Splinter Posted April 8, 2010 Share Posted April 8, 2010 Playing around in the shop over the last couple days I built myself a 90 amp GM alternator that is a DIRECT bolt in for my 83 Brat. No custom brackets, no wiring, nadda. It can be built in single wire or with a factory plug, so you can retain your dash light etc I can get parts to build more of these, would anyone be interested, and at what sort of prices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted April 8, 2010 Share Posted April 8, 2010 Why? The Nissan Maxima alts are already 90A and basically the same price new as the GM units - they don't require any modification other than changing the pulley - they have the same dimensions as the stock alts and the wireing also plugs in. Now - if you were doing 120+ amp units - it might make more sense. But not for a 90. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Playing around in the shop over the last couple days I built myself a 90 amp GM alternator that is a DIRECT bolt in for my 83 Brat. No custom brackets, no wiring, nadda. It can be built in single wire or with a factory plug, so you can retain your dash light etc I can get parts to build more of these, would anyone be interested, and at what sort of prices? I'd be interested in what you found out...if you "built" it, how is it a direct bolt in? Not sure where maxima alts are so plentiful tho....not in the yards in my neck tho...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Well there's a few reasons. 1. The Delco 12SI is a really robust alternator, it'll do 90 amps indefinitely. The maxima alternator will burn out after around 10 minutes of pushing 90 amps 2. For an offroader, the Delco makes a lot more sense because it can be taken apart and repaired in the field. There's no soldering or crimping to be done. A few (common) spare parts in the glovebox, and you're safe. 3. Single wire operation for people like me, who hate any wiring beyond that which is absolutely necessary 4. Apart from the actual casing, parts are available everywhere, cheap, and always will be. But if people aren't interested, then they're not interested. I'm not trying to push this on anyone, just sharing something I found. Here's a couple pics anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 I'd be interested in what you found out...if you "built" it, how is it a direct bolt in? You couldn't go to your local NAPA and buy one of these, but if I built a few of them, they can be directly installed onto, AFAIK, any 82-89 Subaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 You couldn't go to your local NAPA and buy one of these, but if I built a few of them, they can be directly installed onto, AFAIK, any 82-89 Subaru Ok, once you modify it because you have to, it is no longer a "direct bolt in" If I can't get it at NAPA or a salvage yard and bolt up, then.... Still nice, just not bolt in IMO... :-\ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Still nice, just not bolt in IMO... :-\ How is it not a bolt in? I send it to you, you remove your old alternator, and you put this one on. No custom brackets, no splicing of wires, no swapping pulleys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 You couldn't go to your local NAPA and buy one of these Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Maybe you have a mod that is a direct bolt in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Maybe you have a mod that is a direct bolt in? I think you and I have different definitions of bolt on. To me, 'bolt on' means something that you bolt on. Not sure what it means to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 I think you and I have different definitions of bolt on. To me, 'bolt on' means something that you bolt on. Not sure what it means to you. To me it means that I can buy the replacement anywhere and bolt it on direct without any modifications. So if you have to modify a factory part to make it a bolt on, then to me, it is no longer a direct bolt on. If I add your modified alt to my car, then give it to my daughter who then has a failure of said part, and she is not able to buy a direct replacement, then...it is not a "direct bolt on" IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 To me it means that I can buy the replacement anywhere and bolt it on direct without any modifications. So if you have to modify a factory part to make it a bolt on, then to me, it is no longer a direct bolt on. If I add your modified alt to my car, then give it to my daughter who then has a failure of said part, and she is not able to buy a direct replacement, then...it is not a "direct bolt on" IMO Well your opinion differs from the rest of the automotive community. A bolt on has nothing to do with where you purchased it, only that you can install it without modifying anything on your car. And if your scenario came true, she COULD buy a direct replacement: The original hitachi alternator could be purchased and installed. Nothing has been modified on the car. By your logic, any aftermarket part isn't a bolt on. Is a K&N air intake a bolt on? Not according to you. According to everyone else, very much so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 I agree with both of you to an extent. Yes it's a bolt on - but the key for asis and for a lot of folks like myself is that it's not a bolt-on from a "major supply chain". IE - if you dissapear and no one replaces you in building these alts then your choices for replacement are either to rebuild it or to find someone that can build another one like it. The single-wire setup is a bad choice for anything that has much in the way of accesories - the remote sensor is there to insure there is no voltage drop at the main junction and the charge indicator lamp is very useful in indicating a problem with the VR. I would reccomend the three-wire optionfor anyone running one of these in a Subaru and the GM alts are already setup the same as the stock Subaru wiring anyway. As for the availibilty concern - either the GM or the Maxima alt can be had in a matter of a day or two at about the same price for the 90's through any of the major auto parts chains. In either case the original Hitachi can be used as a temporary spare in case of failure since both of them bolt on. It's down to a preference thing really. I prefer the Maxima alt personally for a simple, bolt-in solution to the weak 55 amp units on the car. Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Well your opinion differs from the rest of the automotive community. Now this forum is HARDLY "the" automotive comunity, and I disagree. A bolt on has nothing to do with where you purchased it, only that you can install it without modifying anything on your car. Correct, it does not depend on where you buy it, only if it will bolt up without being modified, will any warranty be supported at any other outlet? And if your scenario came true, she COULD buy a direct replacement: The original hitachi alternator could be purchased and installed. Nothing has been modified on the car. No mods to the car is a good thing no doubt, still a direct replacement is not available through common outlets. By your logic, any aftermarket part isn't a bolt on. Is a K&N air intake a bolt on? Not according to you. According to everyone else, very much so. No it is not a "direct" bolt on in most cases, from my experience, however once done, you can buy a "direct" replacement filter if need be. We can bantor this all night and I promise you I can find more examples of your explanation being less correct than mine...we can get into Federal Aviation Regulations and such if you really want some discreet explanations of mods, replacements, repairs, overhaul, rebuild, refurbish.......etc. It gets in depth I can assure you...but I think it will only detract from your efforts and I really don't care to bantor. Now if you just want to offer your find and not share any info, then by all means perhaps you should seek a patent Good luck, and oh ya, thanks for the joust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 There's nothing I can offer that would be of use to anyone who isn't an electrical rebuilder in Canada. It's not a standard production casing, it was something created by a Canadian alternator company in the 90s as a direct replacement because they thought it would be cheaper than trying to manufacture the Hitachi units. They don't sell component parts to retail customers, so not even a part number would do you any good. The casing is different, but all the internals are completely standard Delco 12SI parts. Unless you crack your casing, it should be rebuildable til the end of time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 There's nothing I can offer that would be of use to anyone who isn't an electrical rebuilder in Canada. It's not a standard production casing, it was something created by a Canadian alternator company in the 90s as a direct replacement because they thought it would be cheaper than trying to manufacture the Hitachi units. They don't sell component parts to retail customers, so not even a part number would do you any good. The casing is different, but all the internals are completely standard Delco 12SI parts. Unless you crack your casing, it should be rebuildable til the end of time Awesome! Thanks. If or should I have the need, I will keep you in mind for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 I agree with both of you to an extent. Yes it's a bolt on - but the key for asis and for a lot of folks like myself is that it's not a bolt-on from a "major supply chain". IE - if you dissapear and no one replaces you in building these alts then your choices for replacement are either to rebuild it or to find someone that can build another one like it. The single-wire setup is a bad choice for anything that has much in the way of accesories - the remote sensor is there to insure there is no voltage drop at the main junction and the charge indicator lamp is very useful in indicating a problem with the VR. I would reccomend the three-wire optionfor anyone running one of these in a Subaru and the GM alts are already setup the same as the stock Subaru wiring anyway. As for the availibilty concern - either the GM or the Maxima alt can be had in a matter of a day or two at about the same price for the 90's through any of the major auto parts chains. In either case the original Hitachi can be used as a temporary spare in case of failure since both of them bolt on. It's down to a preference thing really. I prefer the Maxima alt personally for a simple, bolt-in solution to the weak 55 amp units on the car. Rick Great input Rick and thanks. Sure hope I did not detract from the work Splinter has put into this, or the benefit some may find in it we can split hairs on descrip, but hey, when in need, make it work, and I agree Splinter may well have...so. Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asis Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Well there's a few reasons.1. The Delco 12SI is a really robust alternator, it'll do 90 amps indefinitely. The maxima alternator will burn out after around 10 minutes of pushing 90 amps 2. For an offroader, the Delco makes a lot more sense because it can be taken apart and repaired in the field. There's no soldering or crimping to be done. A few (common) spare parts in the glovebox, and you're safe. 3. Single wire operation for people like me, who hate any wiring beyond that which is absolutely necessary 4. Apart from the actual casing, parts are available everywhere, cheap, and always will be. But if people aren't interested, then they're not interested. I'm not trying to push this on anyone, just sharing something I found. Here's a couple pics anyway Dude?!?! Is that an aresol can laying next to the alt in at least two of those pics???