pontoontodd

My 2c, either build it inside or outside the car, both would probably be even harder. If you're not racing or trying to prevent body damage though, I think some 2x4 or similar steel tubing connecting the front and rear suspension would do a lot of good for not much weight, time, and expense and could double as sliders. Then try to tie the bumpers, strut mounts, etc into those.

1.5 x .095 should be plenty strong for your trail rig. .120 wall is only 26% heavier though. Any of those layouts should be strong enough if done correctly. In racing a continuous hoop is required behind the seats (inverted U between the B pillars). I think that's in case your welds are spoob or cracked it will still save you in a bad rollover. Start mocking it up and see which would be easiest to build. You can get EMT and bends pretty cheap, start cutting and tacking. Keep in mind you'll have to weld the tops of the joints somehow. You can cut the roof off, cut holes in the roof, cut holes in the floor for your hoops to drop into, or sleeve the bottoms of the tubes. If you're really worried about weight like you keep saying, you won't want to put a full cage in the car. Something like the subframe connectors they put on muscle cars would probably give you the most stiffness and weight per pound. Maybe you could make something like that to support your front bumper, but I couldn't really tell from your pictures. You'll want to connect the strut mounts, control arm mounts, and engine mounts if possible. Does this meet the rules for some racing organization? Just curious. For desert racing we need 1.75 x .120 for the entire cage.

Definitely interested to hear how the Audi works out if you start pushing it. I would think they're less reliable and parts are harder to get and more expensive than Subarus. Like you say, most Subarus don't have lockers, low range, or a lot of suspension travel either. The low end torque of a V8 would help a lot. How long you can keep up with Jeeps??? Even with completely stock suspension, I've never been with anyone in a Jeep who will even go half the speed we go in Subarus because the Jeep ride quality is terrible. They can crawl much better, but that's a different story. Second bratman on the headgaskets. Everyone I've talked to says you might have to replace them once, but not every 100k.

I just found this, looks like it will be very helpful finding springs: http://www.moogproblemsolver.com/moog/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/MOOG_Coil_Springs_Spec.pdf This Moog distributor has a sortable version which is even more useful: http://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/universal_coil_springs.asp They also have this outer tie rod size chart: http://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/universal_outer_tie_rod_ends.asp stock is ES3712 And this amazingly useful inner tie rod size chart: http://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/universal_inner_tie_rods.asp stock is EV473, looks like I just have to decide how much longer I want the tie rods.

Looks like a great candidate for long travel. Have you tried cycling the suspension with the shocks off to see how much travel it could have and what's limiting it?

As mentioned earlier, replaced the alternator with a Subaru reman. Also swapped a different power steering pump on. The one that's been on the car offers very little assist at idle. This one is much better. I've had these KC lights on for a while now. They're a spot pattern and I put a set of cheap HID conversions in them. They have amazing range, probably 1/4 mile, but very focused. I have them aimed slightly to each side of center. One issue I had at first was that they would slowly drop down while off roading. I think after I cranked down the adjustment bolts they stayed put, but just in case I added these long bolts underneath so I can fine tune the vertical aiming and they won't drop down. These are wired into the fog lights since those died the first time we took this thing off road, but the switch and wiring were all conveniently in place. The HIDs even plugged right into the stock fog light plugs, although the polarity was reversed. The downside of that is that the fog lights only come on with the low beams, the opposite of what I want. I have seen how tos on making the fog lights work regardless of hi/lo beam switching, but I'd rather have them switch on and off with the high beams for highway driving. So I figured that out, fortunately the Haynes manual has fairly accurate color coded wiring diagrams of these circuits. Basically had to cut the yellow/blue wire from the fog light switch and splice a wire into the plug end of it. This is the pin looking at the wiring harness plug: - - - - - X Ran that to the plug for the hi/lo switch under the dash. Spliced into the red/yellow wire on that end. These pictures aren't very good but hopefully you get the idea. Now you can turn the HIDs on and off with the fog light switch and they only come on when the high beams are on. So, more questions: Anybody know where I can get longer tie rods? The ignition coil has been humming for a long time, I'm thinking I should replace it, and then I'd have a spare. Any brand better than any other? The biggest problem with the long travel struts is still that they are sticking. I think at least part of the problem is that the springs are inline with the strut rather than angled toward the contact patch. So I'm looking for some springs about 3.5 or 4" ID, 14" long, and 200#/in spring rate. Anyone know of a good spring size chart or a place that winds good springs for $50-$100 each?

