sushisan87 Posted December 15, 2010 Share Posted December 15, 2010 When my 94 Loyale is cold, it runs really rough, sputtering along until it warms up and then it runs fine. Just started happening in the last month and a half when the outside temperature started to drop, but I'm not sure if it's related to the problem. Prior to this period it ran like a top, despite its 200k+ mileage. Could it be some sort of temperature sensor that's burned out or defective? Could it be dirty fuel injectors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted December 16, 2010 Share Posted December 16, 2010 I would suspect the engine temp sensor, the one with 2 wires and the green plug on the thermostat housing. good luck. A new one will be litted for upwards of 95 bucks, maybe 45 at supplier cost. Or it's a pocket item at the junkyard if you bring a 17mm wrench. Unplug the sensor and see if the car runs different (closed loop) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drugh Posted December 16, 2010 Share Posted December 16, 2010 You can also verify if the engine temp sensor is broken by plugging in an approproate resistor into the plug for the sensor. The Chiltons manual has the resistance that the sensor should be when the engine is warm. This way you can buy a new sensor and you can be sure that your problem will be fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93Newbaru Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 I was just going to post the same problem, my 89 Gl with swapped 93ish 1.8 runs like crap when cold (sometimes) until it warms up. Symptons include: bucking, stumbling, or completely cutting out when gas is pressed. First thing we did was route the EGR on the 93 motor like the 89 motor, which seemed to bypass some kind of solenoid and I believe it routed directly from the egr valve to the intake. Second thing was swapping the temp sensor and temp sender from the 89 motor, still stumbled and ran crappy. Third thing was swapped the coil from another 89 car and it ran perfectly a few times when cold, but is back to the same problem once again. -My last 6 gallons of fuel the trip meter reported around 70mpg, my tires are oversized but not by that much. --The car is also showing me no oil pressure, when started it jumps to maybe 80, then drops off to nothing and stays there. Have not swapped an oil sensor yet, but I assume there is oil pressure seeing I have driven it a couple hundred miles? I have just been living with it for a few months, although I would like to learn a little more seeing as I am about to acquire my third car and all 3 need work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93Newbaru Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 (edited) Temp sensor: AC Delco #F1864 $15.08 ULTRAPOWER #TX96 $32.99 (lists for $75 under '89 GL but $32.99 under 94 loyale) ULTRAPOWER #TX18 SUBARU states "w/ turbo" $7.03 Temp sender: Standard motor products #TS61 $8.90 AIRTEX / WELLS #1T1211 $3.23 Edited December 17, 2010 by 93Newbaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushisan87 Posted December 28, 2010 Author Share Posted December 28, 2010 Thanks for all the suggestions. I just got another temp sensor from a recent addition to a local wrecking yard. Popped it in and no real difference. I'll try hooking up a resistance meter to see if it's faulty. When I do start the car with either sensor it warms up normally and reaches a nice stable idle. It's only after I drive away that it chugs along sputtering especially on hills until it's really warmed up. Could an exhaust system leak cause these symptoms or could it be related to the mass air flow sensor (where is that?) mentioned in another thread? Recently replaced the fuel filter and the air filter is clean. Tried running it on the more expensive gas the last few tank fulls to try to help the injectors out. Speaking of where is that, does anyone know of a good online source for shop photos of this engine identifying various parts? My Chiltons book is missing a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosens Posted December 28, 2010 Share Posted December 28, 2010 Check all vacuum hoses and the fit of the plenum , and for cracks in the plenum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushisan87 Posted December 29, 2010 Author Share Posted December 29, 2010 Sorry Moosens...don't have my manual with me. What is the plenum and where is it on the late spfi loyales? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosens Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 That boxy cover thing that sits over the SPFI throttle body. Duct goes to the air cleaner/filter box with the MAF along the way. Not that its a huge matter of importance here and now but cleaning that MAF doesn't hurt. Check those sensors and their connections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushisan87 Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 Checked my temp sensor and it comes up to specs. Cleaned my MAF (not really dirty to begin with) and checked all vacuum-type connections and plenum contacts. Everything seemed ok. Thanks everyone for your advice. It starts up fine. First crank and sounds very normal. Exhaust system seems okay. Good metal from front to back. Everything seems very snug. It may be a bit loud when warming up from a cold start. As soon as I pull away and hit any type of incline, it starts to sputter and hesitate. No power and warming up the engine doesn't seem to matter any more. In the last two weeks it's gone from bad to worse. It stays pretty gutless now. Checked the spark plugs and wires and they all seem to be functioning fine. Did notice a little foam on the oil cap. Please tell me I'm not looking at a head gasket job. Probably wishful thinking, but can the foamy cap be due to the engine working harder? It sputters and chugs pretty hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Change the fuel filter+ignition tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhise Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 A little foam on the oil cap is normal in the winter time, it's just condensation. My old loyale ran alot better with a new o2 sensor. Seems the old one was lazy enough to make the car run like crap until it warmed up enough to get into closed loop. Try resetting the ecu by disconnecting the battery and turning on the lights for a few minutes and see how it runs then. -Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soobenthusiast Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I hope you find a solution, the Loyale runs exactly as 93Newbaru describes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo747 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 You may have noticed that I've been having a very similar problem for that last month myself. Turns out that my fuel injector was bad. A new one is pricey (in the $300.00 range), but you can get a rebuilt one (like I did) for about $27.00 (plus core) from RockAuto.com. Good Luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushisan87 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 dhise-??-"Try resetting the ecu by disconnecting the battery and turning on the lights for a few minutes and see how it runs then." Not quite sure I understand how to do what you're suggesting. How can I turn on the lights while the battery is disconnected? Like the idea of resetting my ecu. I replaced my fuel filter a little while ago. Made no difference. Did a mini ignition tune today and based on the Chilton's tune-up guide I'm not sure if I did it properly. Does anyone know what the idle switch is and where it's located? According to Chilton's it needs to be on and the test mode connector (single wire green connector-in the upper right section of the engine compartment near brake fluid reservoir??) needs to be connected before attempting the timing. I think I connected the right test mode connector, but I'm not sure about this idle switch. Anyway-my idle was a little high so I turned it down and then set the timing. It runs much better, but still isn't perfect. Been suspicious of the O2 Sensor for a while, but I'm lacking the special angle tool and can't quite figure out how to remove the old one. Also suspicious of my fuel injector, but I'll put that off for now until I'm sure about my tune-up. Did have a little build-up on the contacts on the inside of my distributor cap. Sanded them down and they looked pretty good. Wires aren't that old so I'm ruling them out for now. Probably should test their resistance. My rotor cap was jammed on. It's not that old and it looked good so I left it for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhise Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 dhise-??-"Try resetting the ecu by disconnecting the battery and turning on the lights for a few minutes and see how it runs then." Not quite sure I understand how to do what you're suggesting. How can I turn on the lights while the battery is disconnected? Like the idea of resetting my ecu. Of course the lights won't come on with the battery disconnected, but it will drain any residual voltage in the ecu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushisan87 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Got it. Thanks dhise! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soobenthusiast Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Just wanted to say that when the Loyale was bucking and stuttering it only had about 3" of pipe after the muffler flange. It now has a straight pipe going all the way back, and the bucking, stuttering, and stumbling has almost completely gone away. Hopefully this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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