Guide me o great subugurus! New to me 78 DL 4X4

[Nubaru]

We own a wrx and i have been wanting to have a project subi for some time. Also daily driver hopefully soon. I found it for 300 bucks in a local trade paper. Saw it and knew the parts alone would be worth twice what he was asking. Perfect buy i think. I will have pics up soon. Havent had much time with the car since i bought it. I am a shadetree mechanic and generaly know cars. But i'm sure i'll have quesions, and if there's anywhere to ask questions, this has to be the place. Pleasent community at that. =D

 

The history is it has been setting under a tree for a year and is very dirty and stayed wet i assume. Some rust but nothing too bad, Havent fully looked under the car, but looks decent and minimal rust at a glance. The engine looks good and ran last summer when they parked it. It ran when primed, the gas that went to the filter was very dirty and fuel system flush is high on the priority list. It may run good shortly after. the engine looks pretty clean on top, but there is some seepage or messy oil filling on the crossmember.

 

I will have all day sunday to check it out.

 

 

So, the first bit of advice i seek is,

 

1- What to look for? any secret rust spots that kill the car? there was some bubble on the frame that worried me. I want eventual spray bedliner on the bottom 1/2, but it's not cheap. How should i stop the rust for now? sandpaper and primer?

 

2- What do i have here?, i know it's a top starter ea71, can i get enough hp/torque to spin 195/r14 tires (smallest bfg all terrain), and how much lift to make them fit? Is it easily accomplished?

 

The general plan is a lifted knobby tired forest buggy. That i can still drive to work. Thanks for any advice, i have a million questions and am very excited to have found this car!

[ecky]

Welcome,

 

Major rust spots I have noticed would be tops of the front fenders, and around the rear lift gate. (or at least on my '77 and '80) Lifting a first gen is do-able, but more common w/EA 81 second gen cars. You WILL have trouble finding 14" wheels to fit your 4x140 lug pattern unless you have them already. (Check out the wheel page)

 

I paid $175 for my '77 4wd that had been parked for ~5 years. Drove it for three years and grew very fond of the EA71 as it seems to be a little snappier then the EA81

 

Best o' luck w/ your project.

[SUBARU3]

Look inside at the VERY top of the inner wheel wells. Inside the car..... Where the cowl, firewall and the inner wheel well come together. Both sides. Pull back the insulations and the wheel well vinyl trim.

 

Todd

[Nubaru]

Thanks for those tips. I will check there, going to start striping it tomorrow. Guy at advance said he had some rust killer spray. So i'm going to clean it up real good with a wire brush, fill in the holes, and get a couple cans of bedliner for the bottom 1/2. and forget it ever rusted. So question #1 for today.. is that a good plan?

 

I got to look around real good tonight under the front of the car, ran the engine some. It ran on a single cil, and it moved a little, about 200 ft up the driveway, it's got heart lol. Gears and clutch seem good, shifts into 4wd. Got some lights to work.

 

I am going to replace the plugs tomorrow and see about a compression, i think i can rent one from autozone. The oil pan gasket is obvious and the right valve cover is seeping a little. The headgaskets have been replaced, somewhat recently i would say and seem solid but messy. No oil in the radiator, no milkshake, no smoke, yet. Question #2... Plugs, timeing, points, what else could it be? See how plugs go tomorrow i guess. And i'm researching timeing before bed.

 

Still working on tracking my camera down.

 

Thanks again for advice. This has been a lot of fun so far.

[hatchsub]

Thanks for those tips. I will check there, going to start striping it tomorrow. Guy at advance said he had some rust killer spray. So i'm going to clean it up real good with a wire brush, fill in the holes, and get a couple cans of bedliner for the bottom 1/2. and forget it ever rusted. So question #1 for today.. is that a good plan?

 

 

 

 

Still working on tracking my camera down.

 

Thanks again for advice. This has been a lot of fun so far.

 

It will be alright short term but eventually the rust will show up again and if its under bedliner you wont know until its too late. My best advice is to find someone with some welding skills or learn to weld yourself. You can patch it with bondo and fiberglass and have it look ok for a year or two but eventually it will rot out worse than before. Once rust is there its a devil to get rid of. Oh and the rust converting spray never really works in my experience.

