Myxalplyx

This file is the 1st-3rd run of all the ECUs. Remember: Part# AC831 is my stock ECU, Part# AD400 is a 1999 2.5ltr Legacy GT ECU and Part# AD400 is the 'other' 1997 2.2ltr Impreza ECU for other models made in 1997. 1st-3rd gear run Just for further analysis, I'll post up each gear of all these runs, hp/torque and air/fuel ratio and leave it at that. I know there are a ton of things (like the size of the pics) that could be done better dyno wise but this is my 2nd time on the dyno. I'm not rich so I plan to spend as little time there as possible with each dyno session BUT I feel like I'm on Dyno-Crack now. I have to be there as much as possible. I've already made more appointments to test out little stuff. Before posting the dyno charts of each gear, notice the hp/torque spikes in each gear. This is the valve body shifting pretty hard (just the way I like it). I tried to describe the feeling to folks as 'it-throws-the-car-forward while shifting. At least the full dyno run in to 3rd gear shows why. Torque shoots up in between gears. Pretty cool eh? 1st Gear of Full Run 2nd Gear of Full Run 3rd Gear of Full Run Looks like the Legacy ECU makes the most power, then the 'other' 1997 2.2ltr ECU, then my stock Ecu. The air/fuel ratio looks interesting. The Legacy is LEAN. Can't see how I got away using that ECU doing what I did. I'll stop here. Comments!?!

Car: 1997 2.2ltr Subaru Impreza Outback Sport Wagon (AWD/Autotranny) Dyno: Dynojet *AWD Dyno* Place: Xotic Motorsports Current Mods: Underdrive Pulley and 2.25" axle back exhaust (Remus-dual) That's it! Tests: Tested 3 different ECUs for my car. Did 6 dyno pulls total. The first 3 were 3rd gear pulls up to around 6000rpm. ECUs where changed and reset (Pocketlogger) after each run. The 2nd 3 dyno pulls where from 1st gear all the way up to the top of 3rd gear at 6000rpm. This way you could see the hp/torque and even shift characteristics of each ECU to compare. ECUs Tested: Part#AC831 This the ECU that comes stock in my car according to the vin number (lost my original ECU, don't ask). Part# AD61A This is a 1999 2.5ltr Legacy GT ECU. I used this while I was running turbo/nitrous for years. Just took it off the car last month. Part# AD400 This is a 1997 2.2ltr Impreza ECU. It's not for my car but other models of Impreza in 1997. The first 3 runs where done in 3rd gear starting between 65mph-60mph. It's really difficult to get a decent run in this gear without having the tranny downshift into 2nd gear. Sudden mashing of the throttle even this high can make the tranny downshift even if it has only 200rpm left to go before shifting into 3rd. The pics are way to big to post and show here. 3rd Gear Run Sorry for the huge file sizes as I'm still getting used to changing the dyno files over into pdf and then to jpg format. Note my stock ECU makes less horsepower than the Legacy and the other 2.2ltr ECU. My stock ECU also seems to run richer than the rest. I tested my stock ECU first, the 'other' 2.2ltr Impreza 2nd and the Legacy ECU 3rd. I didn't let the car cool down for no more than 5 minutes in between each run. If someone can make these files smaller for me, please let me know. I'll delete what I have up and submit a smaller size. I'm not good at these things. Next up: 1st to 3rd gear run of each ECU.----------------->

I just got off the phone with Scott at Delta Cams and well.......they don't have a grind for the 2.7ltr XT6. So, I'm going to send mine in either today or tomorrow and Scott is going to look over them and compare/see if anything is close to it as far as regrinds go. Scott stated they did the same thing with the EA82 cams and it just seems to work very well for the Subbies that use them. So......here goes nothing. Oh...and the grind I am asking for is to improve my top end and/or the high rpm range (5400-6200rpm). According to my dyno runs, this is where the XT6 seems to fall flat on it's face.....badly. I don't need any more low end torque since I have FWD and all I'll have is BBQ tires everytime I'd moderately take off. Thanks guys! Keep the posts coming!

