1991 Loyale Wagon - let the build begin.

[NICALM]

My Loyale starter has been giving me grief for about 2 years now. I'd be interested to know what model of Legacy this starter came from so I could ger a reman of the same type to try. Any info GD?

[Stubies Subie]

My Loyale starter has been giving me grief for about 2 years now. I'd be interested to know what model of Legacy this starter came from so I could ger a reman of the same type to try. Any info GD?

 

http://www.streetperformance.com/part/bosch/starter/3863343-1608002.html

 

this says it fits GL, DL, Loyale, Legacy from 1980 to 2004

 

I got to this link by doing a google search

[GeneralDisorder]

Correct - any Subaru starter from 1982 to 2004 will interchange. With the exception that EJ manual transmissions require one that fits into their smaller bell-housing hole. The bolt pattern is still identical and ANY starter in that year range will fit any of the EA's.

 

GD

[Stubies Subie]

Correct - any Subaru starter from 1982 to 2004 will interchange. With the exception that EJ manual transmissions require one that fits into their smaller bell-housing hole. The bolt pattern is still identical and ANY starter in that year range will fit any of the EA's.

 

GD

 

It's day number two and that starter I got from GD is working just fine

[Stubies Subie]

Nice score! Were you not able to find the proper PCV routing parts for the oil-burning retro-fit?

 

GD

 

 

I got the PCV retrofit parts in the mail today, and installed them tonight, when I took the old hoses and fittings off, they were full of oil, literally saturated.

 

We’ll see how the oil burning does now, next step would be the PCV valve but I'm not going to change that unless it's still sucking oil even after the hose retrofit.

 

And if it's really bad, (even after a new PCV valve) then I can always go to an oil catch can if it's needed.

 

the car is running really well now, I really like the torque cam grumble it's got, at some point I want to upgrade the exhaust on it to help bring the sound out a little better and maybe allow for a little bit more power

 

I noticed tonight that I'm getting what sounds like some squeaking or maybe almost a grinding sound coming from the front end, it's real bad when it's cold and goes away completely after the car has been driven a few miles (I noticed it when I got off work tonight) maybe axles? Or brake pads? I know it needs new brakes on the front, that's my next step, I hope it's not a bad axel or axles, but if it is, I'll address that problem as well. At any rate, you can manipulate the grinding squeaking sound by turning the steering wheel, so it’s got to be axles or brakes or something, I’ll try to get into it this weekend and take a look.

 

I'm pretty sure this car sat for a number of years so I'm finding that I have a few bugs that need to be worked out of it, but so far, it's doing pretty good. I’m pretty sure at some point this nickel and dime stuff is going to quit.

 

I'm thinking sometime in February I'll start upgrading the car and getting ready for traveling, I'm just not sure what I want to do first, tint the windows, maybe get a custom back bumper with a 2" receiver in it? or do the lift kit? Or the exhaust? get the body work done, Or any one of a bunch of other things I'd like to do to the car.

 

this is going to be a work in progress for a number of years I'm guessing, I got a huge list of "I wants" for the car.

 

I've put close to 3,000 miles on it since the engine was put in it, and the more I drive it, the better it seems to get.

Edited December 7, 2011 by Stubies Subie

[zukiru]

Correct - any Subaru starter from 1982 to 2004 will interchange. With the exception that EJ manual transmissions require one that fits into their smaller bell-housing hole. The bolt pattern is still identical and ANY starter in that year range will fit any of the EA's.

 

GD

 

manual or auto? doesn't matter?

I could have sworn I saw that they needed different starters.

[Stubies Subie]

manual or auto? doesn't matter?

I could have sworn I saw that they needed different starters.

 

from what GD was saying, anything works except a starter from an EJ with a manual transmission

[Stubies Subie]

Just a quick comment on the cooling system filters:

 

After 3,000 miles driving, and cleaning the filters out about 5 times total (or thereabouts)

I can tell you, I don’t regret running those filters one bit, the cooling system is incredibly clean, the engine operating temperature stays down around the ¼ to 1/3 mark on the gauge, and the heater blows so hot that on a nice cold night like tonight, it will literally drive you out of the car,, I have never driven anything that had such a nice hot heater in it, and I attribute that to the heater core filter keeping the debris out of the heater core.

