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Everything posted by pontoontodd
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Since we ripped the front bumper off our friend's Impreza pulling him out of the swamp, I decided to weld the brackets to the front bumper of my Impreza. You can see the one spot weld is already cracked/rusted apart. We also messed with our CB radios a bit. We have four CBs and tried them in three different cars and seemed to have about 200' of range with any combination. Better than nothing but very disappointing. We have our cars mostly ready for the next off road trip, so we took apart the dual range trans to see what had failed. Not surprisingly the high range synchro / baulk ring was badly distorted. The snapring that holds the hub in place had slid out of the groove, which seems very shallow. Here you can see one of the spring clips that holds the pads had broken. I don't know if that was cause or effect. I'm not sure those clips are needed or even helpful since they would normally hold the selector ring in between gears. In the case of the low range you'd either want it in high or low, not in between. You can also see the hub fits on the smashed synchro ring, the hub was definitely sliding on the shaft. At a minimum I plan on cutting the groove in the shaft deeper and getting a different snapring. Also noticed the ring/flange on third gear that is probably supposed to keep you from shifting too far was broken. Anyone know where to get dual range synchro rings in the US? I've gotten them from a company in Australia. Other than that I made one control arm for the 2002 Outback.
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You would be amazed by the difference the 1.6 low range makes. It's more than 60% better. You get 60% more torque multiplication, which helps, but you're also running 60% higher RPM. Imagine doing a hill at 2500RPM vs 1500RPM, the engine is making much more torque. Perfect for what you're trying to do. Unfortunately it seems like every time I pushed it at all it would break or get stuck in low range. We've talked about rebuilding it and putting it in my friend's Forester with the stock engine and tires but even then we would be afraid it would get stuck in low range. I have seen people put oil pumps on them to cool the low range but I would worry about that failing and dumping all the oil out of the trans. Really for slow off roading you're better off with a Toyota or something else with a real low range, lockers, solid axles, bigger tires, etc.
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Did you ever look at the X-trail or other struts? I'm sure you could find something to give you more travel if you're willing to cut and weld. The other reasons we built our own struts are that the standard replacement struts don't have much damping, the seals blow out, and the bodies bend. If you're not driving hard that's not a problem.
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We got mud in the air filter in the Impreza on the last trip so I wanted to change the intake. I think the main problem is it was pulling air from right in front of the front tire and the plastic wheel well is long gone. Figured I'd just get it to pull air from a high spot in the engine compartment, that should keep most of the water and mud out. Also the intake after the filter is 3"+, the pipe before the filter was about 2.5". I had this 3" exhaust bend lying around so I made a flange and welded it on. Sanded a few of the ribs flush and bolted it on. Riveted a piece of sheet aluminum to cover the original intake hole. I also drilled out the drain hole to about 3/4", that always seemed to get plugged with mud. I wanted it a couple inches below the hood so it had plenty of airflow. We ran a strap around a tree and pulled the radiator support forward. It worked but I wound up ripping off part of the radiator support/tow bar mount. It looked like it may have been cracked about halfway through where it broke. I replaced it with 2" square. Have to get better washers for where it bolts to the tie down point but I think it will hold. Since the lower radiator mounts are gone or broken I made up this little sleeve to support the radiator with foam in between. I drove to the carwash to blast out the condenser and radiator while the bumper is off. Steering is much better now, car is running well. Have to put some weld on the bumper brackets and bolt that back on, try to find a tire leak, secure a fender a little better, and a few other little things. Cars are pretty much ready to go for the next UP trip later this month.
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The 95 Outback headlight assemblies (bottom) are one piece and hold up much better than the two piece Outback and Impreza (top) headlights. For some reason it seems like the adjusters don't rust in place either. It is not a perfect fit but with some sheet metal removal I got it to fit on my 96 Impreza. Wiring plugs into headlight bulb but I had to splice the running light wire. Could splice the turn signal wire in too. Got the radiator water neck TIG welded. Put the radiator back in, it's not sitting all the way down in this picture but you can see that there is now some clearance between it and the valve cover. I can slide my fingers between the hose and valve cover now. The valve cover was touching the radiator hose before. Since I had to drain the coolant to do that, I replaced the oil cooler gaskets and hoses and the valve cover gaskets. The engine had been leaking oil badly when it sat overnight and now doesn't leak. While I was doing that I discovered the driver's side engine mount had separated. This might be why the valve cover had rubbed through the radiator hose after over a year with no problems. This is the passenger side mount. That split in the rubber goes most of the way through. I might be able to rip it apart by hand. The part that bolts to the engine is plastic but seemed undamaged on both sides. I only found them for sale from Subaru so they were about $80 each, I think that's why I hadn't replaced them when we first did the swap. Here you can see there is a tab that holds that steel plate in place. I think all the rubber was worn off the old one, that plate just falls off. On the new mount it's difficult to remove that plate. The driver's side had separated completely and that tab is gone too. Also replaced the left rear caliper on the 99 Outback. We replaced the u-joint steering shaft in the Impreza, both u-joints were tight.