Here is an email I sent to Level 10 Transmission and their response to it. It's a simple response but one nevertheless. Just wanted to show this to the turbocharged (or nitrous..hehe) Justy guys that are having trouble with their ECVTs tranny design. I wish they would've gone into more detail since their response was really broad. "Dear Kevin, How are you? hope all is well. We can upgrade those transmissions also. We can build the whole transmission or the valve body and torque converters. Thank You for contacting Level 10 Products Sincerely, Sam Ismail Level 10 Products 3670 Rt 94 Hamburg N.J. 07419 (973) 827-1000 -----Original Message----- From: Kevin Thomas [mailto:thomasck@comcast.net] Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 10:49 AM To: info@levelten.com Subject: ECVT Transmission work Hello Pat and Sam, A couple of guys have gotten together and are building 2 turbocharged Subaru Justys (please don't laugh..hehe). I'm interested in doing the same but with an automatic transmission. Pat, you've done some work on a Subaru Impreza Outback Wagon of mine (white/black stripes...turbo/nitrous....back in January 2001) and it is still going strong. I'm looking to have a Justy's automatic transmission made stronger but it's not the same. It's an ECVT transmission. I know you guys are pros and all but do you (or have you) done any work on an ECVT (you know but I have to add it: Electronically Controlled Variable Transmission) and if so, what can be done to 'beefen' it up. Stock Justys are about 75hp/73lbs-ft. With the turbo, estimating around 145hp/lbs-ft - 155hp/lbs-ft or so. Not a lot but enough to tear up the trannies as 1 of the guys found out previously. If you do work on these, please let me know. Thanks Kevin Thomas"

I've searched, read, re-read, fell asleep and got lost again. I'm looking for information from those people that have had their cams regrinded by Delta Cams. I am seriously considering going with them since their price is so low. It would help wake up my XT6 since it absolutely falls on its face after 5600rpm based on some recent dyno runs. I'm looking for: 1: How much you paid to get your cams done, 2: What car you got it done on, 3: Cam specs, 4: Time it took to receive your regrinded cams, 5: What power improvements (hp and/or torque) gains or loses have you observed, tested, and/or noticed. Some or all of the above would be great. If you had these done on an XT6, I'm very interested on your results. If you guys/gals that have done this also recommend springs and such also, please let me/us know. I just figured one thread instead of a bunch spread out with cam info would be a good 'research' tool. BTW: I have no idea what I am to tell the Delta Cam folks about the cam profile that I want. I know how much higher I'd like my powerband to be moved but I don't want it to affect emissions or idle to severely. I want it to be aggressive as possible within reason. I've never purchased cams before and I don't want to sound like an idiot when I call these folks. All input is mucho appreciated. Thanks!

EXACTLY! Off goes the ProECM Powerchip tomorrow afternoon and time for some more tests. Note: Not to sidetrack this thread but I did a little research on my 'history'. The PRoECM Powerchip is supposed to help you gain hp/torque by advancing the timing throughout the powerband. I noticed on my older dyno runs where I was having MAJOR problems with the Apexi SAFC making the car run lean. I only had one run with the squiggly lines up high in the rpm range and that was on the first run. For the most part, runs 2-3 where smoother or smoother up high. ttp://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno1.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno2.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno3.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno4.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno5.JPG If you notice, all the runs where done on March 15, 2002. I was wondering if I had the ProECM Powerchip during that time and had to search a bit to see I had posted anything about it at the Yahoo XT6 group board. Then I found this post: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/xt6/message/6691 I stated I had the ProECM installed 'yesterday' which would've been on March 19, 2002. What does all this mean? Well, the 'chip' is designed to advance the timing provided you run higher octane. I've been running 93 octane even before the chip (bad nitrous runs.... ). If my top end smooths out when the chip is removed, perhaps these cars (Older Scoobies..some of them anyways) don't like timing to be advanced high up in the rpm range, especially with mods. That's a bold generalization so I'm not going to go there, especially with all these high tech scoobie gods here. :-p If it is a timing issue that gets resolved by the removal of the chip, then perhaps you are suffering the same problem. Turbos usually hate advanced timing up high anyways. Suffer some low end powerloss with timing reduced slightly further and see if it helps your situation. Then you would know for a fact but I think u already know this and you stated u didn't want to go that route anyways. Oh well! I'm just excited and perhaps I can gain a hp or two removing my squiggly lines.

Actually I like the junkyard-style approach. Keep it up! Everyone doesn't have $$$$, including me. So anything you find out that is cheap and affective would be cool. *Now to look at exactly what turbo you are using [stock I'm assuming again]* If so, a cheap Legacy unit would sure be nice. --Don't worry about telling me/us yet again. I'm searching now.-- *Edit* Nevermind! http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/usmb/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10371

This is an interesting point! Lets say someone was to put their car on the dyno but they can not audibly tell the car is knocking (They are deaf for instance. ). If the timing is too aggressive or advanced in the higher rpm range (where it starts to affect power), how will this manifest itself on the dyno plot/chart? If you say what I think (hope) you say, you would give me an idea. :cool: Thanks!

