Romy

I never followed up with this thread. It turned out the TO bearing didn't fit as snugly as I thought it had. The sleeve was indeed missing causing the pressure plate to not release evenly. I ended up just getting a new TO bearing that was not meant for a sleeve and it was all ok after. Your problem reminds me of another problem I had with a VW bus. I was on a long trip in the bus and an odd semi rubbing/grinding noise began to develop. The trans also started getting louder just while in gear. I probably drove about 3000 miles on it before I was in a location to pull the engine out. When I did pull it, I found that the pilot bearing had disintegrated. Easy enough to replace. However, the damage had been done at that point and had I been more astute at the time I would have realized the trans input shaft leak was probably an indication of what was to come. Initially, shifting into only 1st and 2nd, it seemed good to go. But as soon as I got on the highway I found 3rd and 4th were near impossible to into. After I got the bus home and pulled/opened the trans, it turns out that the unsupported input shaft had worn the internal bearings on the main shaft out. It happened slowly over time I suppose so the shift forks wore to match. Realigning the input and mainshaft (which are basically the same shaft) caused all the formed wear patterns to now be misaligned. And so there went 3rd and 4th (1st and 2nd were engaged on the secondary shaft). I don't know if this is your problem or not but the Subaru and Bus transaxle are extremely similar. As others have mentioned you could check your shifter linkage bushings. There are two replaceable ones and a third that can be fixed, as mentioned, by resleeving with some hard rubber or nylon after drilling the old bushing out. But it does seem suspicious that the bushings would be bad when your TO bearing was toast...

It ended up being the plate that bolts to the bottom of the engine. It was pinched/bent up. I took a picture when I pulled the engine out, which I can throw up here later. This new engine runs nicely now with no unusual noises. The newfound power compared to the old engine almost makes me rethink the turbo swap I've been planning. Almost. But that's for later. Thanks for all the replies!

I'll try the screw driver thing. I used a long tube to my ear and it really didn't narrow anything down. Well, except that it was a lot noiseier under the engine than above the engine. It really sounds like valves (it sounds like they're tapping when near them) but also like something in the oil pan (also sounds like tapping near it). I don't think it's a rod knock but who knows at this point. The oil pump is a rotary thing so it shouldn't make that tappety noise, right? Are there any other internal things that might cause that noise? I'm going to check the valves yet again this morning. And beyond that, I'm going to call the auto wreckers I got this engine from - they have a warranty on it supposedly.

The timing belt tensioner is new as are all the idlers - from the Gates kit (which uses OEM idlers). Water pump is also new. They all looked fine with the enigine running - smooth rolling. Just to be sure the tensioner was ok, I pryed on it with a screw driver to increase tension and there was no change.

I personally haven't done a compression test. I'm in the middle of a move and all my normal tools are packed up en route to the new house. However, the wrecking yard I got the engine from claimed 190-200 psi on all cylinders. Beyond that, it drives well and doesn't smoke. And turning the crank over with a ratchet, I can definitely feel it has compression. Beyond that fuzzy descript though, I have no hard numbers. Tomorrow I can pick up a compression gauge and report back.

For what it's worth, here's a video of reving the engine. It was started relatively cold to make the video. There was a whine which I would assume is the pilot or throwout bearing (I doubt the latter as it has about 9k miles on it and rolled smoothly when I swapped engines). Pushing the clutch pedal in and out changes the noise and I do it throughout the video when at a constant rpm...it's the reason the noise changes at constant rpm. Video: 2000 Subaru EJ25 Reving Up Pressing Clutch in-and-out ticking engine noise by Jennifer Frederick, on Flickr

I know, right? I'm letting the engine cool off now and will recheck. I used the arrow on the d/s cam gear with noon at cylinder 1, 3 o'clock at cylinder 3, 6 o'clock at cylinder 2, 9 o'clock at cylinder 4. There was already clearance on the intake/exhaust when at those locations. I suppose I could take the spark plug out and check to ensure it's at TDC, but the present valve lash at each position seemed to indicate it was correct.

I have a 2002 Outback with 260k. My engine developed a rod knock (so I'm familiar with that noise) which led me to swap in a 2000 EJ25 out of an Outback (it's what was available). It required changing the crank and d/s cam gears, as well as keeping the original '02 intake, but other than that was a pretty direct swap. I put on a new timing belt and associated idlers/tensioner, a new water pump, changed oil/coolant (both at proper levels), set intake valves to 0.007" and exhaust valves to 0.009" with the engine cold. It makes this noise: 2000 Subaru EJ25 Engine Ticking Noise by Jennifer Frederick, on Flickr From searching, I thought perhaps this was piston slap, but from what I gathered, that's supposed to go away when the engine is warmed up. Mine makes the same noise when the engine is cold or warmed up - I took that video 4 different times, from cold to warmed up and it all sounds the same. The noise is louder from underneath the car, but I can't pinpoint which side - it sounds like both sides and in the oil pan as well. Really weird. It really sounds like valves but I've checked them multiple times now...I even tightened the valves to the tight end of the spec and still noisy (hence the 0.007" and 0.009" above). I'm basically out of ideas of what's wrong. I checked to make sure the timing marks lined up twice. It has oil, it has coolant, the exhaust was torqued properly and the isn't leaking. The car makes good power, revs fine, drives fine, and otherwise behaves as it should. Any ideas? I don't think it's a rod knock as I just experienced that and it's a deeper more clunky noise. Could it somehow be the oil pump, pilot bearing, or throwout bearing? It sounds like a tappet noise, not a whine or other constant metal on metal contact but I'm so out of ideas now I'm not sure...