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That car should be a blast! You could definitely fit an H6. The EG33 is only an inch or two longer (25-50mm), the EZ30/36 is less than an inch longer than the EJ. It is probably much too late in the build for this, but can you lower it? What do you need, 50mm ground clearance?
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The front struts will be about the same, I am going to make a small change. Front control arms will be the same. In the rear I'm going to start with the coilover shocks I used for the a-arm front suspension, they'll give me 10-11" of travel. In the future I'll get longer bodies and shafts which should allow 13-14" of rear wheel travel.
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I have most of the parts for long travel suspension. I am just waiting on a few machined parts. I plan on putting smaller front brakes on it so I can use 15" alloy wheels. I will use the same wheels and tires (215/75/15 Hankook MT) as my 99 Outback. I want to make fabricated bumpers, 2" tall x 4" wide rectangular steel tubing to protect the lights. Also has to have skid plates before I take it off road. I'm afraid I might have to do the head gaskets before I take it off road too, the coolant boils over a little occasionally just driving it hard in town. Never runs hot on the gauge though. I'll also add a tablet mount for navigation and convert the high beams to HID (already have the kit). Eventually I might change it to a manual trans but I want to see how the automatic works (with a cooler) and I want to leave it mostly stock for now. I'll use it for trail riding, going to offroad parks, going on vacation. Earliest I'll get started on it would be August, I won't have the time or money until then. Considering the head gaskets, it will probably be a winter project. Same with the 6MT/R180 swap into the 99. Should probably do head gaskets on that one too.
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While I had the coolant drained out of the 99 Outback I decided to replace the oil cooler and valve cover gaskets since they seemed to fix the oil leak on the 2001 Outback. I got those replaced, they were very stiff and brittle. While doing that I realized that the driver's side engine mount is broken (rubber is separated). The passenger side is badly cracked. I ordered a pair of those from the dealer. I got the water neck on the radiator welded. We replaced the steering rack on the Forester since the one line was kinked and rusty. Also replaced his RF knuckle with one with bolt on wheel bearing as we couldn't fully clamp the ball joint with the bolt. Wheel bearing that was in the new knuckle didn't quite fit the CV splines, wound up putting a new bolt on wheel bearing in it, which was of course super easy. Finished editing the video from our May trip to Arkansas: https://youtu.be/2hZ0n65dPJk
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Before the UP trip the cable hood latch was acting up on my Impreza and Outback so I welded a strip of steel onto the latch so I can just open them directly. Seemed to work fairly well, sometimes you have to push back down on the lever to get it to latch, but no more worrying about snapping the plastic hood release off. Had also noticed three of the four wheels on the Outback had cracks in the inner bead so I replaced those. Yesterday B fixed the fender and corner light on his Forester. He tried to remove the steering rack bolts, one of them broke off and he drilled and tapped it, another one was probably going to break so he threaded it back in for now. We will probably replace the whole rack or at least the one line soon. His RF balljoint is loose in the spindle too, we put in a different bolt with a 17mm hex and still weren't able to tighten it enough to get the ball joint tight. We'll put a knuckle with bolt on wheel bearing on that corner probably next weekend. I adjusted the parking brake on the Outback since I drove with it on last weekend. Checked all the wheel bearings and greased the struts. C straightened out and screwed down the left front fender. The lower radiator hose hadn't rubbed through, this time it split open. I think this is an old one I've been carrying around as a spare for a long time, maybe even the original one from the car or the six cylinder donor. Ordered a new one for 99 Outback with 2.5 and one for 2002 Outback with 3.0, see which one fits better. We pulled out the radiator and I cut a v notch in it so I can get that welded at a lower angle. Here you can see how close it was to the timing chain cover and the bolts I cut off. V notch cut and bent down, a little hard to see in this picture but moved the water neck down about 1/2". While the coolant is out I ordered some gaskets and plan to seal up this engine like I did the 2001. I replaced the RR strut on my blue Impreza since it was leaking and had almost no damping. B replaced the LR CV axle. When he did that he noticed the inner CV had worn a big notch in the exhaust. B fitted a piece of steel over that and I welded it in place so at least it's not cooking the CV. I hammered and ground the wheel wells where the tires were rubbing. I wired the cooling fan to one of the terminals on one of the AC relays in the fusebox so it's on with the ignition. Has an inline fuse near the fusebox. I checked the wiring at the RF headlight which seemed wrong at first but after testing and blowing out a headlight fuse seemed the same as the 95 Outback headlight. We fitted one to C's Impreza with some sheet metal trimming and hammering, should hold up better than the two piece headlight/corner lights.
