Electrical struggles... bad switch?

[rainman19154]

Thanks in advance for any help ya'll can give. You guys have been great in the past ... I'm really in need now!!

 

I will try to be concise but cover all possible points of interest.

 

1995 Legacy AT AWD 2.2L

 

Car has been fine. All systems normal.

After work Tues, no start. Seeming dead battery. Called for a tow.

 

No response to a jump start... same click. click. dimming display.

 

Checked and cleaned all main connections... Battery terminals, ground near starter, and the main starter connection.

 

Left on charger overnight. Same. click click dimming display.

 

 

Key in Accessory position, all seems ok. Radio works. Dome light bright.

 

Key in "on", normal dash display, radio works.

 

Key in "start", displays go blank or dim, radio cuts out all together.

 

Return to "on", displays return, after some seconds, radio returns.

 

 

Switch came under suspicion only because I read reference to it here.

But no wiggling n jiggling had any effect. Pretty stable in how it acts n feels.

 

Took starter to Pep Boys... tested bad on "chatter time" (whatever that is)

but it did run. I replaced it anyway.

That was last night, 9 pm. Came home and called it a day.

 

Today, 4 pm, I put the replacement starter in... now i get no power at the switch. The dome light works. Hmmm - haven't tried the horn fwiw.

After being off the charger about 24 hours, the battery reads 13v.

 

I'm gonna take it to get tested but I'm back to suspecting the switch.

 

 

Whats involved in swapping out the ignition switch?

Any posts here that give any breakdown on it?

 

Will I end up with a new key?

This means I'll have the original key for the doors and a new key that just

fits the ignition?

 

 

And am I off base suspecting the switch?

I did pull the washer resevoir and unbolt that main fuse box, curious if I'd find a meltdown underneath there but it all looked ok. Its bolted back in place.

Edited June 3, 2010 by rainman19154
added info

[Cougar]

The trouble you are having appears to be due to a bad connection in the main power bus. I would first make sure the fusible links are ok if you have them. If they are ok then you need to check the power getting to and past the ignition switch. You should use a voltmeter to check with but a test light should work also. Along with the power bus leads also check the grounding to the chassis.

 

When the ignition switch is in the START mode some things are normally disconnected from power. So some of the things you mentioned turn off anyways.

[Old Pearl]

A switch sounds like a logical fix. If you replace the switch you will not have a new key (it will still use the old key) Only if you replace the tumbler will you have a new key. I have replaced a few ignition switches in the past and it is not very difficult. You need to remove all the plastic around the steering wheel and then you will see the switch and how it is attached to the back of the tumbler. You will also see a plug where the switch is attached to. Here are a few other tests I would try...... I would bet that option 3 is most likely the issue due to it being intermittent.

 

1) Get out your Volt or Multimeter. Find the starter and test the main power straight from the battery (the big cable) using the bell housing as a ground. If that is fine then find the solenoid power wire (it will be small and most likely have a push on connecter) Test for power with the key turned to the start position.....if you have a helper this will be easy, if not then you will need to wedge or attach the positive lead of the connector to the solenoid power wire and find a suitable negative area to wedge the negative lead (neg of battery) then put the volt meter at the base of the wind shield and turn the key while watching the meter. You can pull the wire from the starter so that you don’t have it turn over and cut off a hand or something. If you have power then the starter is bad. If not then it is either the switch or the wire to the starter solenoid.

 

2)Next you can find the switch. Using a wire diagram you can locate the starter solenoid wire, positive hot wire, neg wire, ect. Check to see if the Hot indeed has power (I am going to assume it does because the instrument lights ect work) Then put the negative lead to the ground and the positive lead to the start and then turning the key to start you can test to see if the switch provides power when the switch is turned into the start position. In the past I have replaced switches only to determine that the wire to the starter solenoid was faulty or the NSS was worn out.

 

3) Depending on whether the car is an auto or stick it will have a NSS (Neutral Safety Switch) at the clutch pedal if a stick or the auto shifter if auto. The switch will only allow power to the starter if the clutch is depress or the trans is in Park or Neutral. If this switch is faulty then the car will think it is in gear if an automatic or the clutch is not depressed if it is a stick and will NOT supply power to the starter. A quick test would be to take a jumper wire and complete the circuit at the switch and try to start the car. This is most likely the problem.

[Fairtax4me]

I don't see any suggestions that the battery may be to blame, so I'll throw it out there. A dead/failing cell will still allow the battery to read 12V+ but will not be able to provide the amps needed to engage the starter. Honestly, I'd have the battery tested first, (start simple) but you can do it after poking around at the ignition switch if you want.

 

Of course that doesn't explain why it wouldn't start when being jumped, but I've had plenty of fun jump starting cars at work (you'd be surprised how many brand new cars end up getting new batteries before they're ever even purchased). Proper connection is key when jump starting. I've done several where the car still would not turn over even with a fully charged booster pack, only to move the ground cable to a different location and then have it work.

[rainman19154]

As it turns out it was the battery.

 

I did replace the starter as I mentioned and the ignition switch as well.

I got the same symptons. Battery showing a usefull voltage but as soon as a strong load was applied, all went dark.

A jump was ineffective.

 

After 24 hours on the charger, the battery showed initially 14v. Over the next two days, while completely disconnected, the reading deteriorated to 12v. I took it in for testing and it failed.

I put a new battery in and the car started right up. That was three days ago and it has continued to be just fine.

 

 

Years ago, I ran into the same thing. When this battery went south, it became like a huge blackhole, consuming all power but giving none out. Dunno if it was a short between the plates from sediment built up in the bottom of the case, or something else.

Anyway... all good now.