Yep, I think you're right. I emailed rockauto about it; I doubt they'll cover it but at least they should know. That was dumb on me for not realizing if the instructions were there, it probably meant the sleeve should have been there too. And if it was a return, that's dumb on rockauto for not confirming the box contents before reshipping. Once I get it apart I'll inspect the damage. I'm hopeful that the PP and clutch disc are ok, but not counting on it. TO bearings are relatively cheap, and as long as the trans quill is ok, I'll just plop a standard one in there. Thanks for the help; I'll report back when there's news.

That's the ridiculous thing about the kit - it had those instructions, but there was no sleeve included. The TO bearing fit just fine without it. I'll be pulling it tonight anyhow.

Well ok, I spoke too soon. The problem is back in full force; maybe it just felt like being nice after I replaced the slave cylinder. When it won't go into 1st or 2nd at a stop, if I double clutch very fast, I can get it into 2nd with a slight pop. 02 Forester and 02 Outback both have 4.11 final drives, so I'm good there. I agree about the oil and synchros vs final drives, although I'm guessing that won't do it. I may give it a shot though. Also, the new clutch came with some info about a repair sleeve or some such thing - could that be the issue? Perhaps the TO bearing is actually going crooked because the thing isn't sliding evenly... I'll probably start pulling the trans tonight. Fun fun. I'll report back with whatever I find.

Thanks for the replies, and here's a slight update: I replaced the slave cylinder and hose, flushed the old dot 3 fluid out, filled it with fresh dot 3, and bled it. It helped, but didn't eliminate the problem. It still has intermittent issues going into 1st and 2nd, but it'll now at least go into gear without grinding, so that's a plus. The intermittent clutch chatter remains, and as before, if it's difficult to get into 1st or 2nd, clutch chatter ensues. Double clutching doesn't help. Rev matching does, but unfortunately I can't rev match when stopped unless I turn off the car I did use synthetic - Mobil 1 75W90 IIRC. It doesn't seem like a synchro issue as it's intermittent. Although I'm not positive, every other car I've had with synchro issues had the problem all the time, not intermittently. So maybe I missed a bolt when tightening the pressure plate? Or maybe the input shaft isn't seating in the pilot bearing? It looks as if the trans will be coming out again, I'm running out of ideas...

Ok, I can't figure this out. 2002 Legacy Outback with a 5mt. This whole problem came about because my front differential was bad. I got a 5mt from an 02 Forester and swapped it in. New pressure plate, clutch, and flywheel, as well as throwout bearing and trans input guide bearing. I figured with a lower first gear and higher 5th gear, it would be nice; and it was for the first few weeks. Then all the sudden I started having issues getting it into gear, but only sometimes. Let me try and describe it. Occasionally, and uncorrelated to temperature (of the car or surroundings), humidity, time of day, phase of the moon, and whatnot, it will not go into 1st or 2nd without massive grinding. So I don't try when it does this and instead pop it into 3rd, get it rolling fast enough that the trans speed matches the gear speed, and go into first. For whatever reason, it'll go into 3rd at these times, but usually not 1st or 2nd. It's almost as if the clutch doesn't disengage enough to allow it into gear. That would make sense if it happened all the time, but it doesn't. Sometimes it'll shift just fine, with no issues at all. Other times it has this difficulty getting into gear. When it does have difficulty getting into gear, there's massive clutch chatter, as if the clutch is misaligned. When I have this difficulty getting into gear, I can hear an RPM-dependent whining. I don't know if it's the clutch disc slightly dragging between the flywheel and pressure plate, the throwout bearing on the pressure plate, or perhaps the guide bearing in the flywheel. I bought a new slave cylinder and hose, but haven't put it on yet; my wife is out of town and I have no way to bleed it otherwise. I bought it thinking that just maybe the old slave cylinder isn't disengaging the clutch enough. I was also thinking perhaps the guide bearing is pressed in too far and the input shaft slips out. That might explain the massive clutch chatter and occasional lack of problem (like when it's actually aligned). I really have no idea, and before I pull the trans again, I'd like to get other opinions. Has anyone had an issue like this? Any thoughts?