Starter related electrical issues

[jrmctaz]

I have a 93 Legacy L that has had a tricky starting routine - I would have to mess with the clutch with the key turned to the start position to find the sweet spot with the neutral safety switch - but it would start after a few attempts. Now the problem is, when you try this routine you get a couple clicks and nothing (the engine never cranks) - it appears to be a short somewhere because once the starter tries to kick the engine over, within 2 seconds the battery appears to be dead (the "door open" light is dimly lit and nothing else works). Now if it sits 15 - 20 minutes you can do it all again with the same result.

Here is the list of things I have tried - New Battery, even swapped my optima from my truck - not the battery. A new starter, bench tested it - worked fine, even hooked up the electrical in the car without mounting it - worked fine - no massive power draw. I thought maybe the ignition switch - I unhooked the starter solenoid wire and went through the routine and no loss of power; reconnect it and same issue. I even disconnected the alternator (not sure why, but I did) still no joy.

I have been considering trying to push start it to see if it is mechanical, seized, but that doesn't explain the massive electrical draw - it almost acts like it has some sort of thermal overload protection somewhere - the power returns when it adequately cools, but in all the threads I've read I have seen nothing quite like this. Any advise... I am running out of ideas.

[Legacy777]

So you tried putting in a new starter, you hooked up the electrical, and it spun without any issues? But when you put it in and tried to start the engine, it didn't work?

 

Yeah, I'd suggest trying to check if something is mechanically stuck. Can you turn the motor over by hand with a breaker bar/socket attached to the front crank pulley?

[Cougar]

I assume the engine was cranking over ok before you swapped the starter out so that would eliminate the engine as being the trouble. From what you say it makes me think there is a internal short on the switched side of the solenoid contacts. Some folks have had problems with a short when they change out the starter and connect the battery lead to the solenoid stud. They over tighten the stud bolt nut and that causes the stud to turn. The head inside the solenoid touches ground and so when they connect the battery lead to the battery there are big sparks. Simply turning the stud bolt back a little clears the problem. Your problem is on the other side of the solenoid switch contacts, when the solenoid is turned on. The problem may not have shown up when you tested it off of the car because the case of the starter was isolated from ground. If the starter has a warranty it may be easier to just return it and swap it for another one. If they question it then have them check the resistance between the switched solenoid contact and case of the starter. I think they will see a short.

[jrmctaz]

Thanks to those who responded, unfortunately I have been busy earning a living so the car had to wait until my break. Today I pulled the starter again - went to a junk yard and pulled a complete battery cable set up (+&-), a neutral safety switch and the backside of the ignition switch. I took the starter apart and cleaned it up and did some resistance checks to make sure it was in good shape. I started with the wiring harness and installed the starter - it worked? not really confident as to why but in ops checking it it starts ~90% of the time and there is a "new" clicking sound - kinda like a chattering solenoid - coming from somewhere in the lower dash region - I think I will go ahead with the safety switch but hold off on the ignition switch to see if I can pin point where the problem was. Thanks again...

[Cougar]

The trouble with the starter was explained in my previous post. It had a shorted fault condition on the starter side of the solenoid contacts. By working on it you apparently cleared the short. I'm not sure what is causing the relay or solenoid chatter.