I don't see why not, but I don't know much about those cars.

A little rust/fatigue re-repair on the LR strut tower after we got home. I had just welded this back together without adding material the first time. The other side had a larger gap so I'd added a strip of sheet metal and that seems to be staying together, so I did it on this side. Not very pretty or exciting, but it needed to be done. Still looking for longer tie rods and a bigger airbox if anyone has any ideas.

First, here is a video mainly from the Badlands a few weeks ago. You can really see the difference in ride quality in the figure eight clip. For the most part, the video doesn't do it justice. There were trails where the Forester was thrashing around, tires bouncing off the ground, and we were being lightly jostled around in the Outback. Or if the Outback was leading the way, we could take any line we wanted and the guy in the Forester is pushing it as hard as he can and trying to find the smoothest line to keep up. The main problem still seems to be static friction. I am going to try cutting spiral grooves in the bearings and adding graphite grease when I put the fronts back together to see if it helps. Installed a Subaru thermostat and Subaru rebuilt alternator. Started mocking up a cage too to see how practical that would be and confirm exactly what we'd have to do to be legal. A few more things on my wish list are: Improved air filtration - current thought is to find a larger (longer) stock air box that would fit that I could run a snorkel to the hood scoop or at least high up in the engine compartment, maybe with a filter twice as big as stock. So if you know of one, post up. Bigger fuel cell for surge tank. I could probably fit a 12" x 18" x 4" tall cell on the passenger side. Still looking for longer inner and/or outer tie rod ends too.

Here is how I did the fuel lines and the floor. Cut a few pieces of 1" foam to support the floor panels. With the stock floor panels set over the top. Eventually I'll make a piece of sheet metal to cover this with carpet glued to it. The stock floor panel that covers the spare tire is heavy. After I drove the car for a day, this happened. The gasket under the cap of the fuel cell is sagging out and falling apart. There were two gaskets stacked, not sure if that was normal or relevant to the problem. I'm sure this thing is normally mounted with the cap at the top but I'm disappointed the gaskets couldn't take pump gas for a day. Cut a piece of cork gasket to cover the entire hole. I have no use for a cap on the side. Made a steel plate to bolt over the top, welded three bolts to a split ring on the inside for easy assembly and disassembly. I'd really like to fit a bigger surge tank but I haven't found anything larger than these 1 gallon tanks that would fit. There are some wedge shaped four, five, and six gallon cells I've seen but I think they're too wide, not to mention expensive.

Thanks for all the advice. The lifetime warranty parts can be a good deal sometimes. When I called about the thermostat, the Subaru dealer said a reman alternator is $106 ($50 core), so I think I'll go that route. Another issue I ran into when I put the front struts on is that the tie rods were just barely long enough when everything was realigned (roughly). Probably two threads of engagement. I'm not sure why since the lower arms are basically the same and I set the alignment about the same as it was with the a-arms. I had to adjust them at least 1/2" longer. I wanted to drive the car that day so I made some extenders, which seem to be holding up fine. Are there any longer inner or outer tie rods available? An inch longer would be ideal, even a half inch longer would work. I went through my pile of various used Subaru and aftermarket inners and outers and they're all the same lengths.

I was including all the chain stores with the Autozone reman comment. I know all those reman starters and alternators last about six months. A warranty is great if you just drive around town but if you're hundreds of miles from home in the woods it's worthless. There is a difference between a reman and made in China, not saying one is much better than the other, but some Chinese parts are actually made well. Not that I have the time and resources to figure out which ones.

1. The shafts are lubricated with shock oil which is as you describe. It is between the shock bodies and strut housings that they are greased. Every description of rebuilding inverted struts I've seen has recommended using a thick waterproof grease, but perhaps gear lube or something would work. The bushings we're using should be able to operate dry and they seem to stay pretty clean with the seals we're using now. 2. I should have been more clear, I was not considering an Autozone special. The only thing available on Rock Auto was AC Delco, etc reman alternators. I was really hoping to just get a new one for $100. Also considering getting the old one rebuilt locally. 3. Will do.