Welp, I'm divided! My Impreza OBS has spanked many faster cars and have made me laugh soooo hard, tears came out of my eyes many nights. I've met many cool people and it's probably the only car that has/will gotten/get me on T.V. It has travelled 120 miles with a blown headgasket and another 120miles with no oil and never left me stranded. Even when I tore my transmission up racing, it still didn't leave me stranded over an hour away. *sniffle* My XT6 on the other hand has left me stranded 3 times. I think I've probably spent more money on the XT6 in repairs even while the car was stock. It leaks oil on and off like a monthly period. (Eww...bad comparison). Leaked power steering fluid, the pump failed, fuel pump failed, spark plugs, wires, water temp sensor, tranny failed, creeks, squeaks, leaks water on both sides of door, refused to get faster with mods, the steering is comparible to the feeling of first time sky diving over and over again when going around turns, *rubbing hands from this long sentence*...................... And you know what? I drive this car with da attitude more than my other cars. ?????????? It's driving great but this'll last for about 2 weeks. I suspect my motor will go out anytime now. Oh yeah, it's one ugly arse car with no aftermarket. I LOVE it!

I contacted Dave at ProECM a while back through the XT6 board. He was selling lightweight pulleys and the chip to the XT6 peeps but no-one was biting. So I went for it. No check engine lights, but I haven't noticed any 1/4 mile gains nor loses in speed or E.T. Everything just stayed the same. ??? I am using 93 octane though. You are supposed to use this so the chip can 'take advantage' of the higher octane. U can run lower octane if you choose however. Still, I haven't noticed or seen any difference in performance or drivabililty. The wagon is back stock except for an underdrive pulley and a cat back exhaust. Which is good actually since I can dyno it now and compare the difference. The shop has an AWD dyno and with the wideband O2, it only costs $50.00 I'll be spending a LOT of time at this shop before they catch on and up their prices. I may take the wagon up next week probably Tuesday or Wednesday. I'm expecting (hoping) for hp in the low 90's. :cool: I noticed that the infamous 'Subaru Dyno Dip' is gone in my new dyno runs vs my old ones between 4000 and 5100rpm. Wonder how the intake affected this. I though it was just by design of the subaru motor since most subarus I've seen has this 'dip' in the powerband at about those points.

I automatically assumed you did. Sorry! Then I'll point a BIG finger at the fact that you don't have an intercooler and you are getting too much hot air in your engine at high rpms. :cool:

There is always a 'depends' on any aspect of tuning. I wasn't saying to use the EGT to determine what is causing high EGTs. Just noticing you have high EGTs can save your engine by you shutting down or letting off the gas pedal and preventing expensive engine damage. And I'll say, ANYTHING above 1600F is too high. I try to shoot for EGTs where the stock EGT is. But.....there's not point in this now because WJM does not have an EGT gauge. On the wideband O2, you can actually run rich where your Subaru is supposedly theoretically safe and still end up with high EGTS or cylinder temps. Going too rich will do this and you want to prevent that also so simply dialing in for a specified air/fuel ratio isn't going to cut it. Every car is different. Now, since not gauges (O2 sensor, EGTS) are being used, timing is being controlled, colder spark plugs, colder thermostat (I kept saying water temp sensor...sorry ), nice rich mixture, what can be causing detonation? 1: Intercooler isn't being efficient enough or it's heat soaking, 2: turbo is blowing too hot air, Wait, I have a cheap suggestion. Instead of the 180F thermostat, how about trying out a 160F thermostat instead. Since our older engines are notorious for running hot anyway, and you have taken things one step further by turboing a higher compressioned 'hot' engine that would use 180F thermostats to help it stock...it's worth a try. The engine should/will run cooler. Perhaps add a touch of water wetter. It's cheap so I figure it'll be something u could do to hold you over. I'm no tuning expert though. Perhaps Scoobie Steve and offer more input.

Yes! BTW: All my dyno runs got choppy above 5300rpm despite me adding fuel (My EGT gauges thermocouple is O/S so I couldn't use that as a gauge for anything). Besides a lean condition, what else would cause choppiness in power delivery? On a side note, after every run, my oil dipstick looked like it wanted to escape out the engine bay (partually out). The PCV valve was changed earlier THIS week with an OEM unit (thanks to u guys) and all of my vacuum hoses (2 crankcase hoses that connect to intake and the xmas tree thingy) was cleaned out at the same time. Maybe my valves or piston rings are worn. I dunno...u are the gurus.