 

At some point I’ll probably change out the Gano radiator filter for a Tefba brand only because the Tefba brand is a little easier to service then the Gano.

 

I would highly recommend running a cooling system filter, it’s really made a difference on my car.

 

 

 

[zukiru]

I need some of those filters.

very neat.

 

where are you buying yours?

[Loyale 2.7 Turbo]

I'm Glad to know that your Subie is Developing so Great!

 

...We’re also doing the torque cams, that should give a little better low end torque for towing...

 

...I really like the torque cam grumble it's got...

 

Could I Kindly ask you More info about the Torque Cams?

 

Thanks ... ...

[GeneralDisorder]

No - ALL EJ starters will fit EA's.

 

EJ manual *transmissions* need a starter with a different step on the drive side to fit the starter hole. But these starters WILL fit any EA.

 

There is a difference in auto vs. manual starters but it has to do with gear reductions inside the starter. Effectively one cranks slightly faster and one has more torque but in practice this simply doesn't matter. Both get the job done just fine.

 

GD

[zukiru]

No - ALL EJ starters will fit EA's.

 

EJ manual *transmissions* need a starter with a different step on the drive side to fit the starter hole. But these starters WILL fit any EA.

 

There is a difference in auto vs. manual starters but it has to do with gear reductions inside the starter. Effectively one cranks slightly faster and one has more torque but in practice this simply doesn't matter. Both get the job done just fine.

 

GD

 

had i realised I could have saved a few bucks and had my starter quicker.

oh well. good to know for future reference.

[Stubies Subie]

 

Could I Kindly ask you More info about the Torque Cams?

 

Thanks ... ...

 

 

I'm not an expert on the cams but I can tell you that I really like them, they were re-ground by Delta cams in Tacoma Washington, and from what I understand they have a couple of different grinding options for the EA82, Torque cams (which is what I have) or horse power cams, and I couldn't even tell you what the difference is other then the torque cams offer greater low end torque over stock cams.

 

My dog really likes riding in the car, and I honestly thought she was as excited about it as I was, so the other night, I tried to explain the engine mods to her and I really thought she was listening, but it turned out that I was sitting on her ball and she just wanted me to get off it.

 

The grumble rumble in my opinion sounds really cool to me, and when I’m pulling into traffic on the freeway trying to get up to speed, it hums along quite nicely, to me it’s not as slow and gutless as I would think an EA82 would be, but then again, I don’t really have anything to compare it to, someone that knows what a stock EA82 with a 5 speed feels like for torque and acceleration would have to drive it and see if they notice any difference between it and a stocker, I wouldn’t think that it has much more torque over stock.

 

On another note: I did the PCV hose re-route thing and have driven it well over 100 miles in the last couple of days and can now tell you that the oil consumption has all but stopped, the oil level hasn’t budged at all since I did the hose mod.

 

Every now and then it seems like I might get just a whiff of a burnt oil smell when I open the hood, but it’s so slight that it may not be that at all, I can’t say for certain that’s what the smell is, but to be on the safe side, and simply because I think it would be better for the engine in the long run anyway, I am going to install an oil catch can.

 

I don’t want to restrict the PCV system in anyway, so I will be running 5/8” hose to and from the catch can.

[92_rugby_subie]

Have you fixed the brake lights yet?

 

It feels like it has more spunk than my 92 Loyale did... and feels comparable to NED with his Weber, so I think they have added a bit of power.

 

No EA82 is a racecar but they are good cars

[Stubies Subie]

Have you fixed the brake lights yet?

 

It feels like it has more spunk than my 92 Loyale did... and feels comparable to NED with his Weber, so I think they have added a bit of power.

 

No EA82 is a racecar but they are good cars

 

nope, brake lights still not working, I need to look into that, but am kinda trying to nurse it past Christmas before I throw any more money into it.

[Loyale 2.7 Turbo]

Thank you for your Kind Answer.

 

... the torque cams offer greater low end torque over stock cams...

 

I'll Like to Know How Much...

it Sounds interesting and Maybe I could Try that on my BumbleBeast one Day, but I have the Third Gen EA82 Heads installed on it, so maybe those are a Li'l bit Different.

