Gen II vs. Gen III - pros and cons?

[eryque]

Hey, everyone. It's been a long time since I've posted here, mostly because I've had the good fortune to have kept my Impreza running pretty well.

 

It's getting to be time to say goodbye to the Impreza. I need something bigger and want to get back into an Outback.

 

The top of my price range is going to be around $6500, which appears to put me in reach of either a later 2nd generation model or an earlier 3rd generation model. What are your opinions about the pros and cons of each?

 

I have a slight preference for the 3rd generation, based solely on looks, and have a slight preference for an automatic transmission. Those aren't dealbreakers, though, and I'll jump on the first one that seems to be a really good deal.

 

Any help and opinions here would be much appreciated!

[afterbang]

I have a 2nd gen outback and I like it more aesthetically but mechanically you're better off getting a 3rd gen. Preferably one that has had the head gaskets replaced. The HGs weap fluid on the phase II ej25 but you can still drive it and pour in some coolant "conditioner" that may slow the leak. In a phase I ej25, when the gasket fails it's time to drop some bills if you aren't mechanically capable to do the repair yourself.

 

I'm sure you can find an older 2nd gen Outback that has had the headgaskets replaced but the engine may have been abused prior to their replacement.

 

With $6500 you could afford to buy a newer one private party without a problem.

 

Phase I = DOHC ej25. Automatic 96 outbacks and all 97-99 ones. Same with 2.5GT Legacys

[eryque]

Thanks for the info, afterbang.

 

So the 2000 and later models had the Phase II EJ25? And the head gaskets are not as problematic on those?

 

I like the looks of the 3rd gen a little better, but it may work out a little better to go for a late 2nd gen model with more options.

 

Any other issues to look out for? How about transmission issues? I know about the potential binding issue and how to detect it, but is there anything else to look for?

[rverdoold]

3rd gen has lots of new safety features. Not saying the 2nd is unsafe but the 3rd is an evolution of the previous one.

[eryque]

It looks like I was going on some bad info about when the 3rd gen started, and there's no way I can reasonably expect to get into one on my budget. There's an '05 listed that would be in my range if I can get them to come way down, but it's got 162,000 miles already. *If* it were perfectly maintained and those were all highway miles it might be okay, but I'd be leery that it's going to need a lot of expensive maintenance very soon.

[lesstutrey]

The H6 motor available in G3s does not have head gasket problems, and it's got some power.... just no aftermarket parts. And yeah, side curtain airbags in the G3s, and a stock ride height that is higher, no macpherson strut in the rear etc. Love mine.

[afterbang]

i just reread what i posted... i must have been tired or something and im surprised no one has called me out on it.

 

when i was talking about the generations of the outback, i posted information about the generations of the legacys in general. sorry, i own a 1st and 2nd gen legacy and the 2nd gen happens to be a legacy outback so that's what i was going off of.

 

1st gen legacy outback 1995-1999. 1995 is a legacy L dressed like an outback.

 

by 2nd gen, you mean 2000-2004. that is going to be a sohc phase II ej25. those are the ones that leak from the head gasket. the 2005 is a single overhead cam as well. from what i understand, the service bulletin for the head gasket problem affected 1999-2002 model phase II engines but they ended up recommending the conditioner for 03 and 04 as well.

 

google search "subaru wwp-99" to read the service bulletin yourself.

 

i know it's confusing. the first outbacks were just a trim option available to the legacy. it became it's own standalone model separate from the legacy in 2000.

 

sorry for the mistake. i swear my intentions were only good!

Edited March 11, 2011 by afterbang

[eryque]

Thanks for updating the info, and I promise that I won't hold any mistakes against you

 

So here's what the Service Campaign says:

 

• 1999-2002 2.5L engines may experience a leak
  
• Only Phase II engines are affected by the campaign (1999 and later)
  
• In 2002 they fixed the problem at the factory
  

 

So... if I buy a late '02 or later model, it shouldn't be an issue, right?

[1982gl4]

It's shouldn't be, but at the shop where I work (not a Subaru dealer) we just replaced them in an 05 outback around two months ago :-\ , coolant was weeping around the head gaskets we told the customer that it would be fine for a while being an external leak but they just wanted it done. So if I were looking for a car I would most likely opt for a car that has a know good history, and they have been changed once already.

[AWDFTW]

http://www.cars101.com/outback.html

 

Hope this helps.

[idosubaru]

Phase II EJ25's are some 99's (Forester and RS) and all 2000+.

 

the Phase II HG problem is benign compared to the Phase I. Phase I I wouldn't consider a reliable vehicle personally unless it has new OEM headgaskets on it (preferrably done by me or someone that knows these engines). Phase II I would drive anywhere as they don't leave you stranded. But i drive a lot. 18 hours to Maine and 18 hours to New Orleans last year....28 or something hours to Colorado, so I view risk a little differently than most. The Phase II's won't leave you stranded, that's key for me. And due to the lack of overheating the bottom ends hold up better, fewer lower end bearing issues like the older ones.