Sagebum Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 To back up... 08 Legacy Outback Wagon, 2.5 I 4cyl auto trans. 18,000 mi/18 months old While driving up a slight incline at 40 mph, we heard a faint buzzing sound that in 2 seconds turned into a sound like a stick going into a fan which immediately turned into a sound such as a fork/knife/spoon in sink garbage disposer. Very loud, very scary. The key thing here is that it was consistent with engine rpm, not wheel rpm. Pulled over and stopped, opened hood, started engine in Park for 2 seconds. Same garbage disposer sounds from just behind the engine...not in front or around drive belt. Emergency AAA road towed car to Subaru dealer for next day inspection . Next day Subaru mechanic checked a lot of things before starting car but when he did...absolute normal running engine. Test drove 15 minutes. No sound. Can't do anything under warranty and it only cost me $100 to find that out. The mechanic was very cooperative and we talked for about 20 minutes/drove car etc. I talked to an independent Subaru guy and another general mechanic. The general theory from each is that something came loose in the bell housing, perhaps an inspection hole cover plate and fell down and got the @#$!% beat out of it and then fell down out of the way and is now just sitting there. Recommendation is to drive the car and see if any permanent damage shows up. Any thoughts from anyone with knowledge of this? Where would I look for a missing inspection hole cover if that is the problem? If a hole cover is now missing, does that leave the internals of the bell housing exposed to debris/dirt/wear? I want to go beyond the dealer to Subaru with as much info as possible. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Hrmmm. Good news is the car still has a warrenty. Could it have sunded like something came loose, then the car was dragining it, then it finally fell off? Could it be that you picked up some road debree and dragged it? This is an automatic. There is not much there to come loose and be chewed up. There is an inspection cover down there. Its not a biggy if it is missing on an automatic. There is nothing in the bellhousing that this could be. its possible a bolt came loose and got spit out, but even that I wouldnt sweat. Keep all your documentation on this incident just in case it happens again. nipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagebum Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) Thanks The key info is that the noise was consistent with engine rpm not wheel rpm/road speed. Even the Subaru mechanic ruled out anything external. The only exposed part that rotates in direct relation to engine rpm is the drive belt area in front of the engine. The noise was behind and the engine and occurred after we were statioary and in Park. Just trying to be clear. Edited November 21, 2009 by Sagebum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Thanks The key info is that the noise was consistent with engine rpm not wheel rpm/road speed. Even the Subaru mechanic ruled out anything external. The only exposed part that rotates in direct relation to engine rpm is the drive belt area in front of the engine. The noise was behind and below the engine. Just trying to be clear. And the only thing at the back end is the starter drive. Hrmmmm If it happens again, have them pull the starter and inspect it. Sometimes a starter drive can do this, but it would do it constantly, not just once. nipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 On the old EJ22 there's a cover on the top, passenger side of the bell housing, dunno about on the newer engines. I don't see how the starter pinion would make contact with the flywheel unless the kick out solenoid is messed up or something. It might be worth it to remove the starter and do a visual check of the ring gear to see if there is any noticeable damage to the teeth. There is a clip of some sort that goes on the transmission side of the torque converter on older cars. I wonder if something like that might have popped loose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just went through the FSM for both autos and manuals, and there is nothing in there aside from some bolts. If it was a cracked flex plate the noise would always be there. STarter drives do fail sometimes, and sometimes a starter may self engage but that is ver rare, and I am out of theories. nipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just went through the FSM for both autos and manuals, and there is nothing in there aside from some bolts. If it was a cracked flex plate the noise would always be there. STarter drives do fail sometimes, and sometimes a starter may self engage but that is ver rare, and I am out of theories. nipper what if it was a flex plate bolt? i would have thought the dealer would have checked, but...... could a rock or piece of gravel gotten thrown up into the bell housing? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 what if it was a flex plate bolt? i would have thought the dealer would have checked, but...... could a rock or piece of gravel gotten thrown up into the bell housing? . I was thinking that, but that is so rare I would discount that for now. And a cracked flexplate will make a tick noise at idle. Im going with the rock theory for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagebum Posted November 22, 2009 Author Share Posted November 22, 2009 Much appreciation for the ideas...I am taking notes! Eventually I want to go back and talk to the service manager about how to proceed, things you all have mentioned to check. I hope for a simple fix and answer. Right now I have a car we love but are afraid to go out in the middle of Nevada with. How would a rock get in there? Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Much appreciation for the ideas...I am taking notes! Eventually I want to go back and talk to the service manager about how to proceed, things you all have mentioned to check. I hope for a simple fix and answer. Right now I have a car we love but are afraid to go out in the middle of Nevada with. How would a rock get in there? Thanks again. It is very possible there is a flying cover that is usually missing on the bottom of the trans bell housing an the flywheel is exposed. So if I rock is thrown in the area will shoot up and land in various area's till it drops out somehow! I would give it a few WOT runs then some normal hilly driving. See if it does it again. If not have no worries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 No rock big enough to cause all that racket could get past the bell-housing inspection cover. Surely is a strange thing you have experienced. Hope you never hear that again. :-\ GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagebum Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 It was dramatic and loud to say the least. In the case of it happening again, the Sub mechanic said it would be nice if it would do it again and cause big damage so they could find it and go after it. As it is now...it is a mystery. Thanks again for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Yes - hopefully there is catastrophic malfunctory next time. Smoke and flames would be nice as well. Warantee's are designed to cover exactly these types of problems - things overlooked at the factory or design issues. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Sometimes the only way to diagnose a issue is for it to get worse. Just enjoy the car, i have a feeling this will never occure again. nipper PS it is possible that something that was left in the bellhousing during assembly worked it's way loose, like a spacer feeler gauge or a wrench). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 The sound you describe is what our 2001 Forester (97k miles) is making for us now when we turn the key to start her up. But only intermittently. I will be pulling the starter to visually inspect it as soon as I get a warm day. Sounds like some teeth are messed up...on flywheel or on starter. I will report back here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 look for a missig bolt. there is a robber timing plug on the bellhouing, you will see the bolts. turn the crank with a 22mm or 7/8 socket. there will be 4 bolts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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