987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 My 98 legacy has contracted a weird issue it didn't have before it sat for 5 months. When I decelerate there's a sort of whirring noise from the back right wheel. It doesn't do it when driving a constant speed or accelerating, just decelerating foot off the gas. It isn't related to the brakes, if I push the brakes or pull the parking brake handle the noise persists, and doesn't change at all. So probably not anything to do with brakes. Furthermore, if I push the brakes, and push the gas at the same time (but still slowing down) the noise is still there. If I then push the gas a bit more to maintain a constant speed, the noise goes away. Also, it doesn't matter what gear the automatic transmission is in. If I put it in N going up a hill, it'll make the noise as it slows down. Maybe just a bit quieter. There's no play in the wheel, no handling problems. I took the caliper off. Slide pins are free, pads move freely. Greased it all up anyway. Took off the rotor. Parking brake isn't rubbing and it's all working properly. Also, by whirring noise, it's more of a cross between the sound of a wheel bearing and brakes dragging. It's not the kind of whirring a bad diff makes. What could this possibly be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Could it be the backing plate rubbing on the rotor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Miles? Too soon to tell. Possibilites of axle or wheel bearing beginnings. Wheel bearings much more common. Try paying attention to sound on gentle(not sharp) bends at speed. That's where I usually notice wheel bearing noise first. Those rear axles in my experience rarely go bad, but a look at rear axle boots may be worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) Could be the backing plate. I can take a quick look. I don't think the axles are leaking any, but I have a bunch of spares (because they never fail...). So if one is bad, that's not a big deal. It doesn't have the same grumbly sound a wheel bearing makes. But then I REALLY don't want it to be a wheel bearing. I'll try doing some cornering while it's making the sound. I absolutely hate getting those rear knuckles off. I always have to saw the damn long bolt into three pieces and destroy the bushings... Isn't it wonderful working on cars in maine.... Car has 242,000 miles. With the failure rate of rear wheel bearings on these cars, it's probably been done before. Edited February 11, 2012 by 987687 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 If you've got parts cars (and even if you don't) I replace that whole rear stub rather than fight that lateral link bolt. I find it easier, less frustrating, and cheaper. You can find a recent thread (and the criticism for taking this swap the stub route) here but it was talking about the front stub. And you're probably correct it's already been replaced. Which swerves into the discussion of whether the last bearing replacement screwed it up and now it'll wear bearings no matter what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I would suggest wheel bearing by how it sounds. My father in law's forester had a whining sound. We took it in to replace the wheel bearing. After the work, there was still a bit of noise form the other side, although the bearing checked out. The forester has drum brakes. Is there a difference in steering response from one way or the other. Does the noise come or go while making maneuvers such as lane changes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 stupid, obvious thought. Sometimes tires that are "feathered" from wear at a certain corner car start to make noise under certain conditions. May be worth rotating for kicks. Doesn't take any money and not much time. If you're gonna recheck the backing plate you're half way there anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 stupid, obvious thought. Sometimes tires that are "feathered" from wear at a certain corner car start to make noise under certain conditions. May be worth rotating for kicks. Doesn't take any money and not much time. If you're gonna recheck the backing plate you're half way there anyways. Huh, now there's a good thought! It does kind of sound like a tire wear thing, it's that type of sound more than anything. I'll go do that now. They are old RE92a tires that I got for free... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 Swapped the back wheels. The noise persists... Didn't change anything. No backing plate rubbing or anything. There actually isn't much backing plate left... Rusty rusty. It makes slightly less noise cornering left, which I find odd. But it doesn't get louder cornering right. I suppose if it is a wheel bearing it's not very bad and can probably go many thousand miles before it's a real problem. I don't mind doing it in summer when I can ride my moped around, etc. I hate doing work like this when it's freezing cold out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Since tire rotation didn't change the sound of the noise, I am thinking you have a wheel bearing going out. The big clue is change of noise, when cornering. That is what a bad bearing is known to do. I am no wheel bearing expert, but seem to remember reading here that you can drive quite some time & millage on a worn wheel bearing without a problem. Others may chime in to agree or disagree with me. I am with you, it is much better doing driveway repairs, when it is not freezing cold outside. So, you may be able to wait a while on doing repairs. You may want to "search" info here on this forum regarding wheel bearing, and see what has been written in the past. For what it is worth, I am the guy who just replaced a front spindle/knuckle on my 99 OBW, with a used one from a wrecking yard. I am sold on this approach, as it avoids all the nasty work of R & R bearing replacement. I have never done a rear bearing unit, but I bet complete spindle unit can be had from a yard for the rear as well. My yard gave me a 30 day guarantee on the spindle/knuckle they sold me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 As I have said before.....it's junk, you might as well sell it to me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'm not going to replace it with a junk yard part. I don't want to have to deal with it again. It's not the end of the world getting the spindle off, I've done it enough times working at a shop. I've even replaced rear bearings. But working at the shop I had a press and all the right sized dies to press the bearings properly. Now I'd just take the parts to a local machine shop and have them do it, they'd probably only charge $40 for a job like that. The guy does all the bearing work for a few small garages and knows what he's doing with bearings, so I trust him not to screw it up. I have a small cramped up garage with a reddy heater, if it's blowing at me I don't freeze. And I have other cars to drive. I'll just let it be for a while, bearings can go a very long time before they do any damage to the spindle. As I have said before.....it's junk, you might as well sell it to me! $2500 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Run it! It'll start howling some day - perhaps when it's warmer. And I've swapped more rear stubs than front ones. Even with a hub tamer kind of service set there is the possibility of screwing up where the bearing goes in, even screwing it up for future bearings. That lateral link bolt in the rust belt isn't something I wanna mess with at all. The bolts that