[Nubaru]

So today i...

 

Opened the back hatch! and got the button working =D

 

All lights but the low beams work on their own now!

 

New ngk plugs, proper gap, sparks good, fuel pump is a champ, new line from the under hood jug tank to carb, still runs like crap. It only runs when feeding it starter fluid.. soo.. pulled the carb to put a 20 dollar rebuild kit in it (in process).

 

Compression test too, 120 psi all cil. She's good to go i guess after carb rebuild?

 

So some stuff i'm looking for is.

 

1- General info on how to retime it, where to drop dist, which cil is which, fire order? Links are great, i just cant find much on the subject. (ea71). I want to clean it up and paint it, replace a couple gaskets. So i will need a full retime.

 

2- It has the vaccum hose pattern under the hood, but i have no ac (anymore). And it's had so much retubeing and caping it's just a mess. What does what and goes where? I have tube to rerun it after the quick motor pull. Just need a senseable diagram.

 

3- Under hood wire diagram. or one for the car in general.

 

I realise that these things are found in service manuals and haynes books. But i have to keep it on the cheap. And geting it runing is takeing priority. If anyone has these in books and has a scanner it would be awesome, or proper links (i have looked). Thanks again for the info and advice!

[Nubaru]

I am takeing the advice aginst the bed liner for now (thanks hatch), cleaning all rust off and spray painting to protect, sand paper and wire brush for me. thanks for the tip, i plan to keep it for a while. I hear my ea71 is a mechanical tank.

 

i cleaned the carb and took the 2 bolts off the bottom of the float tank, corroded and filthy inside. It made me able to blow through it freely after cleaning them. Going to slap it back on the intake tomorrow and see if it works any better.

[biffanyus]

Sounds like its coming along pretty well.. Please post pics soon..

[Nubaru]

Finaly got some pics. I have been busy with various things, both car related and not. Anyway here she is..

 

 

 

i'll have some more pics and questions later tonight.

[biffanyus]

Very nice!!

[Nubaru]

My engine looks good for now, minus needing a new carb real bad. Havent gotten to run it for long, but it looked clean in every port i could see in. The rear main seal my be leaking, some oil in the bellhouseing on the engine side. But the oil pan gasket was a gusher, so it creeped up the motor everywhere i think. Have to run it to see if i have more leaks.

 

 

I have to retime it anyway.

 

 

 

So the big question i have here is.. I'm going nowhere without another carb and the rebuild is too much and too risky (might be trash). It may sit for a couple weeks while i get a weber with the intake manifold exposed. How do i stop the rust in the cilinder, it rains all the time it seems. Is my motor even in danger?. i refilled it with oil and new filter.

 

On that note.. anyone have a cheap working weber? or even a cheap hitachi that would work? just need to get it running.

[Nubaru]

And on too rust...

 

Driver side front wheel well through to wiper fluid jug.

 

 

 

It was raining today and it's obviously leaking inside.. the passenger side is similar but not as bad. Mostly mud and rot in the floorboard.. going to clear that out at a car wash whenever i find a carb.

 

 

and.. i'm worried about the hatch latch :/ alot of that is bondo'd already.

 

 

 

Saw a welder on e-bay for $120 and i have a neon i can butcher.. (i plan on trying to get the seats to mount in). But the welder is months away i think..

[84gl]

I've got a stock carb come you can have for 20 bucks or so and it runs come and get it

Edited August 18, 2010 by 84gl

[Nubaru]

Thanks a million for the carb 84GL. It mounted right up, now to see if i can get her to run. Proably going to work on that more tomorrow night.

 

You hit me with a ton of info fast, you know your subarus i'll give ya that =D. But i'm for sure interested in how you minimized all of that vaccume tubeing and wireing under the hood. I want to do the same, as few wires and tubes as possible.

 

As far as the junkyard trips go, i'd be in for that indeed. Just need a week notice to ask off from work.

