CzarMohab Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 OK... I'm just going to start with a little back story first... This car was a daily driver from when I bought it at 205k miles until I upgraded to an '03 Baja a couple of years ago when it became a spare car. For a year or so it was driven only occasionally, maybe twice a month for local errands and the like (better fuel economy than the Baja for things like that). Eventually, it came time to sell it, and three days after it sold, deep in traffic and half way through a major intersection, the engine died, and would not start from that point onward. It was towed back to my house where it has sat for around a year or so. Long, sad story short, I just have not had the time, or money, or at various times both, to keep on it and make it work. Recent events (seized the engine on the Baja) have forced me into requiring getting this old beast back into operations, even if for just a short time. I was able to poke at it from time to time for about two months after it was parked, but due to time wasn't able to do anything with it beyond basic observations. This is what I found: -Engine would turn over, just wouldn't catch or start -Fuel filter had pressure to it (which I know now that I was supposed to depressurize that line first - live and learn) -After attempting a restart (to re-pressurize the fuel line) and then properly depressurizing the line, there was no pressure on either side of the fuel filter Irrelevant to the cause and the cure, I plan on replacing all 4 spark plugs, wires, distributor cap and rotor. I am also contemplating on replacing the fuel filter just to eliminate that as a possible cause. I won't be able to do any of these things until Friday at the earliest. I found this thread and plan on looking into the CTS. There is, however, one major hitch to all of this. About 4 months ago I got it into my mind to try to get it up and running again, but I couldn't get into the car! The key no longer worked in either door lock. Tried and failed with the trunk lock, but the key never really worked well there. After breaking into my own car I realized that the battery had died, and the key no longer worked in the ignition, either. It did, and still does, work just fine in the lock on the glove box - so unless those locks typically suck I can be reasonably sure that I have the right key; that lock does not turn with the other Subaru key I have from the late Vicki (86 GL-10 Wagon). It was around this time that I figured that the car wasn't worth the short time that I had and I would just pick a weekend and a paycheck and go all out... Now that I am more or less forced into using this car, I do have the battery on a charger (it is holding the charge, just taking forever to get to full) and will be re-installing the battery to see if that might clear up the key issues, though I highly doubt that it will change much. The battery does need to be charged to eventually get it to start, so at least there's that going in my favor. My questions are: -Is there anything that would prevent the key from turning the ignition or door locks, under any circumstance? I am pretty sure that if the key is itself the issue I can get it replaced, I just want to make sure that a new key won't have the same issue; and if I don't have to pay a lock smith, so much the better. -Is there a list of things to look into (once the key issue is resolved) not already mentioned (heck - even if they are mentioned I wouldn't mind hearing them again) that may be preventing the engine from starting? Additional Details: -As the title suggests, its an 88 GL Sedan -EA-82 engine, the EA-82 is in a box in the "stamp" on the engine - i know that that box is significant, I just don't remember why exactly - it is FI, non-turbo and ran fine before this. -All fluids are where they are supposed to be considering that the engine is cold. Oil spots on the ground seem to suggest otherwise -Engine ran fine up until it quit - there were no signs indicating a future failure (e.g. surging, lack of power, stuttering, etc.) -Car was originally sold in Southern California, I know somewhere I read that some engines/cars from the "everything causes cancer" state had special mods, I don't know if this one does or not. -235k miles with ~36k on a new (not rebuilt) 3AT FWD tranny. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. If you need any further information, let me know. I won't be able to do anything major until I can either move the car into a garage (key issue prevents unlocking the steering wheel) or Friday when I can have the entire day to poke at it... As it is I only have about an hour before the sun goes down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Locks are sticky from sitting so long. Spray some wd-40 into them with straw. Then, check to see if the rotor spins when cranked. if not, broken timing belt. mosty likely culprit if it was running then just died. No fuel presure after opening the system and then cranking cause the ECU won't power the pump unless it sees spark (spinning disty.....broken belt means no spinning disty) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Most likey quit running with a broken timing belt. No damage at all. New belts will have it running the same. If you want to verify that the fuel pump is working, plug in the green test connectors under the hood, and turn on the key. This will cycle the fuel pump off and on. You can take off the steering column covers to remove the ignition switch to start the car with a screwdriver. This will allow you to run the car, but the steering will still be locked. As stated above, verify that the rotor is turning when craning. If not, check the set screw for the rotor if it has fallen out. It could be just that simple. Otherwise, if the screw is there, the timing belt had fails. which is most likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 8, 2012 Author Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) I don't mind getting dirty, greasy, bloody, or anything else that comes with working on an EA-82; however, I have rather large hands and forearms... Anything between the radiator and the engine proper is indeed my least favorite place to work on these. So please don't take this the wrong way, but I hope you are wrong and the timing belts are not the issue. The way my luck runs: one of them catastrophically failed into 300,000,000 micro-pieces, taking both tensioners, one of the idler pulleys and the other belt with it when it went. _OR_ its a loose wire not previously discussed, or even thought about... Also - my WD-40 is in my tackle box in the bed of my Baja in a repair shop not easily arrived at by bus, bike or foot (yeah, they are cheap and easily replaced) and if I had a car that ran right now, I could go get it. How's that for irony? Edited February 8, 2012 by CzarMohab Add'l info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) ..._OR_ its a loose wire not previously discussed, or even thought about... Like Fusible Links? Edited February 8, 2012 by Loyale 2.7 Turbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 9, 2012 Author Share Posted February 9, 2012 Brief update: Very probably not the immaculate, looks like new distributor cap or distributor rotor. Pix of it tomorrow, feeling not really up to it right now. I firmly believe that whoever designed the steering wheel cover area should be smacked in the head with a rather large trout. Sun went down so I'm done for the night. Any other thoughts would be greatly appreciated... Things like is there an easy way to check the timing belts without dismantling everything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKghandi Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 You can drill out the steering lock pin if you can't find the key. But most of the time just about any Subaru key will work. No wd-40? Olive oil works too it's just a Pain to get into the lock. As for checking the t belts, take the cap of the disty jump the starter if the rotor spins at least the drivers side is intact I have seen a few of these run On only the drivers side belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 10, 2012 Author Share Posted February 10, 2012 Last nights photos of interest: Found a tiny drop of ???? in the bottom of the intake manifold/throttle body/thingie on top - keep in mind I still haven't cranked the engine in ... well I forget exactly how long but I would think that a drop of gas would have evaporated by now. inside the disty cap. Disty rotor. Note that the droplet looking thing is just a shadow. Rotor was firm in place. Sparky wires looked good (e.g. no cracks, breaks, etc.). Wasn't able to pull the plugs due to the sun going down. Can't get back into it tonight because of the rain. Can't push it into the garage because of the key issue. On that - the best way to really describe it is it feels like i just have the wrong key - goes in but won't turn (except the retarded glove box lock). I will be oiling the locks in the (predicted) sunshine tomorrow; but if that doesn't do it then I can only assume that somehow the key has worn down just enough to not work. Maybe being on a key ring that sees pocket and other keys daily helped that. Also tomorrow the timing belts will be looked at. Not really looking forward to that. And, most importantly, Thank You All for the help so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Timing belts are easier than you think. You can remove the outer cover to inspect the alignment. go on the youtube and watch "art of subaru maintenance" series which covers timing belt and distributor alignment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 Timing belts are easier than you think. You can remove the outer cover to inspect the alignment. go on the youtube and watch "art of subaru maintenance" series which covers timing belt and distributor alignment. Timing belts are easy when they are not in 300,000,000 pieces and wrapped around some of the parts that go roundy roundy... The way my luck runs: one of them catastrophically failed into 300,000,000 micro-pieces... ...It did. Driver's side. Blech... ...taking both tensioners... ...Nope, just one. Driver's side. More accurately, the shiny part of the tensioner seems to indicate that it failed (stopped going roundy roundy) first, taking the belt with it... ...one of the idler pulleys... ...Almost. Cleaned out the belt fragments and it works again... ...and the other belt with it when it went. ...It tried and failed... Think I spent more time cleaning the teeth of all the gears (both sides) than I did ripping the front end of the engine all apart to get to the timing belts. I was really hoping that it was something else. I really hate squeezing these giant paws into the tiny openings to turn tiny bolts... Mostly just bad memories and scars from being in a similar spot with a water pump on an 86 a couple years back. Pictures when I can, there's some awesomeness in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertsubaru Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 If you have big hands and arms take the radiator out for more clearance to the timing belts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 If you have big hands and arms take the radiator out for more clearance to the timing belts. Wasn't an option this time. Honestly - I would have loved to just yanked the engine and done all the work at a comfortable level and spacing... Everything is back in place and all tightened up. Have an extra 10mm bolt now, not sure why. Not really concerned, I think its just to the TB cover. Waiting on the locksmith to actually make a working key based on the lock. Spent two hours on it and nothing came out. At least I know that someone won't be able to use this as a method of stealing the car. I promised some pictures so here they are (possibly not dial-up friendly): I have also come to the conclusion that if I ever own a non-metric vehicle, I'll need to re-buy 90% of the tools I have in the standard equivalent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 17, 2012 Author Share Posted February 17, 2012 its alive!!! thanks all for the help. couldn't have done it without you. She's still got some dust to shake off before I can say she's back to where she was (accelerates about as fast as a dead elk rolling down hill... very slow at first then... zippy), but at least its running and driving. If it doesn't get any better I know where to find you all for help Special thanks for the Art of Subaru Maintenance #08. Without that I probably wouldn't be running right now, and would have bugged you all with more questions easily answered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Woof. That's just ugly in there. Glad you got wheels again. Not to worry the Baja will get all tuned up shortly GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CzarMohab Posted February 21, 2012 Author Share Posted February 21, 2012 What a difference a tooth makes... Had driver's side timing belt off by one tooth... Managed to get into and out of the timing belts in record (for me anyway) time, 1.5 hrs, and its like driving a totally different car now. Went from 0 power and 0 acceleration to spinning the tires (ok ok... it rained a little and the ground was wet...) and beating a Mustang off the line (ok - so maybe he wasn't paying attention when the light changed... still impressive for 77 horses of fury!). Ended up changing air, oil and fuel filters, and the spark plugs after it was back to normal. Now its even more peppy than it was. I still need to fix the exhaust leak at the muffler (Friday she gets a new one) and eventually the suspension, and a laundry list of minor tweaks and fixes, but its alive, and that, I think, is what matters most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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