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Our friend M wanted to have an off road bachelor party so we took ten guys and five Subarus to the UP. We all met up at my house around noon Friday. C showed up early, his girlfriend drove his blue Outback and he flat towed his black Impreza OBS with his pickup. We went to a grocery store to buy food for the trip – bagels, strudel, bread, PB&J, pizzas, dogs and burgers, and taco ingredients. We left around 1PM and all drove to the cabin without any issues and cooked the pizzas. The next morning we cooked pancakes and packed up and left around 7AM. Headed across 2 to the railroad grade into Watersmeet, hit the mini whoop section on the way into town. Shortly after going through Watersmeet the blue Outback died and we eventually towed it back to Nordine's in Watersmeet. Eventually figured out the timing belt had skipped some teeth. C had brought a different tensioner thinking the one on there might be weak. Got it running again and headed towards the Baraga plains. After a couple more hours we finally got into an area with a lot of trails and the blue Outback died again. We got it running but not well, it probably had some bent valves. Pulled it to civilization with the 50' strap. Talked to a kid in the family that owns a repair shop of sorts, his mom wouldn't let him buy it. Found a gas station that would let us leave it there for a month, C is coming back up over the fourth of July with his girlfriend's family and will tow it back then. At some point early in the day A put the Impreza in a ditch and got it up on two wheels which bent one of the front wheels. Drove on some main roads to the Baraga plains. Drove around a sandy stunt area and got all the cars but the blue Impreza stuck at one point. Went to the sandy pipeline grade and hit that which cheered everyone up. Switched cars at the halfway point. Headed east on 28 to get close to halfway to where we were staying Sunday night. Headed south off the highway and did some more trail riding. Saw a couple of painted turtles at the start of one of the first trails. I let M and C lead the way and they decided to keep going straight where the road turned and we were on an old narrow somewhat overgrown trail. They started driving through the woods to a clearcut at one point and when we got out to look around and found we had gotten off the main trail a bit. Shockingly it went through to the dirt road we had turned off on. We found some other dead ends on the way to the campground. At one of them we noticed coolant coming out of the bottom of the Outback. One of the valve cover bolts had rubbed through the lower radiator hose. Cut the bolt and boss off flush with the recip saw and put the spare radiator hose on. The campground at Pike lake has been closed for almost a decade but the campground at Bass lake was open so we camped there. The next morning I took the overflow cap off the Outback which caused it to start leaking coolant again. A different valve cover bolt had rubbed through the hose. I was able to cut one of the hoses back, cut that bolt and boss off flush, and put it back together. In the morning we found some dead ends and motorcycle only trails. From there we headed east to Gwinn and got fuel. There was a nice little jump along the powerline on the south side of town that we took turns hitting. Looped around the south side of town on a whooped out sandy trail. Went south between Mehl Lake and Little Lake and everything seemed to be private. Went north across the highway on some sandy trails that led up to the snowmobile trail, which was sandy/dusty and whooped out. I was driving the Outback in the back and could see the Impreza bouncing around quite a bit, the right rear has no damping. Followed 35 for a bit and went down some other dead end trails. Eventually worked our way back up to the snowmobile trail but there were gates in a few places so we wound up taking 94 to Munising and got gas. At this point we decided to just go to the lodge we rented and make dinner. S cooked tacos. C wanted to do some trail riding since there are a ton of trails around that lodge. Figured we'd loop around for an hour or so, try to find an unpaved route to the Driggs River road. We went west and then turned off on Sunset Landing road. Fun road with dips/jumps and sandy turns. Came to a four way intersection. The widest straight route went right into a big pool of standing water. There was a trail right alongside it that was narrower but a decent dirt road with just a tree line in between. I drove down the