 

Thanks again 84 it was a pleasure to meet a guru and hope to do some junk runnin soon.

[84gl]

get that carb hooked up and running yet?

[SUBARU3]

Just a few observations:

 

That is not the original engine. It is a later EA71/fatcase version with the flywheel cover from the original engine. Also the oil fill is an indicator of that. No big deal though. Still great engine!

 

The rust at the hood cable is a problem, caused by the rubber seal not being seated correctly. Water get and soaks the insulation on the underside and the next thing is that. Very common.

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10028&highlight=hood+cable+rubber

 

 

Todd

Edited August 20, 2010 by SUBARU3

[Nubaru]

a few issues with it, or should i say with my knowledge lol. And i havent had much time to work on it, it's on the manifold and 1/2 way hooked up.. Sunday i have all day again.

 

so my troubles..

 

Vaccume hoses... ugh.. going to delete the entire egr system sunday. The soup can cap for where the egr mounts i have figgured out pretty well.

 

After that, do i just remove all of the hose and cap everything off? (canister included)

 

I know the vac advance on the dist needs to operate, and the retard left to breath. (as per GD post on the subject). Other than that i guess it's all plug/removeable. On that note.. where is that dist vac advance supposed to plug into?

 

I have tried to search for this info on usmb and google to save asking. If i missed a good write up some where, links rock. But the info i find is in bits and pieces and hard to put together with what i know. (more everyday)

 

Need a good link to the "quarter trick" too.

 

Next issue is my air cleaner is not fitting great.. but i can work that out i think.

 

Final issue before i can even start it is the throttle cable isnt lined up right.. that i can get figgued out sunday tho..

 

just need that next day off =D

 

I know it will work, just have to figgure it out lol.

 

Thanks again 84!

[Nubaru]

Just a few observations:

 

That is not the original engine. It is a later EA71/fatcase version with the flywheel cover from the original engine. Also the oil fill is an indicator of that. No big deal though. Still great engine!

 

The rust at the hood cable is a problem, caused by the rubber seal not being seated correctly. Water get and soaks the insulation on the underside and the next thing is that. Very common.

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10028&highlight=hood+cable+rubber

 

 

Todd

 

Missed this earlier and was on break making a quick response.. well i dont do much on quick responses lol..

 

The engine is interesting.. but i really planned on ditching it for a ea81 with a 4mt D/R , fairly easy to find. I was thinking something was up.. the chiltons manual says the old carb, dcj-306-15 says only 1980. So.. i'm just further reinforced to get the 81/dr combo..

 

But my rust.. that's pretty bad news for me! I have no welder and the cash flow is more of a trickle..

 

i can wipe out that entire hood cable and just run it out of the grill somewhere.

 

Then can remove the dash and i fill it up with bondo an a crap load of sealant?

 

Bedliner is still on the table i guess..

 

Big question i have here i need to research.. bondo price VS. a cheap welder and hacking the neon up..

 

Thanks for the responses and help. Great community here and i hope to bring our cars to a gathering one day!

[SUBARU3]

Missed this earlier and was on break making a quick response.. well i dont do much on quick responses lol..

 

The engine is interesting.. but i really planned on ditching it for a ea81 with a 4mt D/R , fairly easy to find. I was thinking something was up.. the chiltons manual says the old carb, dcj-306-15 says only 1980. So.. i'm just further reinforced to get the 81/dr combo..

 

But my rust.. that's pretty bad news for me! I have no welder and the cash flow is more of a trickle..

 

i can wipe out that entire hood cable and just run it out of the grill somewhere.

 

Then can remove the dash and i fill it up with bondo an a crap load of sealant?

 

Bedliner is still on the table i guess..

 

Big question i have here i need to research.. bondo price VS. a cheap welder and hacking the neon up..

 

Thanks for the responses and help. Great community here and i hope to bring our cars to a gathering one day!

 

 

Forget the Bondo. Filler is used for suface inperfections and smoothing. It will never hold long with that kind of rust. It also soaks up water. Use fiberglass if you are going that route.

