mostlymustard Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 Hi All, My Dad has a 2003 Forester XS with 70,120 miles on the original engine. The car started making a noise last week which as been diagnosed by the dealer as rod knock. They are recommending that he get a new short block, a procedure that will cost about $5,700 (including machining the old heads). The short block comes with a 3 year, 36 month warranty. I'm hoping that someone with some Subaru knowledge can help me with the following questions. Do you think there is anything Subaru would do to help (71K seems awfully early for engine failure)? Does this well maintained car have any value to anyone (in its current condition) on the open market? The body is very clean without dents or dings. The dealer mentioned that the engine can be replaced by a used one for about $4,700. It would come with a 6 month warranty. Any other suggestions as to what we may do? It's such a bummer to have this car go out on us like this. We were Subaru fans until this happened. I appreciate your time. Albert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 This is a problem normally reserved for the dual cam 2.5 found in 96-99 model Subarus. Typically it gets blamed as a side-effect of overheating. To hear of one with that low mileage having trouble certainly doesn't boost my confidence in the newer engines. Honestly though, I'd get a second opinion first. Take it to another dealer or independent shop that specializes in Subarus. The timing belt tensioners on these are known to wear out and rattle/knock and can sound similar to a rod knock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 +1 what Fairtax said! Definitely get a 2nd opinion, even a 3rd. Try to find an independent Subaru shop. Then maybe contact Subaru (SOA) and ask to talk to a regional rep--the car shouldn't have that dire a problem at such low milage. Where is Belmont? Please add your state to your ID--someone may have a recommendation based on your location. Good luck Albert and let us know what you find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 you could probably get $3,500-$5,000 or so roughly for that car, so it does have some value, but not what it would if running new. make *sure* it's rod knock. failing timing tensioners or cracked flexplate can be misdiagnosed as well as rod knock. rare and unlikely - but so is rod knock at your mileage. you can get a used engine for $1,500 and have it installed for $1,000 (at the most with new timing belts, etc). you can even get engines cheaper, but should not have any problem getting one at that price. so $2,500 is top dollar for engine replacement in my opinion. you can even try to find an engine that's got bad heads/bent valves/cracked cam gears etc and just use the block, those are cheaper and you just use your heads. http://www.car-parts.com for used engines. shipping is about $700 from your way - so $1,400 round trip shipping, i'll fix it for $2,000 and you're only out $3,400! fix it right and you've got a lot more reliable miles coming to you. but yeah you got some bad luck at only 71,000 miles. doubt Subaru will do anything about that due to age/mileage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 I believe that a cracked flexplate can also sound like engine bearing knock. In my view, some mechanics are very, very quick to diagnose an expensive engine replacement by ear alone. We're talking about a substantial amount of money, it's worth a little trouble to confirm the diagnosis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 I'd take it to an indy shop. Dealers don't have the time to deal with older cars (yes, 2003 is an older car to a dealer). They drive people out by giving them a ridiculous bill for stuff that may not even be necessary. They basically want to sell you a new car. That's what dealers do best. An independent shop, on the other hand, stays in business by doing good work for people and making happy customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarl Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 If the problem is indeed a rod knock, and you have not run the car too much on the knocking engine, I don't see why you would need to machine the heads. In any case, a used engine installed by an independent shop should be about half of the quote you got. There's a Subaru engine rebuilder in northern Michigan (hopefully lower shipping rates) that offers engines with the same warranty you are being offered by the dealer, for $1750 or so (ssisubaruspecialists.com - have never dealt with them, though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mostlymustard Posted August 29, 2011 Author Share Posted August 29, 2011 Wow, I'm impressed with the involvement of the members of the USMB and the great ideas posted to my thread! The service adviser at Capital Subaru in San Jose told me they heard the knocking in the lower part of the engine, drained the oil, and found metal contamination in the oil. This is the basis of their diagnosis. He also said the engine was a quart over on oil. I'll have to get it towed to another shop (it's recommended that we don't drive it) to get a second opinion, but it sounds like that is the consensus. I'll also give Subaru a call to see what they say. Thanks again for all the great ideas! Albert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarl Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 Yep... I'm new at USMB and I'm also amazed of how helpful and kind people are around here Definitely do NOT try running the car. The main reason I met this group was because I had to replace my OBW engine. It spun a rod bearing, and the engine was run like that for too long (not sure how long... I bought the car after the damage was done). Apparently the oil filter got clogged with all the crap flowing through it and the bypass opened, allowing shiny little pieces of brass to flow freely around the engine... I still wonder if an oil change, along with a *really* good filter could have prevented this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 these engines are generally considered scrap once they have rod knock. there's usually other more cost effective repair options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake River Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 You can puchase new long blocks for $2800 from Pacific Powertrain , and they come with a 12 month unlimited mileage warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnW Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Remember this is a 9 year old car and to Subaru, that isn't going to be something they cover very often. Especially beyond powertrain 5/60 coverage window. By all means try it but don't be surprised when its denied. A rebuilt engine is probably your best bet. I sell a rebuilt longblock for $3059 for that model. Shipping is an additional charge of around $400 for both core return and new engine shipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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