 

 

...

My dog really likes riding in the car...

...

 

Great! ... I really Like your Dog, Looks Huge, I Used to have a BloodHound dog...

 

 

... I am going to install an oil catch can.

 

I don’t want to restrict the PCV system in anyway, so I will be running 5/8” hose to and from the catch can.

 

 

I Did it and maybe my Pictures could help you a Li'l, you can see 'em here:

 

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showpost.php?p=1043339&postcount=10

 

 

Something interesting is that I have issues with my BumbleBeast's Brake Lights too, but the Culprit is the Brake Bulb on the Pedal... it got Sticky, I'll Try to Clean it soon.

Kind Regards.

[renob123]

Thank you for your Kind Answer.

 

 

 

I'll Like to Know How Much...

it Sounds interesting and Maybe I could Try that on my BumbleBeast one Day, but I have the Third Gen EA82 Heads installed on it, so maybe those are a Li'l bit Different.

 

 

 

 

Great! ... I really Like your Dog, Looks Huge, I Used to have a BloodHound dog...

 

 

 

 

 

I Did it and maybe my Pictures could help you a Li'l, you can see 'em here:

 

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showpost.php?p=1043339&postcount=10

 

 

Something interesting is that I have issues with my BumbleBeast's Brake Lights too, but the Culprit is the Brake Bulb on the Pedal... it got Sticky, I'll Try to Clean it soon.

Kind Regards.

 

You can call or email Delta, and they'll know exactly what you need. The cams are surprisingly affordable, but I don't know how shipping or duty would affect you.

 

I wish I had a dog, but I just don't know if I'd be able to provide the activity I know they need. Too bad plants don't provide the same love and energy:)

 

Jacob

[Stubies Subie]

Here’s another update:

 

It seems I was having front end trouble, and it was becoming more and more increasingly obvious that something in the front end was amiss.

 

At first I wanted to blame the axles, but the thumping, grinding, and high pitched squealing I heard every now and then just didn’t match the symptoms of a bad axle, it was way to intermittent for that, sometimes it would show up when I was braking, sometimes when I was accelerating, or coasting, or turning the wheel, it would do it off and on pretty much in any configuration the car happened to be in, it had to be something else other then the axles. I also noticed that sometimes the brakes applied easily with little pressure, and other times, it just about took an act of congress to stop the car, something had to be done.

 

I took a look at the brake pads and thought they looked somewhat thin, so I ordered a new set of pads thinking that maybe that funny symptoms I was hearing every now and then was the pads falling apart or possibly broken and rattling around on the caliper.

 

I pulled both front hub caps and noticed that on the drivers side the axle castle nut was loose, (I bet that’s part of the problem) the passenger side seemed fine.

 

Being on a very tight budget at the moment I figured I would be lucky to afford the pads let alone anything else until after Christmas and after the initial repair was paid off (by the way, I’m dang close to having that paid off now)

 

I decided to start my brake pad replacement on the passenger side, upon pulling the rotor, I noticed that something was seriously amiss, the rotor was all but blown out, the rubber seal over the parking brake mechanism has a hole in it and upon inspection, it was all gummed up in there, the seal around the piston was all but shredded, and when I tried to screw in the piston, that’s when I noticed the jack screw was stripped, that piston wasn’t going anywhere, this caliper is way beyond rebuilding.

 

I don’t like doing things half way and I’ve always been a firm believer that when doing work like this, you do both sides, whether it’s needed or not, but not having the funds at the moment to do both sides, we’ll start with the passenger side for now, we’ll address the drivers side in a few days.

 

There’s something wrong with my camera so I’m not even going to try to upload pictures tonight, but I took a bunch and none of them were worthy of posting, so I’ll try to get some better pictures in a day or two.

 

At this point, (everything will be done in pairs, but I only have funds for the passenger side right now, I suspect that the drivers side is going to be worse.

 

The brake fluid is a nasty dirty black, it has to be completely flushed, I’m ordering a rebuilt caliper, as well as wheel bearings and hub seals, (I believe at this time that the axles are ok, the boots are intact and not torn on either side, at least not that I can tell)

 

if I'm completely flushing out the brake system, I figured this would be a good time to switch to DOT 4 brake fluid.