dirt road and thought Cory saw me. They both joined up after the tree line. C didn't see me and had gotten overconfident from the standing water we'd driven through on sandy/rocky trails in the afternoon. He drove right into it and got stuck in the middle of the pond. It was about 50' wide and 200' long and he was stuck right in the middle. In a couple minutes there was water on the seats and they were sitting on the roof of the car. I couldn't get close to them on that trail since I started to sink in before even getting to the standing water. Water was only about a foot deep but the bottom was very soft. I got close on the side trail and we winched them over to the treeline. We were able to pull the car up the bank with the snatch strap, ripping off the front bumper in the process. It was held onto the brackets by four spot welds on each side. Pulled it back to the lodge and C told B he joined the swamp club. We drained the water out of the oil pan, pulled the plugs and cranked more out, and it sort of ran. Relays were clicking on and off, battery seemed weak, we're thinking the ECU being submerged might have caused problems. The next morning we drove back to the crime scene so we could all check it out in the daylight. At this point we struggled to get C's car running right, swapped the batteries between the Imprezas. It kept acting up for the next hour or two, hotwired the fuel pump, eventually just decided to flat tow it back home with the Outback. Outback was running hot above 70mph, especially up grades. Blasted out the radiator at a coin op car wash which didn't help much. Radiator has at least some mud on the backside of it. Had to run the heat about 1/3 of the time on the way home. Blue Impreza's hood didn't get latched properly after we got gas in Menominee so that blew open and smashed the windshield. Other than that we got home alright. Leaning towards just getting a RR strut, windshield, and a couple other things for the Impreza. Tempted to get Forester struts for it and pull the swaybars. Also tempted to just switch to the alloy wheels and snow tires and keep the steels for backup rather than buying more steel wheels that are just going to bend. Thoughts on that? The next day the Outback was leaking coolant again. Need to change the water neck on the radiator and flush the mud out of it.
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While looking for rear axles we noticed that they are different lengths. Got a pair that I think are from a 98 Forester, right rear axle is about 10mm longer than the left rear. Shortly after the last Arkansas trip my wife and I went to Tennessee in the 99 Outback with kayaks. Forecast was for rain in IN, KY, TN so we stayed in western IL. Odometer went over 250k on the way down. Went to a couple different lakes in Illinois. Next we went to Interlake. Have to pay to enter now, not a lot of people out on the trails. Trails seem rougher and more overgrown than the last time we were there. Looped around to one of the lakes at the bottom of a rough hill. My wife figured we wouldn't see anyone else out on the lake and we didn't. Went up the hill without much problem and kept looping around. Showed her the one big climb just off the county road which wasn't much of a problem. The trail after that was quite narrow and washed out and at the bottom the whole area was flooded. We probably could have gone through but I decided to turn around and take the main trail back to the parking lot. On the way we stopped at a hiking trail. Trail was fairly overgrown and we were only able to follow it by looking for the markers on trees. We headed for Wood creek lake the next day. On the way to what we thought was the boat ramp we went by Wildcat off road park. I thought this was the park in KY where you can drive through a cave so we signed in and bought wristbands and a map. Then I found out this is not the park with a giant cave. Should have asked for my money back but we went out and looped around the main trail across the road from the office. There were a few sections that tested the Subaru but we made it through but I decided we should leave while we could. Did some more kayaking and hiking and had no car problems. Drove about 2000 miles, mostly on pavement, used about a quart of oil. We plan on taking ten guys in five Subarus to the UP soon, I think we have the cars all ready to go.
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Looking good, should be a blast when it's done! Make sure you have enough piston to head clearance. Guess I mentioned that before.
