bigjimd Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 Please y'all some help would be great. Now I have 2 broken mani bolts. First one left a stub about a 1/4" or so, no problem. Bad part is second one the head wrung off. I soaked these puppies for a week in Kano Kroil, before I broke em. The second bolt has the anular space around the bolt filled with years of baked gunk. Tonight I started trying to clean that space. started with a tiny drill bit and punched a bunch of holes down in the funk, then got brilliant and made a bit out of 16ga SS tie wire. Bottomed out the bit and tried to go deeper with the wire. As you can see the first attempt didn't work so well. Second shorter one did better sorta kinda knocked some crud out between the already drilled holes. Another smartness was the oak wedges. Hope I didn't crush anything.I didn't really go crazy with the hammer on em. Got the space I made filled with KanoKroil now. Can't get the sucker to budge any ideas? Can't spin it because the stubby bolt remains limit side to side. Haven't put any heat on it yet. Scraped off the oozed out gasket at the mani to head junction and I swear someone put a leather washer there. Tried driving the wedge in there too. Thinking about tring to find a piece of tubing that will fit the space with some teeth cut in it to try and run down the hole. Thanks in advance for any tips Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertsubaru Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 Never used KanoKroil, I never even heard of it. I use PB blaster. I have had some really rusty bolts that looked impossible to get loose but an overnight soak in PB always got the job done. If that don't work heat may just be your solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjimd Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share Posted June 23, 2011 Thanks, heats what I'm thinking too. Wish I could think of something that would disolve that gunk. Got turned on to Kroil in the 70's when I worked for Mcdonell Douglas. Has always worked well. Tried PB and not really seen a diferance between the 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 i've got some extensive posts about how to deal with these, i've done a bunch like this and have succeeded every time. don't have time to reiterate everything i've done but really quickly: 1. can you get longer drill bits? doesn't matter if you round out the intake mani hole some, it'll still hold fine. 2. wedge a sawzall between the intake manifold and head. the head and intake manifold can be resurfaced back to smooth. the width of the blade (minus width of the gasket) won't be enough to ruin it if you're careful. 3. heat would probably be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deener Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 I managed to extract one of those little PITA's with heat, a left handed drill bit and some cutting oil. I swear by the left handed drill bit...hard to find (like only the high end tool stores have them around here) but they work a million times better than any 'screw extractor', just load it in the chuck and set the drill on reverse and with a good pilot hole, you are well on your way to glory. They chew up the bolt while applying the reverse motion and aren't brittle like screw extractors so they don't snap. Also note, I have been running one of my EA82's with 5 intake bolts, as the 6th one just refused to extract. For that one, I just made sure the 'nub' was gone/filed down and slapped the intake back on. It rattled a little for the first day or so without the 6th bolt but it settled right in quickly and runs perfect now, no vaccum or coolant leaks at all. It's not the ideal solution but that one has held for well over a year now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 good point - do not even think about using a bolt extractor - those things are terrible. they are worthless as a tool and more importantly if they shear off (which they often do because the'they're strong...but very brittle - then you got a real big problem on your hand.) i say they're worthless not because they can't remove something - but because they're not very good - anything that a bolt extractor can remove can be removed by various other methods. so it's not worth the risk considering how hard a sheared off bolt extractor is to remove. high quality left handed drill bits are amazing and worth every penny. but they are hard to get, i've never been able to find them for sale locally. gotta order what you want depending where you live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjimd Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share Posted June 23, 2011 Thanks a lot y'all. I wish I had never heard of screw extractors. I always tell myself never again. Done that at least 3 times. You should have seen the size of the stud that wound up holding the ex manifold on my old Volvo turbo wagon. A bunch of 10mm and then what is that 9/16" stud doin there. Ugly!!! I am determined to win this battle. What scares me about trying to drill it is the length of bolt still in there and how tight a grip the blasted goo has. Thankfully I have access to a fantastic hardware store that stocks left twist drills. If my plan for tonight doesn't work I'll try that next. Then I guess it's sawzall time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjimd Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 GOT IT !!!! Smacked it around after work last night and she finally gave in and opened up. The wedge popped it off. Guess the Kroil finally got the goo loose. Both broken bolts came right out with the Vice Grips. Yipee Yahoo. Thanks again for all the help. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 great! that's awesome the studs came out, they almost always have needed drilled out for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Glad to see that worked. Someone else is going to benefit from this post when they break a blot. MAybe it should go in the USRM. the wooden wedge idea is pretty clever. My buddy has a stuck mpfi intake bolt, that trick may work since we tried other methods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petersubaru Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 I build a moat with RTV around the stud and let the PB blaster pool in there..time and patience are needed ..maybe a week of sitting and during that time I tap around the offending area with a hammer ...also apply heat to the area near the stud(map gas)..anything to get the metal to expand a little..usually works for the toughest bolts IF the penetrant can get in....and in some cases, the "kano" product might work better, since the molecules are smaller then PB and will go deeper..if it makes a difference, who knows... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Someone here told me to use 3/8 impact on those and they almost never break that way. So far after the usual soaking with PB ect, this hasn't failed me yet. I know it sounds crazy but it works:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Someone here told me to use 3/8 impact on those and they almost never break that way. So far after the usual soaking with PB ect, this hasn't failed me yet. I know it sounds crazy but it works:eek: Makes sense! I bet a cordless impact driver would work as well. I know for a fact that works on other smaller rusted screws and bolts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 The idea is to not twist the bolt faster than it can unscrew. I use a long breaker bar and slow steady torque. Moving too fast will shear the bolt. You are fighting to turn corrosion all the way up the shank of the bolt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 The shock of an impact does seem to have a positive effect on breaking up the corrosion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjimd Posted June 26, 2011 Author Share Posted June 26, 2011 I think drilling those holes in the gunk, letting it sit for a couple days full of penetrating oil, some pessure from the wedges and wiggling the other end around a bunch all helped. I did have a bolt in the center hole on the other end to give the wedges something to push against, but be very careful with the wedges. I'm hoping I didn't wreak anything, you create a huge amount of force really quick when you drive those 2 wedges against each other. I had about a 1/4 gap on the loose side and just drove them good and snug then tightened the bolt a bit. Rapped the stuck side with a brass hammer before and after work for a couple days. We went to the upulit today thinking we were gonna get some replacement mani bolts and all 6 of the bolts on one engine were terrible to get out, they came but were really ugly and I'm sure at least 1 was ready to let go. They were bent and plain ugly. Will order new bolts going back in. Anybody grease the bolts or anything to keep this from happening? Baby girl scored a nice sunroof for $23.00 she can't wait to get Fizgig back together again. Gonna be sorry to see the steer horns go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjimd Posted June 26, 2011 Author Share Posted June 26, 2011 Miles I can't agree more. Taking your time is key. I admit I am not real good about that. I actually thought the second one was moving .... right up till it snapped. I did rush them both truth be told. And the results I had at the upulit today are a direct corelation of hurrying things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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