine firing up when it's been a sitting duck for a few days. And I guess I made this way more complicated than it needed to be. Can't overlook the simple things. In the words of someone on a Pontiac GTO forum, when you hear hooves, think horses, not zebras. So I guess I'm gonna carry a hammer in my car until I can get a new positive terminal, in case I need to hit it again. Thanks again for all your help though! As always, I learned new things with this issue. Kinda surprising how my car does this over a little amount of battery acid, while my mom's car has so much battery acid, it looks like Mt. Rainier, hahaha. And her car has no problems. I don't know, but I'm glad I know what the issue was, and I'm even more glad my engine is not toast. It's got 258,000 miles, and I plan to pass 300K! This was a minor hiccup, but it's still running and it should still be able to go the remaining 42,000.

Ohhhh, okay. So the two wires are connected to each other, making one long wire. One end goes from the battery, and one end goes to the starter. The connection between the two wires serves as a "switch." So, when the wires are touching, closing the switch, the starter should engage like if you turn the key to the start position, right? Then would I need someone pushing the clutch in, so the car doesn't lurch forward like it would normally starting the car? Okay, and the signal wire is the one with a connector thing, right? Or is it the one with the ring terminal that is tightened down via a bolt? And do I need remove the existing wire when I do this, or keep it there? I'm probably making this a lot more complicated than it is, haha. I don't want to go out there right now since it's dark, but I won't have any daylight tomorrow to work on it. I don't know.... Yeah, I fear I won't get to do much on the car until Tuesday. But after watching EricTheCarGuy's video ( ), I'm gonna take out the spark plugs and try moving the crankshaft again, next time I get the opportunity. Hopefully I can find a 17mm socket to try with. And that's another thing; as djellum said, I shouldn't try starting it until I can get the engine moving by hand. I doubt it will, but I don't wanna do any more damage if the engine is toast.

It kinda makes sense. I think I understand the first part, but I don't get the "then arch them with the other side by hooking them together, creating a U" part. I'm on YouTube now, trying to find some videos. Isn't there the option of running a jumper cable from the positive terminal on the battery to where the positive battery wire connects to the starter, to bypass that wire?

I've always wanted to see someone hotwire a manual transmission car. It'd be funny if they forgot to push the clutch in and it was left in gear. I'll take a look on YouTube for it. When I did a quick Google search for it, I just came up with how to jump start a car, not the starter. And of course; I never have my car in gear unless I'm on a really steep hill or if I'm driving. So, I shouldn't try and jump the starter until I can turn the motor by hand? In that case, I'd be more than happy to hold off, haha. I can turn the power steering pulley, barely, but it's basically doing a "burnout." I am turning the pulley, but it's not turning the belt (therefore turning the other pulleys). It's just spinning there. I also couldn't help but notice a big chip in my crankshaft pulley last time I was looking at it.

No, I haven't tried jumping the starter. Not quite sure about where to hook up the jumper cables on the starter. Plus, I'm kinda scared of electricity, and I hear there might be sparks. :-p And, when you jump the starter, would I need someone in the car holding the clutch down? In other words, when you hook everything up, will the starter engage by itself? Or do you need to go back in the car and turn the key like normal? Checking the voltage on the ignition relay... well, apparently there isn't an ignition relay in my car. Do you mean the ignition switch? If so, what connection on the back of the switch would I put the multimeter probes? And would I turn the key to the start position, or what? I know nothing about electronics, haha.

Glad I can finally move forward with this, at least a little if anything. :-p Check the fuses? Yeah, first thing I did (after checking the fusible links), haha. The three wires attached to the starter look fine; not severely corroded or anything, just a little dirty. Kinda hard to get to and look at with those two coolant hoses in the way. Also, not exactly sure which ones are the ground wires. It looks like the negative wire for the battery goes to the starter, as well as the positive wire. I am not seeing a ground underneath the dash. I know there is what looks like a main ground from the battery (I believe) to the body right above the driver's side headlight, but I know that is working as I've almost burned myself accidentally touching it a few times. :-p Haha, yes, I tried that a few hours ago. Hit the positive terminal on the battery a few times; no luck. Hit the starter a few times; no luck. Took off the casing on the steering column and hit the ignition switch a few times; no luck.