I did a few dyno runs earlier today on a DynoJet dynanometer. The name of the shop is called Xotic Motorsports in Cochranville, PA. Car dyno'd was a 1989 2.7ltr XT6 FWD. The graphs are in pdf format so you'll need Adobe Acrobat to view it. Haven't had a chance to convert them over to jpeg. Mods done to car are: JC Sports intake 2.5" exhaust and 2.5" Cat Converter Dynomax Ultra Flow SS muffler 2.5" Unorthodox Racing Pulley *custom* ProECM PowerChip 4 (8 gauge) ground wires MSD inline fuel pump AEM fuel pressure regulator (raised to richen air/fuel ratios during runs) This is by no means a 'bragging rights' dyno run(s). It's just a point of reference. Runs are SAE corrected. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/XT6Dyno4.pdf http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/XT6Dyno5.pdf http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/XT6Dyno6.pdf http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/XT6Dyno8.pdf BTW: Here are some older runs I did on a mobile Dynojet at Cecil County Dragway. Differences with these runs are: 1: No aftermarket fuel pressure regulator, 2: Apexi SAFC which ran car lean, improper setup, 3: Still had one of the 2 stock cat converters http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno1.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno2.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno3.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno4.JPG http://mywebpages.comcast.net/thomasck/Dyno5.JPG Just some points of reference. Slam away!

Hey Troy, I remember reading a long article that I found on the net and posted here about the ECVT (maybe it was another board..I dunno since I'm on quite a few). It spoke of different ECVT transmissions and how 1 or 2 of them from different manufacturers were able to be 'upgraded' by using a different type of belt. I don't think your rambling is 'insane' at all. :-p Heck, it would even be stronger if the belts could be replaced with a chain like some of the late model Subarus (and other cars) whose timing belts have been replacled with timing chains. Of course weak links may rear it's ugly head somewhere else in the tranny but you get the idea.

If you do anything else, please get an EGT gauge. And air/fuel ratio would help also but you need to know just how hot your exhaust gas temperature is getting. You said you are already running colder plugs, how about colder water temp sensor? I dunno, colder plugs, lower water temp sensor and higher octanes are givens and I'm sure you already did those. Do you have anything to retard timing? I haven't went through your old posts to know. I'm starting to think it's timing related since you've hit on other parts. I know my Impreza's timing was VERY aggressive but I didn't notice any detonation. Even still, it loved to push the timing to the limits at the higher rpm ranges.

Oh, I don't mean to get off subject with this post (yes I do) but do you guys think a set of 15" Konig Heliums would be nice on a Justy? What's the Justy...13x5.5, 4x100 mm, +38 mm or thereabouts? The Konig Heliums in 15" x 6.5" has a 4X100mm bolt pattern and a +40 offset. Plus And they weigh in at 10.8lbs a piece. How much does the stock 13" (or is it 12") Justy wheels weigh? Just a thought!

Hello Troy, Can this problem be remedied by adding a tranny cooler (or two) and keeping the tranny fluid changed (synthetic or regular)? Thanks! I sent and email or two off about the ECVT trannys and how to deal with them. It'll be interesting what response I get (if any). I know the easiest route may simply be to just go with the manual trannied version but I can't escape my auto addiction. I got issues but who doesn't? :cool:

While you are at it, may as well change your spark plug wires as well. I see you mentioned your caps and plugs were changed but I don't think I have seen your spark plug wires where changed as well. Also, check your PM (Private message) as well. Sending you info/link.

Yeah and also the bastids (the company/outfit) that made the supercharger for the STX and knew exactly how to install it and all wouldn't provide the information. They were under some type of contract with Subaru and couldn't release the information. Man, that sucks! I thought it would've been ok to release the info if Subaru weren't going to make it/go ahead with it. That pissed me off when I called them along with others.

Hey guys, I was just skimming around the net looking for aftermarket parts for the Subaru Justy (yeah right, ). I came across an exhaust system for it. Has anyone purchased this? Subaru Justy Exhaust Perhaps it'll open up the exhaust a bit for a turbocharged Justy eh?!? Then again, perhaps this is the stock part. I dunno!

This supercharged XT6 is currently being engine dynod. Once the 2 new injectors arrive (Thursday hopefully), it'll be interesting to see how much hp/torque (and the hp/torque band) this car makes. Nope, it's not my ride either and I'm not working on it. Just a reader of such things. L8Rs

Thanks guys! I can't let these turbo Justy project go. :D

Any more news on the turbo Justy(s) development(s)?

Are there any of you guys here in the Northeast (Delaware, Maryland, New Jersey, Pennsylvania) are that rebuilds old school Subaru engines? I'm talking ridding the engine of oil leaks and power loss through pistons rings and such with new, machined or remanufactured parts? Thanks!