 

this is just more evidence that the car sat for a very long period of time before I got it, in my opinion, the brake system is badly contaminated.

 

As far as flushing the system, my guess is for now that my best bet is to pick up a big bottle of DOT 4 brake fluid, and just start pouring in through the master cylinder, and letting it drain out through the brake lines into some disposable containers.

[renob123]

Here’s another update:

 

It seems I was having front end trouble, and it was becoming more and more increasingly obvious that something in the front end was amiss.

 

At first I wanted to blame the axles, but the thumping, grinding, and high pitched squealing I heard every now and then just didn’t match the symptoms of a bad axle, it was way to intermittent for that, sometimes it would show up when I was braking, sometimes when I was accelerating, or coasting, or turning the wheel, it would do it off and on pretty much in any configuration the car happened to be in, it had to be something else other then the axles. I also noticed that sometimes the brakes applied easily with little pressure, and other times, it just about took an act of congress to stop the car, something had to be done.

 

I took a look at the brake pads and thought they looked somewhat thin, so I ordered a new set of pads thinking that maybe that funny symptoms I was hearing every now and then was the pads falling apart or possibly broken and rattling around on the caliper.

 

I pulled both front hub caps and noticed that on the drivers side the axle castle nut was loose, (I bet that’s part of the problem) the passenger side seemed fine.

 

Being on a very tight budget at the moment I figured I would be lucky to afford the pads let alone anything else until after Christmas and after the initial repair was paid off (by the way, I’m dang close to having that paid off now)

 

I decided to start my brake pad replacement on the passenger side, upon pulling the rotor, I noticed that something was seriously amiss, the rotor was all but blown out, the rubber seal over the parking brake mechanism has a hole in it and upon inspection, it was all gummed up in there, the seal around the piston was all but shredded, and when I tried to screw in the piston, that’s when I noticed the jack screw was stripped, that piston wasn’t going anywhere, this caliper is way beyond rebuilding.

 

I don’t like doing things half way and I’ve always been a firm believer that when doing work like this, you do both sides, whether it’s needed or not, but not having the funds at the moment to do both sides, we’ll start with the passenger side for now, we’ll address the drivers side in a few days.

 

There’s something wrong with my camera so I’m not even going to try to upload pictures tonight, but I took a bunch and none of them were worthy of posting, so I’ll try to get some better pictures in a day or two.

 

At this point, (everything will be done in pairs, but I only have funds for the passenger side right now, I suspect that the drivers side is going to be worse.

 

The brake fluid is a nasty dirty black, it has to be completely flushed, I’m ordering a rebuilt caliper, as well as wheel bearings and hub seals, (I believe at this time that the axles are ok, the boots are intact and not torn on either side, at least not that I can tell)

 

if I'm completely flushing out the brake system, I figured this would be a good time to switch to DOT 4 brake fluid.

 

this is just more evidence that the car sat for a very long period of time before I got it, in my opinion, the brake system is badly contaminated.

 

As far as flushing the system, my guess is for now that my best bet is to pick up a big bottle of DOT 4 brake fluid, and just start pouring in through the master cylinder, and letting it drain out through the brake lines into some disposable containers.

 

I bet the loose axle nut caused a lot of that.

 

I'm sure GD has told you where to go for bearings that are the same quality, but at least 50% less expensive than what you'd get at an auto parts store.

 

The gravity bleeding you mentioned will work, but I hear it's best to do the 2-man system afterward to get every last drop of bad stuff out of there. I'm not sure why that's the case, but that's what I've heard.

 

Jacob

[maozebong]

you can replace one caliper without a doubt if your other one is fine. i do it all the time on the racecars i build when one gets roasted and locks up.

 

 

as for the bleeding get a piece of clear tubing and run it into a clear vessel for each corner. its a cheap one man bleeder that lets you see when you get clear fluid out of the caliper. but im sure you knew that trick already...

 

 

make sure you get plenty of dot4. it takes quite a bit to flush all the ************ and old dot3 out.

[Stubies Subie]

I've been researching the brake fluid types, IE: DOT 3 verses DOT 4 and DOT 5 and 5.1 and Glycol verses silicone.