Alright, so here are the multimeter tests: At rest: ~12.55 volts When trying to start: ~11.75 volts after a few seconds of "cranking" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypUyk9GHOYc Sound is pretty crappy, but you can hear the one click from the starter. The repetitive clicks that follow are only heard from the inside, around the ignition switch. So, I don't know 100% what these numbers mean. But I believe 12.55 volts means my battery is still good, but I think 11.75 volts is not enough. The voltmeter on the instrument cluster dips to ~9 volts when I "crank" it. But likewise, it reads ~11.85 volts when the key is in the "on" position. I don't think there is enough voltage going to the starter, which would mean I should replace the wires going to the starter? But again, I don't know how much voltage is needed or anything. I also picked up a test light while I was at O'Reilly, so if needed, I can use that to test anything. Picked up a Chilton manual as well, but I don't think anything of use towards this problem could be found in there. :-p

Yes, the car is out of gear when I try and turn the motor. It's still not budging. I do hear the starter click, and then the repetitive clicking is something else. After many trial and error tests throughout the day, I really don't think it's the starter. It's something else. Like I said, the repetitive clicking is not coming from the starter, but it seems like the ignition switch. It sounds (and almost feels) like it's coming from the steering column/dashboard. So I'm thinking the ignition switch is toast, or something. I wish I could take the starter out, but I can't. There are two hoses in the way, and they're filled with coolant (I believe), so I can't disconnect them. Not to mention the clutch is there, making things more difficult. So yeah, I can't get the starter out to take it down and have it tested. I will run down and get one here in a couple hours, and I'll give it a test.

I managed to find the starter last night, but thanks anyways. And as it turns out, it is not the factory starter. It has a sticker on it saying it is a remanufactured starter from NAPA. So it'd be trading in a Mexican reman POS for a Mexican reman POS. :-p Well, I just went out there to test it, and I can't move the crankshaft pulley no matter what I do. I mean, I don't have a wrench/socket big enough to turn the nut on the crankshaft pulley, but I can't turn it by pulling on the belt, nor can I turn it from using a wrench to turn the other pulleys. The other day when I was replacing my belt, I was able to turn the belt and all the other pulleys by simply using a wrench on the water pump pulley. So, could my engine be seized? And the starter is just not able to turn the engine over, so it just clicks? The belt/pulleys seem much stiffer than before. And I guess the day before, I kinda had an "incident". I came home, and we had guests over. All the parking places in my driveway were full, so I was trying to move my car around on the front yard/our secondary, gravel driveway. Of course, it was on a hill, and the gravel/grass is soft, so I ended up doing a burnout or two, trying to move forward. Had to put it in 4WD to get out. When I turned the car off and got out, I did notice a funny smell, but thought that was nothing more than the tires spinning against gravel/grass. The car has 258K miles on it, and I don't believe it's ever been driven very hard, so could this cause the engine being seized? Or could I just be worrying a bit too much, and it's something else causing the jam? Oh, and if it's important to mention, the belt liked to squeal occasionally; maybe once or twice a day. My battery is not dead. I have plenty of battery power and I have had no symptoms of a dying battery/alternator. It'd more likely be a bad cable or connection, because there is a little rust on the positive battery terminal, and it looked like the connection from the battery on the starter was kinda rusted. But, of course, the engine being seized is a bit a of a bigger issue now, haha. Yeah, I figured that out last night after some research too, haha.

Thanks for the reply! It looks like an ignition relay is only $12.99 at O'Reilly, but it'll take a day or so to get it in store. I might just go ahead and replace that, since it is pretty cheap. I don't actually have a multimeter, so I can't check the voltages. I should buy one. Plus I don't know where the relay is (ignorance strikes again!). Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I think what I will do is take the starter out (once I find it) and in the morning, go down to O'Reilly and have them test it. If the starter is bad, I can get a remanufactured one (which they apparently have in-stock) and get the core value on my old one. Then, of course have them test the remanufactured one, because I know starters can be bad from when you buy them. If my current starter is not bad, I will buy an ignition relay and if I order it early enough in the morning, they should have it in stock in the evening. And while I'm there, I should buy a multimeter and a test light (need one for a separate poject). Thanks again for the replies!

I have solved this issue. Resolution is in post #23. So tonight, as I was leaving for work, I went to start my car only for it to do nothing. There's not much I can say explaining the issue. Battery is good, and I have battery power. Fusible links are good (even though I need a new wire). All fuses are fine. My car started normally yesterday, and the day before, and the day before, etc. So basically what happens is when I turn the key to the start position, it just clicks over and over again. Click, click, click, click. The voltmeter registers about 3-4 volts are being used to power the starter, so that leads me to believe it isn't the ignition switch. So yeah, I don't know. I took a video of the issue, so click on this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEU-m7Pou-A It's nighttime, so yeah, haha. Is this a bad starter? I'm not sure where the starter is, so I can't whack it and see if that works. Plus, it's dark outside, so kinda hard to look in the engine aimlessly. :-p Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks! Oh, and it's a '90 Loyale, EA82, SPFI, 5-speed, if that makes a difference.