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Dude?!?! Is that an aresol can laying next to the alt in at least two of those pics???? Penetrating lubricant, an essential when working on old cars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eulogious Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Ok, so I am trying to figure this out and nail down why one would want to go this route compared to the nissan route. From what you have said, if I were to purchase this alternator from you, all it is is a delco alternator stuffed into a "special" case. So if it fails, I could just "swap" parts from an appropriate delco alternator without to much hassle? So basically I would be just buying the special case from you already stuffed with new alternator goodies. Am I correct on this? Also could you use the three wire setup that is already in the car for this? I really don't want to modify the wiring in my car that much, so if I could use the exsisting wiring, that would be ideal. I have been toying with the idea of replacing my alt with a bigger one, so this might be a good way to go since the delco stuff will always be available, and for most likely cheap as well. Could you stuff bigger internals into it as well? Say I go with the 90amp and then find out later I need 120amps, could I stuff 120amp parts into the housing with little effort, or is that out of the question? I like the idea of being able to use readily available parts to repair your own alt, without having to actually go buy a whole new alt. This would also be sweet if you could "upgrade" your amps if you need to. I would go this route for sure if I could "upgrade" the amps in the future if needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivantruckman Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 (edited) delco alternators rock. you can rebuild them cheap, all internal parts bolt together, no soldering . there durable as hell. most people that have the skills to rebuild them also have the skills to modify the case to fit there cars. thats a very cool case however. i cant seem to find a 80s nissan here in the detroit area. but i can get tons of 10 si units for cheap http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Delco-Remy-10-SI-Alternator-Rebuild-Kit-70-Amp_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem518bbed497QQitemZ350236890263QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories Edited April 9, 2010 by ivantruckman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Ok, so I am trying to figure this out and nail down why one would want to go this route compared to the nissan route. From what you have said, if I were to purchase this alternator from you, all it is is a delco alternator stuffed into a "special" case. So if it fails, I could just "swap" parts from an appropriate delco alternator without to much hassle? So basically I would be just buying the special case from you already stuffed with new alternator goodies. Am I correct on this? Correct, and there is high-amperage components out there for it, I personally don't feel comfortable using them, and I don't think they're necessary for 99% of people (90amps @ 14v = 1260watts, what are you running that needs that??) But if you were to buy a high amp rotor/stator for a delco 12si, it'd pop straight into this case. What are people paying for new Maxima alternators? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eulogious Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 Correct, and there is high-amperage components out there for it, I personally don't feel comfortable using them, and I don't think they're necessary for 99% of people (90amps @ 14v = 1260watts, what are you running that needs that??) But if you were to buy a high amp rotor/stator for a delco 12si, it'd pop straight into this case. What are people paying for new Maxima alternators? I am not saying I am running anything that would take more than that, but I could see myself running serveral sets of 100 watt off road lights, along with a decent stereo w/subs and such, and a winch, so I could POSSIBLY need more than that at any given time. I don't think I ever would, but I might. I personally like to keep my options open, and being able to upgrade if I want to by just buying "off the shelf" parts and stuffing them into my alt is an awesome option. I would take this over the nissan just because of that. I believe GD charges about $100 for an alt that is ready to go, but you would have to check with him to make sure about that. Is the three plug an option with these? That would be my only hold back on going this route is not having a three plug option. I would think it would be straight forward to make a three plug fit, but IDK.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splinter Posted April 9, 2010 Author Share Posted April 9, 2010 Yes it is I'll figure out if I can put one of these together for 100 bucks or not today It's somewhat doubtful, since I'd be using all brand new parts (nothing reclaimed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eulogious Posted April 9, 2010 Share Posted April 9, 2010 I just wanted to point out that I am not interested at this exact moment, but I am interested in this for an option when I do need an alt. So dont' hurry on my behalf! I wish I had the money for this now, but I got to many things in the pipe line to be able to do it now I would say though that if you were to make a couple of them, I am sure that someone would by them from you for sure! I know that if my alt craps out soon, I will be contacting you for my replacement. How many of these do you have access to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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