 

The firewall, cowl, inner wheelwells, spare tire shelf are really the death nail when rust gets bad.

 

Replace the rubber windshield gasket too. They are available from a bulk order we all did some time ago.

 

I would suggest the welder.

 

Remove ALL of the dash, wiring, insulation, heater and see just exactly what you are dealing with. If it's bad and there are other bad areas on the car, I would salvage the best and part it. Keep doors, hatch, hood, interior and mechanicals, lights. You can still find solid wagons out there. Otherwise, cut out the bad and fab up new metal, weld in, seal up and paint good.

 

If you just want to play with it, then keep it all in perspective.

 

Todd

[Nubaru]

It's Alive!! details tomorrow =P

[Nubaru]

So she runs, idles around 1500 rpm but chokes out a bit around 5.5k rpm. Blew alot of smoke at first from sitting so long. But now.. not a bit of smoke.. not the first little puff.. So, that's great news right?

 

I have the tires geting fixed and need to get my brake piston cleaned and put back in right.

 

Other than that she's ready for the "farm use" test drive =D

 

If everything goes well there i'm going to do what i can with sheet metal and fiberglass, paint it black and red with rustoleum. Find my tail lights on e-bay, fix a few other things to get it to pass inspection.

 

I feel real good about it now..

 

Pics again soon, gotta borow my sisters camera again.

 

I have a few questions.

 

1. the hoses that come out of the valve cover. My air cleaner is a little can one from o'riley now. So they have nowhere to go. What do i do with them?

 

2. The "quarter" trick is just pluging the bottom of that metal tube beside the egr valvue with a quarter right? then you can just saw that tube off? Dont want to get to crazy on that with out verification. I have removed the egr valve and put the can lid on.

 

Thanks again for all the help and special thanks to 84gl for the carb. Once i got the timing right that carb works like a dream!

 

On that note.. I dont know if it was GD's origonal words, but that's where i read it.. Squirt, Squish, Bang.. those 3 words bring it all into perspective and is a little bit of genious.. lol

 

thanks again everyone!

[84gl]

I'm gald you like it. I'm just sorry I don't live closer so I can help More we need more old school soob guys in our area but all we have is V8 junky rednecks

[biffanyus]

Check with ShawnW here on the board. I believe he has some wagon tail light lenses for sale maybe the whole assembly with it as well. Cant wait to see more pics...

 

Heres the link for those tail lights for sale....

 

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=114994

Edited August 25, 2010 by biffanyus

[Nubaru]

Test drive went.. well..

 

Good news, engine feels strong and runs / rolls good enough to tell me the bad news..

 

bad news.. yup i need a clutch.. going to get a new one soon.. easy business

 

With the clutch issue i go into alot of other jobs "while the engine is out".

 

Fixing my firewall rust problem and cleaning, sanding and painting the engine compartment, along with the engine.. It didnt leak a bit of oil in the probably 3 gallons of gas i have idled through it. So i figgure i'm safe to go on that.

 

My plan for the rust is now this.. Remove all of that insulation and replace it with.. i'm thinking some kind of heat resistant foam.. then sheet metal and rivet the big holes and reform what i can. Fill over with fiberglass and paintable waterproof caulk. Smooth it out.. make it look nice.. water proof it.. paint over it and call it a day till i can do a frame off resto.

 

My passenger brake caliper is.. well i'm sure shot.. 60 bucks for a new one from o'riley. no big deal. just the caliper is bad.. the shoes and rotor look fine.

 

battery.. wiper blades, some wireing..

I'm going to be busy.. but i love it, been haveing a great time and i actually look forward to the 2nd engine pull.

 

Some cell phone pics.. i need a new freakin camera..

 

What i have done under the hood recently.

 

 

Rustolium black! I plan on black with a red stripe and red engine parts.

 

Just a matter of time till it's awdsome!.. saw that on a sticker lol

[biffanyus]

She is nice!!!! Cant wait to see her when shes all done. I love these wagons. I love my brat more but If I get another old subie down the line I think I would want this style wagon...... Or a Gen 2 Brat:grin: Good luck.....