mikesgold Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 i know if i search and read a million threads i can sort of figure this out but i want a clear concise and quick answer. i have a 1979 wagon ea71 4x4. spun a bearing this last week (most likely). is a ea81 with 4speed d/r transmission a bolt in swap? what years are ideal for donor parts? what parts are needed? i know the ej22 is superior but transmission clearance issue, wiring, brakes, suspension are more than i want to deal with. i know the 5 speed trans is better but i am under the influence that a 4spd will bolt right up to the stock cross member and fit in the stock tunnel. please help, i am hoping to start sourcing parts on saturday of this weekend. thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jibs Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 You will need a transmission from an 1981 ea81 Brat. Thats the only transmission that'll bolt right up but you'll HAVE to get the tranny crossmember from that one specific year brat. Any ea81 will bolt to that transmission. Everything else is going to take some fabrication skills and all that fun stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Actually... The crossmember you need is the engine crossmember. Any 4 speed D/R will bolt to the trans mounts in an EA71 car, BUT you need the shifter levers from a 1981 Brat d/r, they are specific to that year and are the only ones that will work unless you make custom shift levers. You need the engine crossemember and steering rack from an 81 Brat, because the wider bellhousing on the D/R tranny will interfere with the steering linkage on the stock EA71 steering rack. You also need the pitch stopper and bracket from the 81 Brat, or make something custom. Ive done this swap before, so this is information based on real world experience. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jibs Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Well thanks. I didn't realize that the later model trans were wider. I read somewhere that the shift linkages were nearly the same, in the gen 1's they were turned 90* or something. So its possible to put a 5 speed in a gen 1 by using the linkages from the gen 1 trans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Well thanks. I didn't realize that the later model trans were wider. I read somewhere that the shift linkages were nearly the same, in the gen 1's they were turned 90* or something. So its possible to put a 5 speed in a gen 1 by using the linkages from the gen 1 trans? The 4-speed D/Rs are all the same dimensions externally, just the 81-82 D/R have different 3rd and 4th gear ratios than the 83+ 4 speeds, and the 81's have the special shift levers to fit the Gen 1's. All the 4 speed D/R have mounting points for the EA71 trans mounts as well as the EA81 trans mounts, because they all use the same case castings. FYI 81 D/R uses the same trans mounts as the S/R 4 speeds. The 5 Speed D/R's on the other hand are not a bolt-in swap. They are about 9 1/2" shorter than the 4 speeds and do not have the castings for the EA71 trans mounts, have a completely different linkage setup than the 4 speeds, and the case is a lot wider than any 4 speed D/R. You have to make a custom crossmember to make it work and without a lift you will have to do some beating on the trans tunnel to make it clear with no rubbing. I have also swapped a 5 speed D/R into a Brat, but it has 2" lift blocks on the crossmembers, and I welded mounts to the body to use the EA82 tranny crossmember. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesgold Posted February 1, 2010 Author Share Posted February 1, 2010 thanks for the help. its good to hear from people who have done this swap. okay, so any ea81. any 4spd d/r transmission. 1981 brat crossmember+steering rack and associated parts custom shift linkage (or 81 brat) custom pitch stop (or 81 brat) what about electrical and vaccum? whats the best year ea81 and what year trans to look for? what are common problems to look out for while junkyarding these parts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 Things to look out for at the junkyard, in the tranny you want to make sure it goes into gear nicely, the problem with the 4 speeds is the synchros for 3rd and reverse commonly fail, but you wont usually be able to tell until you drive the tranny. Excessive shifter slop isnt an issue, that is an easy, easy fix covered in the USRM. Also make sure there is no shaft play on the input shaft, and as little as possible on the front diff stubs, you dont want to take one of these trannies apart, they are somewhat complex and stupid, and you need special tools to disassemble them and put them back together right. If you plan on lifting your rig and running big tires you want an 81 tranny, for the lower 3rd and 4th gears will make it easier to run big tires on the highway. If you are staying with stock tires, the 85 and later 4 speeds have a much higher 4th gear ratio ideal for highway cruising. As for the motor, just make sure it turns over and has good compression, and theres no water in the oil. If all that is good, then the engine is probably good. The wiring is the same unless you have a points distributor in your car right now. If you have points you will have to convert the car to electronic ignition to work with the electronic disty on the EA81, which is really just unplug the points ignition module and plug in the electronic disty. Vacuum lines and EGR and emmisions equipment is all up to you, you can re-do and remove a LOT of stuff, unless you have emmissions testing and inspections, but all the stock equipment will work just fine in the EA71 engine bay. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesgold Posted February 2, 2010 Author Share Posted February 2, 2010 sounds good, this is really helping. everything seems simple and straightforward. i am, however, having a hard time finding a 1981 brat to give up its guts. i am wondering if the later ea81 crossmembers could be made to work by using lift blocks with the bottom holes drilled for later crossmember. will all the stock steering and suspension parts bolt to the later ea81 crossmember? or is this insane? i know i can find ea81 crossmembers. or....is it possible to modify ea71 crossmember to clear the newer engine and trans? i have access to welder, grinder, hammer. i am not opposed to lifting this vehicle. also ea81 hydraulic lifters? better or worse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 IIRC, EA81 crossmembers are something like 1 1/2" wider than the Brat crossmembers. But with a lift, if could be made to fit quite easily. Another option, as Earl suggested in the Wanted thread, is to grind enough material off the bellhousing so that it clears the EA71 steering components. The EA81's from 1985 and later had Hydraulic lifters, which at this age typically need to be rebuilt or replaced, or they will drive you insane with the TOD. 1981-1984 were solid lifters, and 1984 EA81's with automatics were as well. The Hydraulic lifter motors also had larger valves than the early solid lifter motors, and were rated at slightly more HP. Best part about them is you dont have to split the block to change the hydro lifters, they drop right out the bottom when you take off the oil pan and rocker assemblies, so replacing them is not an issue. Then you never have to worry about adjusting them -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 IIRC, EA81 crossmembers are something like 1 1/2" wider than the Brat crossmembers. But with a lift, if could be made to fit quite easily. Another option, as Earl suggested in the Wanted thread, is to grind enough material off the bellhousing so that it clears the EA71 steering components. The EA81's from 1985 and later had Hydraulic lifters, which at this age typically need to be rebuilt or replaced, or they will drive you insane with the TOD. 1981-1984 were solid lifters, and 1984 EA81's with automatics were as well. The Hydraulic lifter motors also had larger valves than the early solid lifter motors, and were rated at slightly more HP. Best part about them is you dont have to split the block to change the hydro lifters, they drop right out the bottom when you take off the oil pan and rocker assemblies, so replacing them is not an issue. Then you never have to worry about adjusting them -Bill A wealth of good info there Bill. I am sure you know you're stuff. I have to wander excatly how the statement above in red is suppossed to be read. Possibly reverse of what I am reading? At any rate to clarify, it is the 84 Automatic trans EA81s that have the hydraulic lifters that year. My black 84 Auto 4wd sedan has hydro lifters, my lifted 84 4spd d/r wagon came with a solid lifter motor. 83 and earlier = solid lifter, all 85 and later = hydro lifter, all Just details, don't let me hijack. Good luck to you Mikesgold. Hey Bill? any details or external clies that would make for identification of an 81 brat as opposed to a 79 or 80? I know a guy who's got a couple of total rustbucket 1st gens with no titles.......bout the on;y thing you could part from them would be a crossmember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 A wealth of good info there Bill. I am sure you know you're stuff. I have to wander excatly how the statement above in red is suppossed to be read. Possibly reverse of what I am reading? At any rate to clarify, it is the 84 Automatic trans EA81s that have the hydraulic lifters that year. My black 84 Auto 4wd sedan has hydro lifters, my lifted 84 4spd d/r wagon came with a solid lifter motor. 83 and earlier = solid lifter, all 85 and later = hydro lifter, all Just details, don't let me hijack. Good luck to you Mikesgold. Hey Bill? any details or external clies that would make for identification of an 81 brat as opposed to a 79 or 80? I know a guy who's got a couple of total rustbucket 1st gens with no titles.......bout the on;y thing you could part from them would be a crossmember. Nice catch on the red, I meant to type "were Hydro as well" But I must have forgotten (I was eating at the time, so technically I was pre-occupied...) As for ID'ing a 81 Brat, the only real obvious way to tell is to look under the hood... They look exactly the same from the outside. Other little things about them are different (one-year-only clutch cable, different throttle cable from the 78-79's, obviously a "lo" position on the 4wd selector, usually had a tachometer) but nothing on the exterior. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Nice catch on the red, I meant to type "were Hydro as well" But I must have forgotten (I was eating at the time, so technically I was pre-occupied...) As for ID'ing a 81 Brat, the only real obvious way to tell is to look under the hood... They look exactly the same from the outside. Other little things about them are different (one-year-only clutch cable, different throttle cable from the 78-79's, obviously a "lo" position on the 4wd selector, usually had a tachometer) but nothing on the exterior. -Bill Were all 81 Brats D/R? if so neither of the ones i saw are 81s. One of them had a tach though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oxbrain Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I'm going to be starting this same swap soon on my 78 brat. What is involved in modifying the shift linkage? I haven't seen what it looks like on the ea81 cars to know the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesgold Posted February 3, 2010 Author Share Posted February 3, 2010 im also interested in what will need to be done to the shifting linkage. gonna grind the bellhousing and run stock steering. is there any benefit to solid vs. hydraulic lifters if i use my ea71 pistons, milled heads, ported polished and torque grind cam on the ea81? are these mods detrimental to using low octane gas, stock carb, and reliabilty? i owe you guys a 12 pack already. im racking up beer debt to everyone on here. thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 Were all 81 Brats D/R? if so neither of the ones i saw are 81s. One of them had a tach though. IIRC, the 1600 DL (2 big headlights, vs. GL-4 headlights) was still available, which would still have the 1600 and S/R 4wd. But dont quote me on that... im also interested in what will need to be done to the shifting linkage. gonna grind the bellhousing and run stock steering. is there any benefit to solid vs. hydraulic lifters if i use my ea71 pistons, milled heads, ported polished and torque grind cam on the ea81? are these mods detrimental to using low octane gas, stock carb, and reliabilty? i owe you guys a 12 pack already. im racking up beer debt to everyone on here. thanks. Using the EA71 pistons and decked heads will get you somewhere between 9.5:1 and 10:1 compression, I would recomend using at least Super Unleaded, but regular would prolly be ok as long as you dont detect any detonating. Ive heard it is quite a peppy motor with those mods, something like a 50%+ gain in power and torque over stock -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 I'm going to be starting this same swap soon on my 78 brat. What is involved in modifying the shift linkage? I haven't seen what it looks like on the ea81 cars to know the difference. The gear selector lever on the D/R 4 speeds is a bit different from the setup on the Brat single range trannies, and the only year there was a crossover was the 81 Brat. In essence, if you cant find the 81 Brat shift levers, you can bolt the stock 4wd selector assembly to the D/R trans, but you will have to modify the gearshift lever, it needs to be bent to a different angle in a couple spots, so that the lever moves about 3/4" forward over the shifter bushing. Its hard to explain, I will try to take some pictures of the ones I have, though I have modified mine to work with a 4" lift, you will still see what I mean. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oxbrain Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 To be clear, we're talking about the 4wd selector or the 4spd shifter? Bending, cutting, and welding I can handle, as long as I'm not fabricating any complex linkage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 3, 2010 Share Posted February 3, 2010 To be clear, we're talking about the 4wd selector or the 4spd shifter? Bending, cutting, and welding I can handle, as long as I'm not fabricating any complex linkage. The 4 speed shifter (gear selector) is the one you will need to modify. The Brat 4wd selector will bolt directly onto the 4 speed D/R, you will just need to also swap the ball joint from the 4wd rod on the S/R tranny onto the D/R, IIRC. I'll look at that closer today. Either way, there is no linkage really at all to mess with. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 '83+ automatic's (including turbo) and all '85+ EA81's are hydro. I have an '83 automatic/coupe engine in my lifted wagon that's hydro. I have NEVER seen one with TOD. I own three personally and have worked on many, many more. EA81 hydro lifters just don't tick unless the engine has been abused or something. They are not the finicky things that EA82's have. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 '83+ automatic's (including turbo) and all '85+ EA81's are hydro. I have an '83 automatic/coupe engine in my lifted wagon that's hydro. I have NEVER seen one with TOD. I own three personally and have worked on many, many more. EA81 hydro lifters just don't tick unless the engine has been abused or something. They are not the finicky things that EA82's have. GD every hydro motor Ive ever had had tick of death something horrible, but they were high mileage engines, and with very questionable pasts.... I know of a couple others that tick like that as well.... -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesgold Posted February 8, 2010 Author Share Posted February 8, 2010 okay, im hunting for a nice solid ea81 and trans right now. wondering how hard it would be to adapt spfi to the ea81 in the ea71. read all of this... http://home.comcast.net/~trilinear/EA81_SPFI.html and i am wondering a few things. will the ea71 fuse box work with ea82 spfi system? will the ea71 gas tank work or could it be adapted? and would this mod be worth the trouble given the modifications i am planning for the ea81 (cam, decked heads, higher compression)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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