markjw Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 1992 AWD Legacy Wagon Auto with 166K I bought a early legacy a while back to use as a donor for a EJ swap. It had been sitting in a guys yard for 6 yrs and finally I stopped and asked about it. Of course, "it was parked because of some kinda tranny issue, but it ran fine". When I asked the PO what the tranny was doing, all's he said was "It wouldn't shift". I hauled it home, drained the gas tank, rid the fuel system of all the old gas, installed new fuel filter, lube oil and filter change, sure enough, it runs fine. While doing all this, I could certainly hear the tranny pump whining while at idle, and also while I drove it around in my yard. Well, today, I aired up all the tires and took it for a test drive. After about a mile or two test drive, the whining is gone, and the only other symptom of a tranny problem is it feels like it's hesitating to shift thru third and into 4th gear. This wagon is in Really good condition. I'd hate to take it apart if the tranny is salvageable. I want to change the tranny fluid and see where that gets me, but I don't want to spend 50 bucks on a dead tranny. What should I do at this point to see if I should try and save this thing, without spending the money to change the fluid? Or, is that really my only option? The fluid that is in there now is kinda dark. Not too bad. And, it's over full by about a quart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 I just read a bunch of threads about a slipping 4eat instead of one that simply dis engages while in gear and driving. I'm almost certain mine is slipping. And in all forward gears. I just went for another test drive, and it seems the more I drive it, the more it slips in all forward gears. I can baby the accelerator peddle and make it run down the road, but after each up shift, it wants to rev for a few seconds before I can feel the engine power again. What do you think? Classic case of bad clutch's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 $10 Bottle of TransX might help. Either way you get to spend money on it. You don't have to do a full flush though, a quick drain and refill will likely be enough to see if there is any noticeable difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 if it is slipping it is dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 10, 2011 Author Share Posted January 10, 2011 $10 Bottle of TransX might help. Either way you get to spend money on it. You don't have to do a full flush though, a quick drain and refill will likely be enough to see if there is any noticeable difference. I'm going to try this. Just to see if anything changes. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Be aware if you are unaware, that your Subie has a drain bolt on the bottom of the trany pan. Draining fluid will only drain about half the trany fluid in the system. The remainder stays in the torque converter. To do a good fluid change, suggest draining, filling, then drive for 5 minutes between changes. Do this routine three times. Don't drop the pan cover on the bottom of the trany. The little screen mesh never gets clogged inside the pan cover, and then it is a bear to clean off all surfaces when reinstalling the pan cover. Then, really difficult to prevent fluid leaks from the pan. It is possible that the quart of extra fluid in your trany is causing your problem. It may be foaming, and not lubing your trany. Be aware that low to full mark on the ATF dip stick is only about a pint of trany fluid. So, easy to over fill it. I bet that is what previous owner did. Keep us posted on your progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 10, 2011 Author Share Posted January 10, 2011 Thanks for all the good advice, Rooster. I made most of those mistakes on my previous auto legacy. Here's where I'm at. I found a inline filter in the tranny fluid "out" line. Since I didn't have a new one, I by-passed it. I threw it in the garbage, actually. I don't think it has ever been changed. I drained all the fluid using the tranny pump by way of connecting a 3/8", clear hose to the radiator return nipple, and added fresh fluid along with a bottle of Trans-X as the old fluid was pumped out. I've done this before. I'm convinced it's the best way to change tranny fluid on a early legacy. I don't know if the Trans-X had any effect, but thanks Fairtax, for that tip, too. I went for a test drive, and the thing is shifting perfect. No more slipping and it shifts smooth. I'm almost freaked out by how nice this thing runs now. I'm gonna license it tomorrow and change the acc. belts, take it for a real test drive. I was deceived by the condition of the original fluid just by looking at the dip stick. In the bucket, it looks like mud water. Is it possible the old tranny filter was so plugged it wasn't letting the pump build enough line pressure? I really can't believe a simple fluid change could make this much difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I always check trans fluid on a perfectly clean white rag, and I dip the stick 3 or 4 times to get a good idea of the color of the fluid on the rag. If it's not clean clear red, it gets changed. It does look a bit dark in the pic you posted of the dipstick. The darkness in the drained fluid is probably mostly clutch material. You'll find out if it worked in 1000 miles or so. If it doesn't quit altogether, it's probably OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Yes, a change of fluid can do that much. The fluid can become very dark, thick and nasty. (I use the same method as you to drain/replace ATF.) If that inline filter that you tossed was mounted to the left frame rail, I would suggest that you replace it. It was part of a retrofit to catch lockup clutch debris before it gets into the cooler and plugs it. The filter is mostly a screen, and is intended to be permanent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Glad to hear that the ATF change and Trans-X have improved your trany performance. I hope the slipping issue is behind you. Nice pix on your 92. I had a 91 that was the same color as yours. In fact looks the same all over. I miss those nice mouse fur fabric seats that I bet yours has. They were so compfy. Much better then my current 99 OBW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 It wasn't a complete waste of time, because I know now, after being able to drive it around for a few hrs, that this is a Really nice wagon. BUT:grin:, the tranny is slipping again. And, all that fresh fluid I added last night, it's now "black as pitch"... I'm tied between going ahead with plan A and using this wagon as a EJ donor or, finding a replacement tranny. It doesn't seem like good working 4eat's are readily available. I like automatic early legacy's. But, the problem's associated with them, I can do without. I think they are good trannys, it's just that they all have 200k miles on them now. The 5 speeds are cheap to fix. The auto's are not. Anyways, thanks for all the help and advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Do another drain/flush. Part of what the trans-x does is act as a cleaner, and all the gunk that was settled inside the tranny is now floating in the fluid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 Well, I tried it again. Another drain flush refill. It's hopeless. The fluid level is perfect. It's pink, too. Still slipping. Anybody have a auto tranny for sale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 this reminds me of ''you may be a subaru owner if'' ... you buy a parts car and 6 months later you are still driving it because it is better than your daily driver. i thought you bought it for the engine, has that changed since the trans is no good. take two and make one, i know your pain. to make it work, one of them has to go. or you need to find a wrecked car with good engine and trans. good luck, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 this reminds me of ''you may be a subaru owner if'' ... you buy a parts car and 6 months later you are still driving it because it is better than your daily driver. Now that's funny! I should go with plan A. But, this thing only has 160K on it and it's just a victim of neglect. The great thing about people who drive they're cars into the ground without maintaining them, is that people like me pick them up for a dime after they won't "Go" any more, and drive them for ten more yrs. That could easily be the case with this wagon. It's a perfect swap candidate, thou. And I may still go that route. I need something else to wrench on while I'm still building up the nerve to take on the EJ swap. Keep my mind off this wagon. I'm going to look at a '88 GL in the am. 4wd 5 speed to boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Ah well, you gave it the good ole college try at least. Now at least you know it's hosed. :-p Honestly a good 4EAT shouldn't cost much at a junkyard, ($150ish from a picknpull?) and they don't take that long to swap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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