 

We always want to use what's best, or at least what's best within our budget, and I found a link that describes the differences in detail.

 

The following link covers all types from DOT 3 to 5.1 and Glycol Verses Silicone, it gives the good and the bad of each, it is very much worth the read:

 

http://www.motorcycleproject.com/motorcycle/text/cows-brakefluid.html

[maozebong]

I've been researching the brake fluid types, IE: DOT 3 verses DOT 4 and DOT 5 and 5.1 and Glycol verses silicone.

 

We always want to use what's best, or at least what's best within our budget, and I found a link that describes the differences in detail.

 

The following link covers all types from DOT 3 to 5.1 and Glycol Verses Silicone, it gives the good and the bad of each, it is very much worth the read:

 

http://www.motorcycleproject.com/motorcycle/text/cows-brakefluid.html

 

if it makes you feel better, the race cars i build all get dot 4 fluid. they are right about the silicone/glycol mixed sludge, and its not really worth the effort to get it all out either. dot 4 can be poured in the master cylinder directly after the dot 3, but it sits on top of the dot3. you don't even need to fully empty out the MC either, making bleeding easier. after a bit of bleeding you get the dot4 out at wheel, and you should know by the color change in the fluid.

 

 

if dot 4 can stand up to rigorous track duty where brakes get glowing red hot and use competition friction compound pads, then it should be good enough for any old school soobie.

[Stubies Subie]

if dot 4 can stand up to rigorous track duty where brakes get glowing red hot and use competition friction compound pads, then it should be good enough for any old school soobie.

 

I picked up a big bottle of DOT 4 today, I've already got one caliper off, and already drained one side of the master cylinder (it siphoned out when I removed the caliper) I'll start flushing when the new caliper shows up and I can get it installed.

 

that old brake fluid is so nasty looking that I won't be surprised if I end up replacing the master cylinder as well, I got a hunch, as soon as I flush out the system, something else is gonna blow out, but it’s so dirty, that I want to make sure I get a really good flush, I want ALL that old fluid out of there.

 

I'm going to order the caliper and wheel bearings tonight, the wheel bearings I'm going to order are (6207-2RS/C3) I’ll get the stuff off eBay, the rebuilt calipers are something like 45.00 delivered, with no core deposit and the bearings are $8.something each, I don’t mind the wait because it gives me more time to do a thorough job of cleaning the parts and maybe doing some paint work while I wait for the parts to arrive, if the parts were readily available I’d end up being in a hurry and just slapping it back together, and down the road she goes.

 

I'd order the hub seals, but I'm not sure what to order or how many per axle, 1 or 2? I can get them local anyway if needed

 

I really wish I could get some pictures up here but my camera isn't doing well, all the pictures have come out really blurry, and in some sort of brownish gray scale looking format and I have no idea why.

 

As soon as I can get a camera that will take pictures worth posting, I'll have some more to show.

 

Stuart

Edited December 21, 2011 by Stubies Subie

[Meeky Moose]

i'm late but i used to tow all kinds of stuff with my wagon, definitely exceeding the weight limit.

from richmond to charlottesville, 70mph down the freeway no issues.. i just started out in 4low and went to 2h after 3rd gear.. it was easier on teh car.. and there was almost no tongue weight with the dolly..

[Stubies Subie]

i'm late but i used to tow all kinds of stuff with my wagon, definitely exceeding the weight limit.

from richmond to charlottesville, 70mph down the freeway no issues.. i just started out in 4low and went to 2h after 3rd gear.. it was easier on teh car.. and there was almost no tongue weight with the dolly..

 

That car is perfectly capable of towing, good story, thanks for sharing.

 

I hope to be towing this summer, but don't know if I'll have the car ready in time, I'm already looking at a nice little pop top camping trailer, a little light weight job that's designed to be towed behind a motorcycle.

 

it looks something like this:

 

I'm kind of methodically planning and doing the build, it's just slow going for me, but once I get the custom back bumper with 2" receiver, I'll be ready to tow.

 

I got a list a mile long of things I want to do to the car, so it’s going to be a long drawn out process before this ride is ever finished.