The main issue I've had since getting the Outback back together is that I can only put a few gallons at a time in it at the gas pump. I think it's mainly a matter of moving the vent fitting location on the fuel cell. I would still like to find a good diagram of all the vent hoses, carbon canister, etc. I drove it to a couple of our local testing grounds on Friday. Our local shock tuning expert thinks the front struts look much better than the a-arms. The biggest issue now is that it seems like the struts are sticky. He seemed to think we can overcome this at least partially through some shock valving changes, so we're going to try that and look into different greases and bushings. The next place I went to didn't do any damage to the car mechanically but at one point I was barely able to start the engine. The alternator was only putting out 11.5V. Fortunately my friend had a good used Subaru alternator there that we put on the car, bumping it up to almost 14V. He sort of owes it to another guy though so I'll have to figure out something there. On Sunday we went to the Badlands off road park. It was about 90F, humid, and no wind, so we were happy we had AC. Charged up the AC in the Forester in the parking lot before we hit the trails as a matter of fact. We drove the trails pretty hard for a few hours in our own cars, and then started switching around. The Outback definitely rode much better than the Forester and could go up obstacles we would not try in the Forester. In fact, we did a few things we would never have even looked at a couple years ago. The Outback's suspension might be a bit on the stiff side, we rarely felt it bottom out, but overall the ride quality was amazing. The Forester had much more wheelspin with its less aggressive tires and less articulation, which was entertaining sometimes and a hindrance at other times. It is really fun to drive and does great considering it's almost completely stock. The Outback kept running hot when we were not moving enough and had the AC on, but the Forester had no problems with the AC on all the time. Sometimes the Outback would be OK on temp, but a bunch of times it got pretty hot. We're thinking maybe the thermostat is sticking. The new guy we brought with who had never been to an off road park commented on the way home that he couldn’t imagine doing that without AC and couldn’t think of any other car that could drive 80mph for 250 miles, beat the crap out of it offroad for seven hours, and then drive it back home without ever wrenching on it. It's going to be a while before I can edit all the video we've gotten but it will be good. So here are my latest questions: What is the best grease for inverted struts for minimum friction? Should I get a reman alternator or get my old one rebuilt? Is there a new option? What is the best thermostat to get? I've noticed some are advertised as fail open, I thought they have all been made that way for decades.

I tried mounting the upper spring perches to the body like I did in the rear, but there is too much angle change in the front struts since they're shorter and swing around when you steer. This was the best short term solution I could come up with. In the future I'd probably just remake the top cap and spring perch as one piece. We could probably even have a fitting for the hose at the edge of the spring perch and have a more traditional stud mount rather than the shock loop. Here are the parts for the front welded, painted, and ready to install. LF strut installed.

So I forgot to post this picture, this is what the fuel cell looks like from inside the car. One of the things I had to do was change the angle of the lower balljoint on the lower arm and shorten it a little since the struts have less camber change than the a-arms. It was binding near full compression before I did this. Another reason to ditch the a-arms. I think the subframe bolts were starting to bend a little, and this spacer is definitely cracked (upper left). Not going anywhere, but probably not a good sign. Welded in new reservoir mounts. The strut swings around quite a bit when you steer since it's so far away from the spindle for tire clearance. In this location the reservoir clears the strut, tire, and lower arm. More pictures soon. Finally drove the car last night. The front struts seem to work well. I was hitting some things - ramped alley entrances, parking dividers - that I would never hit that hard in the Impreza or I'd be walking home and it just soaks them up. High pressure fuel pump makes some noise at idle. Hope to really give it a beating this weekend, PM me if you're interested in meeting us at the Badlands on Sunday.

I don't have a lot of experience with different Subaru models. We might make a long travel setup for my friend's 2000 Forester, so I'd know for sure then. From what little I've looked at it, I doubt we'd get much more travel than this. The stock suspension is basically the same as my Outback. It doesn't have the subframe spacers though, so without those it might wind up with less travel. Smaller tires would allow us to get a little more compression travel. No idea about the Bajas or later model Subarus.

Front struts are coming together well. Hope to have the car back on the road by the end of the weekend. To see some more comments, check out these threads: http://www.woodsbuggy.com/forum/pictures-and-videos/17775 http://www.reddit.com/r/battlewagon/comments/3d9y60/this_guy_custom_fabricated_11_longtravel_struts/ Also, my favorite recent youtube comment: If you're havin' car troubles I feel bad for you son, I got a 99 Subaru and this ditch ain't one.