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We went back to Ozark NF in Arkansas over the weekend. Decided to check out the small section of it between Mountain Home and Mountain View. C made it to my house a little before 6AM Friday in his 99 Impreza Outback Sport and we hooked up the tow bar and lights and headed south. Picked up K on the way and met J in Mountain Home and unhooked the Impreza. We started trail riding towards the Leatherwood wilderness. We crossed a stream next to a waterfall and C noticed one of his tires was leaking. We swapped it out with his spare and continued. We spent the night at Gunner pool campground next to a small pool created by a rock dam holding back the stream. C's RR strut mount rusted out in the Impreza and he kept getting flat tires so we stopped at the Walmart in Mountain View and bought two Goodyears. There was a two hour wait so C did the mounting in the parking lot with a couple of prybars. K and I went to the tractor supply store and got a dozen ~8” hose clamps we used to hold his strut top mount together. B broke the RF lower balljoint (Amazon lifetime warranty) in the Forester, which also pulled apart the CV axle. Fortunately the balljoint came out easily and we were able to get it back together. His car was also running hot, the condenser is beat and the radiator was plugged with dirt/dust. We stopped a couple of times to blast out his radiator but that fix didn't seem to last very long. His engine is also still using a lot of oil, at least a quart per tank, doesn't seem to be going in the intake from the breathers or leaking. Any idea what the cause or solution to that problem is? C went to climb a long, rutted, rocky climb and his drivetrain was slipping about halfway up. We headed back out that trail the way we came but there was a long grade with some steep sections we had to drive back up. He thought the clutch was slipping so we spent some time pouring water in the clutch fork hole which didn't seem to help much. When we got back to the long climb out he couldn't drive it up. He said it was showing 30mph on the speedo but the car wasn't moving. I looked under the front and the RF CV axle bar and inboard joint were spinning but the outer joint was not. I tried towing him up the grade but didn't make it very far. I drove up to the top of the grade where B was waiting and got a spare front CV axle and some tools and drove back down to C. We swapped out the CV axle. C suggested towing him up just to make sure he'd get to the top rather than getting halfway up and having to back down. We hooked up the strap and went as fast as I thought was reasonably safe. Most of the time there was slack in the strap but I was pulling him a little on the steepest parts. He probably could have made it up under his own power but it was an entertaining ride and put us in a better mood. We were following what looked like a long trail on the map and came to a gate that was open but said private property. It was at a wide shallow rock stream crossing. C parked hard in the stream so we decided to follow suit for a photo op. C blew out a brake line in the Impreza when I started turning around in a giant dust cloud and he didn't see us until the last minute. We tried replacing the line but then the other rear line broke so we decided to just splice the rear lines together inside the car and bleed the brakes. While we were waiting for it to cool down we checked out the boat ramp I was turning around for. K noticed a big snakeskin and then noticed a snake. We saw at least two swimming around the rocks along the shore. Drove by the road to Sugarloaf Mountain, I thought at first we could drive to the top but the Forest Service had locked the gate. It was a mile to the top and there is a big fire tower so we figured that would be cool to check out. Walked to the top to find out we probably weren't supposed to climb the fire tower which was a big disappointment. The last night we camped at a campground that was partially closed with a spring and cave nearby. It had hot showers and we camped along the stream which was wide and shallow. B went back to the RV dump site and blasted out his radiator. We cooked dogs over a campfire and went to sleep. We packed up the cars in the morning and went to a picnic area with a cave and cliff amphitheater and ate bagels and cinnamon rolls. C stopped at the RV station to wash out his radiator and I hard parked the Outback on a sharp rocky curb which punctured the sidewall. I plugged it and aired back up. Plugs came out every hour or two so we eventually put the spare on, C was excited to see the electric jacks in action. One time we had to stop for that I pulled off the road in Mark Twain NF and after we plugged it we followed the overgrown trail there to a small pond. On the way back out that trail we did some hard parking on a small rock garden. We took a few other side roads/trails in Mark Twain that were fairly short dead ends. We were able to drive all three cars home. Outback just needs a tire patch. Impreza needs rear brake lines. Forester needs a new condenser and possibly radiator and probably tires. By far the most trail repairs we've ever done on a trip, a lot of them were tires. It was a hot weekend, highs of 90F and lows in the 60s, plenty of humidity and not much wind. But we had a good time and found some good trails. B is looking for a rust free Forester so any leads on that would be appreciated, let's say $3000 budget, under 200k miles, stick shift.
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If you look at: http://www.monroe.com/en-US/e-catalog http://showmetheparts.com/kyb/ https://www.partsgeek.com/mmparts/struts/nissan/x_trail.html It does look like they have a little more travel than 1999 Outback struts, maybe an inch. Top threads are the same, so you could probably use Subaru top hats. Not sure about the bottom mount or offset for tire clearance and camber, pictures might not be those particular struts. For that matter have you tried putting Subaru rear struts on the front? I think the bolt pattern is the same, maybe not enough offset to give you good tire clearance, but they're definitely longer and have more travel. Looks like you could get an early 00 Xtrail with a 280hp SR20VET and six speed manual! Why not just buy one of those?