Thanks for all the replies! I think I will start looking into the PCV valve and line(s), since that seems like the easiest, cheapest option. If that is all that it is, that would be fantastic. However, I do not know where the PCV valve is.... I've never replaced a PCV valve before, so excuse my ignorance, haha. But yeah, I don't know where it is, so if anyone could shed some light on that, that'd be great. I've never had this problem before though. It just happened randomly one day. So if it is cylinder head cracks, could they be developing and in a couple months or so, my engine will be toast? I have no tools to check the compression levels. But if the PCV valve doesn't fix it, I might consider buying tools to test it. As far as the coolant goes, no, it hasn't required any addition. I've only had to put coolant in once in the past like six months that I've owned the car. Also, I will note that there isn't oil in my coolant nor any coolant in my oil, as I know those are symptoms that come with bad head gaskets and cracked/warped heads/cylinders. If it is indeed "normal," then I guess I am at the right place and right time for this to be happening. Like I said, I will see about the PCV valve, but I guess I shouldn't worry too much, which I haven't been anyways.

Okay, my '90 Loyale is being weird, haha. So three or four days ago, I was heading to work from school, and as I was getting on the freeway, I noticed white smoke behind my car. Pulled over, and my belt was torn and about to break. Got it towed home and put a new belt on the car, and once again it was driving like normal. The next day, same thing happened at the same place. I didn't pull over though, and the smoke disappeared in ~10 seconds. The next day, the same thing at the same location, again! And like the day before, the smoke disappeared in ~10 seconds. This is weird. It only happens at the same location, and nowhere else. In the morning there is no smoke; at night there is no smoke; at a different on-ramp there is no smoke. It just seems like this one particular on-ramp that it likes to spew smoke out the back for ~10 seconds. This on-ramp is different than others I normally drive on because it's one of those cloverleaf interchanges, so I take a 270° right turn at 35 MPH before the flat straightaway leading onto the freeway, which might be causing the smoke somehow. Oh, and this isn't just condensation in the tailpipe kind of smoke. This is like actual engine smoke. I just don't understand what's different about this. I'm accelerating normally, not like the pedal down to the floor, in fourth gear @ ~2500 RPM or so, and smoke starts coming out the back. It doesn't make sense because I could be accelerating elsewhere in fourth gear @ 2500 RPM, and there wouldn't be any smoke. Heck, I could be going up a hill in third @ 3300 RPM and it's perfectly fine. I've checked my fluids, and my coolant and oil look fine (even though oil burns blue, I believe). The car runs perfectly fine, so I have no idea what it could be. Searching this problem here on the forum leads to what seem like almost identical problems, except for they have a EA82T, whereas I do not have a turbo in my car. The problem I find in those threads is a leaking turbo or something, but since I don't have a turbo, that can't be it. So yeah, I am stumped. If my car smoked whenever I accelerated, anywhere at anytime, I'd have a better general idea. But since it's just this one location at this one time right after school, I don't even have a clue. I have driven down that same on-ramp at night, and it didn't smoke. One thing I think could be contributing to this might be the fact that the car is still warming up, since it's only about 10 minutes from when I start the car until I get to the on-ramp. Then that 270° turn might also contribute, because it never smokes like that during warm-up, even if it's much colder, like in the mornings. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. It's not really something I'm too concerned about, because like I said, it's not a consistent thing, but I would like to know what it is and how/if I can fix it. Alright then, thanks for any suggestions!

Hi there. On my '90 Loyale, the wires you plug together to read the CEL code are not under the dash. Other years and models, yes. But for our cars, no. The wires you are looking for are actually under the hood, next to the driver's side of the firewall, and I believe they are black & white (or green & white (or black, I don't remember, haha)). The test connectors should be in the shape of a T, and only a two-prong connection, if I remember correctly. I can take a picture of them tomorrow, if you can't find them. Oh, and don't forget, the check engine light itself doesn't flash the code. You have to take off the panel under the dash and look at the little LED on the ECU itself.

Thanks for your help! I got the belt replaced today, and it took more time to drive to O'Reilly than it did to take off the old belt and put on the new one. It was as simple as I thought it was gonna be, so thanks again for your help!