They definitely make the car a lot more fun and durable. I'm happy to see interest in these but keep in mind the shocks and springs alone are close to $2000. Then we have to modify the shafts, make housings, assemble bearings, seals, etc.

They are Fox 2.0 smooth bodied reservoir shocks. I had to modify the shafts to attach to the bottom of the strut housings, which I made from scratch. You might want to wait until we've put some more miles on them, but I would definitely be willing to build you a set.

Painted the exhaust and fuel cell and got that all together and hooked up. Fired it up a few days ago. Still have to put the rear suspension back together, including replacing a wheel bearing. Started mocking up the long travel front struts too, so far so good.

The bottom frame is painted and loosely bolted in. I should have welded it as much as I could while it was in the car. I had it tack welded pretty well and did all the welding off the car and it distorted a bit. The exhaust is all tack welded now, just have to finish weld that and I plan on painting it since some of it is not aluminized. I plan on angle cutting the outlet/tip so it's less likely to get packed full of dirt when backing up. In the picture below you can sort of see the little brackets that mount the middle of this frame to the bottom of the stock subframe. Below you can see where it will bolt into the stock tie down points. You can also kind of see the support running across the middle of the fuel cell. In the last picture you can see how this frame ties into the rear bumper. Also welded a receiver on the bumper. There are some gussets on the backside of the bumper not visible in this picture. Mainly more painting and reassembly left now. I also have all the parts and made most of the brackets and tabs for the front struts, so I'll start on those soon.

Finally have the fuel cell support / diff protection and rear bumper welded, just needs paint. Most other aspects of the fuel system and exhaust are figured out now and mostly done. Should have shocks next week so I can make the front struts and get this thing back on the road (and off).

Good to know, I'll probably leave it all in for now but might wind up doing that.

Made some progress on the back end of the car in the past few weeks. 2" angle iron to support and locate the fuel cell. Plan on at least bolting these to the floor. Thought about welding them to the floor originally but probably won't. Also originally planned on adding two pieces front to rear, one bolted to either side of the fuel cell, but probably won't. Filler tube is about the same level as the angle irons. Plan is to cut some big pieces of foam once we have the other lines in place to put the floor on. I'll just put the stock cardboard and carpet in for now, eventually would have to make something out of sheet metal if we go desert racing. Still have to add a return fitting, probably on the fill plate. Rear bumper was easier to make than I thought it would be. Sticks out farther than the stock steel bumper. Easier to back up to a tree, etc without worrying about blowing out the rear glass. Easier to throw a recovery strap around it too. These side rails stick out a little past the rear fenders and taillights. It's too late to keep the fenders from being dented, but at least should protect the taillights when I slide into a tree. Stock plastic bumper cover fits over it like the front one. Just have to add a few caps, weld, and paint that. I'll probably gusset where the 2" square tubes (that go into the frame rails) come out and connect with the 4" tube. Unfortunately the 3 gallon cell I had wouldn't fit so I got a 1 gallon fuel cell as a surge tank. Mounted a Walbro 255lph pump I had from another project to it. Routed the exhaust over the rear crossmember. Plenty of room for the muffler where the gas tank used to be and not much room where the fuel cell is now. Right now the front of the skid frame attaches to the rear subframe mounts and the rear attaches to the tow hooks. Working on making brackets to connect the middle to the tapped holes by the lateral link mounts on the rear crossmember. Originally had it mounted to the holes near the front of the rear diff in the picture below but got rid of those for a couple reasons. One, we could move it up an inch or so. Two, that normally flexes relative to the rest of the subframe so I'll probably cut the points off those mitered joints for clearance. Probably add some tabs where those mounts are to keep this from bending up too high. Also plan on adding some type of connection(s) from that tube behind the rear diff up to the angle iron under the fuel cell and some support in the middle of the bottom of the fuel cell. Plan on adding a few tubes welded to that tube between the tow hooks and bolted to the rear bumper. How should I finish the exhaust? I thought about a downturn or side dump. Leaning towards angling it down some but have it come short of the angled tubes I plan to add. I've packed the stock exhaust with dirt a bunch of times when going backwards, but it sticks way behind and below the stock steel bumper. Plan on welding a receiver to the bottom of the bumper tube. Departure angle should be slightly better without the hitch, diff should be more protected from backing into things, and lateral link mounts are much better protected. Anybody have a diagram of how all the fuel tank vent hoses connect to the carbon canister, etc?