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Yes, anything can be changed, but would it be worth the effort? You would have to modify or rebuild the subframe to change that, which some people do. I think longer links to get 13-14" of travel would be good enough. There will probably be all sorts of other things limiting suspension travel at that point. I should probably measure the bump steer with the stock links but I can't imagine it would be too bad. The BG links are still shorter than the axles, and they start out at more of a downward angle, so we have the same problem, it's not quite as bad. One of the main reasons we can get decent suspension travel out of the Subarus is that the CV axles are so long. I haven't seen many other cars, and virtually no trucks, with CV axles as long.
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Did some measuring on the white 2002 OB H6 LL Bean wagon. Discs are 294mm and 15" alloy wheels from the 99 OB definitely don't fit. So I'll probably get 99 front brakes for that one. The coilover reservoir shocks I have from the a-arm setup have 6.5" travel so I can get about 10.5" of wheel travel in the rear with those, shouldn't be too hard to adapt. Droop travel seems limited by the inboard CV joint bottoming out, which it does on the rear strut suspension at full droop as well. Stage two will probably be getting 8.5" travel shocks (maybe just shafts and bodies to put on these) and making longer lateral links. At some point I'll see how much longer they can be with the stock CV axles, I'm guessing an inch or so like we did in the front. One of those links is really short so an extra inch would make a big difference. Thinking then I could get 13-14" of wheel travel.
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Friend of mine has a 2001 or 2002 Outback a neighbor gave him with front end damage. Broke one of the cam gears and plenty of things in front of that. He is probably just going to part it out. Different color than either of mine and it's an EJ25/4EAT. I'm thinking I'll take the good corner lights off and probably the power seat switch. Anything else on these cars that tends to fail that I should grab? He is probably going to take the front struts. We'll take the CV axles and suspension if it's not all rusted together. Probably just complete rear subframe with diff if possible. Auto trans for the EJ is different than the one for the EZ30 according to the FSM.
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It's possible but I don't know of any longer travel struts that would fit the EJ Subarus. The stock ones actually have quite a bit of travel for a street car, about 6" front and 8" rear. I've seen charts for shock lengths but not for struts. Try contacting some of the manufacturers - KYB, Monroe, etc maybe they can tell you. Keep in mind part of the problem with the stock struts for driving fast is that they have very little compression damping. Especially on the Outback, the rear struts sit near the bump stops at ride height. So they're very easy to bottom out. Which I think is what bends the housings. So you really want more damping, stiffer springs and/or more preload, and a stronger body. Racing shocks cost a lot of money for a reason. They solve all those problems and give you something at least close to the damping you want out of the box. The biggest reason they're so expensive is that they don't make many compared to a standard replacement strut. If KYBs had good damping, a strong body, sat in the middle of the travel at ride height, and they made them by the thousands, they would be cheap and would solve all our problems. But that would probably be too harsh for most people's normal street driving and no one else would want them. Then we're back to low volumes and high cost. Inverted struts are more expensive because they have more parts than a conventional strut. They need a little more maintenance but are much stronger. Again, most people don't want a strut they have to grease every once in a while on their street car that costs more money so not many are made, which makes them more expensive.
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It's all relative I guess. DIY your own shocks from scratch would probably cost a lot more than buying parts from Fox, definitely if you consider your time. There are a lot of parts and some close tolerance machining. Tempted to try modifying a set of KYBs or something for better damping and strength. One of our friends might buy a cheap set of coilovers from ebay for his Impreza OBS just to see if you can adjust them stiff enough to keep from bottoming, price is cheaper than buying a full set of new stock replacement struts and springs.
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I just tried this again, yes, unlocking all doors, foot on brake, all doors closed, (sometimes opening and closing door at this point), turning key from off to on (also tried from acc to on) ten times (also tried more than ten times). If I leave it on and wait, horn never honks. And I did check to make sure the horn is working. Then I was wondering if the alarm was even still working, haven't tried using the power locks in a year. Used the switch on the door to unlock and then lock all doors, closed the door, security light started blinking, when I unlocked and opened the door the alarm went off until I turned the ignition on/off three times. Which brings me back to seconding the original post, how can I just remove this alarm? Even if I got it working, would using the power lock button on the door cause the alarm to go off if I just unlock the door with the key? That's incredibly annoying. I have four street cars and it's nice to just have keys for all of them on my keyring rather than carrying a bunch of fobs around.