hold the entire assy on are easier/more accessable to me and more cooperative. Trailing arms and all will come with a complete stub. On VW's I replace the bearings. On Subaru's I install a used stub. It's your car, do what you want. The first time I was gonna just do the RR wheel bearing. After I started chewing at that lateral link bolt and priced the parts that go with the bolt, I decided it wasn't worth it to me. And if the reinstall would have gone poorly I would have been screwed. Not the bearing install but that long lateral bolt. I had the whole stub delivered for like 100.00 with a 6 month warranty. And IMO much easier to install. And no special tools to borrow or buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 I can get the whole thing at a local wrecking yard for about $40. But doesn't come with lat links, so I'd still have to get the big bolt out. If I go the route of pulling the lat links off, I usually have to cut the bolts off the inside. Really can't win up here with the level of rusty stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I buy a larger stub so I don't have to mess with that lateral link bolt - that's the whole idea. If I add up the bearing (a good one - I never go cheap), the bolt and some bushings from what I remember that the bold goes through it starts to get up there in cost. And still a lot of very unpleasant work to do. And cutting with a sawzall and/or burning the rubber bushing off that lateral link bolt isn't a pleasant afternoon. Either way will work. Place your money and make your bet. Just wanted to point out that all the hassle surrounding the wheel bearing job(removal of stub to take to the press) and reinstall is more work than having the bearing swap done by someone with a press. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 I buy a larger stub so I don't have to mess with that lateral link bolt - that's the whole idea. If I add up the bearing (a good one - I never go cheap), the bolt and some bushings from what I remember that the bold goes through it starts to get up there in cost. And still a lot of very unpleasant work to do. And cutting with a sawzall and/or burning the rubber bushing off that lateral link bolt isn't a pleasant afternoon. Either way will work. Place your money and make your bet. Just wanted to point out that all the hassle surrounding the wheel bearing job(removal of stub to take to the press) and reinstall is more work than having the bearing swap done by someone with a press. I've sawzalled a lot of the $22 bolts out. Because since the inner lat link bolts never come out, it's easier. And the last job I did on my car was sawzall the bell housing off a seized engine... There isn't much that's a bigger pain in the rump roast than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 On decel only? With the amount of miles, I would think its a rear diff. Wheel bearings make noise whenever the vehicles moving, especially when they're real bad. Granted I also have seen wheel bearings make no noise and be totally loose but that's usually impact related. Try swapping the rear diff and see what it does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) On decel only? With the amount of miles, I would think its a rear diff. Wheel bearings make noise whenever the vehicles moving, especially when they're real bad. Granted I also have seen wheel bearings make no noise and be totally loose but that's usually impact related. Try swapping the rear diff and see what it does. So tonight I did more playing around on my drive back from a date... It almost completely goes away coasting in N. So ya... diff maybe. I gave away my spare 4.44 diff a while ago.... I'll see if I can get the top drain plug out tomorrow and take a look at the gear oil. I'll need to get a pump to change it, it's a real pain to fill them up without having a pump... been there, done that. If the diff is bad maybe I'll try to get a 4.44 LSD out of a FXT Edited February 12, 2012 by 987687 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 No pump needed. Just remove the lower plug to drain, and then the upper plug to fill. You just use the squirt bottle that the gear oil comes in. Just squeeze it until the diff is full, and put the plug back in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 No pump needed. Just remove the lower plug to drain, and then the upper plug to fill. You just use the squirt bottle that the gear oil comes in. Just squeeze it until the diff is full, and put the plug back in. I changed it in the GL trying to do this. There's no way to get the bottle up there because the gas tank is in the way. I ended up having to put it in a little container and fill it tiny bits at a time. It wasn't any fun. Maybe the Legacy is different... I'm also not sure I'll get the plugs out. They completely rusted to death. That's why I haven't done anything with it... heh. I have a nice collection if diffs though, so if those plugs strip out I'll just put a different cover on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 My XT rear diff was rusted bad too, and those came out, so hopefully yours will too. Yeah the Legacy should be different. But even if the bottle isn't up high, you should still be able to squeeze it and have it shoot right in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I have rigged a tube, held the bottle in the wheel well to get it above the diff/transaxle and squooze from there. It can make a mess. But without a pump I've done htis on Subaru diff's and old VW transaxles. If you're doing it on a cold day with gear lube it'll be too thick most likely. I actually have an old crock pot in teh garage for heating things liek this up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 I have rigged a tube, held the bottle in the wheel well to get it above the diff/transaxle and squooze from there. It can make a mess. But without a pump I've done htis on Subaru diff's and old VW transaxles. If you're doing it on a cold day with gear lube it'll be too thick most likely. I actually have an old crock pot in teh garage for heating things liek this up. It's gonna be well below freezing today. I'll put the gear oil in the house by the fireplace for a little while before hand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 So I pulled a fresh bottle of gear oil out of the store room... Brewed it for half an hour by the fireplace The level was just a touch low, but not that bad. The oil that came out was a rich amber colour. But not black. It still had a nice viscosity too. I'd driven the car about 15 miles prior to draining, and it wasn't hot/over heated. It was just a tad warm. It's about 15 deg out... The magnetic plug on the bottom only had a very fine dusting on it, not a huge mountain like I was dreading. All in all, it looked a lot better than I was expecting. Looked inside the holes with a flashlight, and the gears all look fine. No scoring or anything like that on the gear faces. I was expecting it to look like the black watery stuff that came out of the front diff... Anyway, went on a test ride. And I can't say if the noise has really changed any. But I don't think it's the diff, just because the oil looked fine, no metal, and the gears looked good. I don't know what it could be now... I'll have to do some more experimenting around.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Often you can tell a wheel bearing by turning the wheel and holding a hand on the related spring. Nice to have both sides off the ground at the same time to compare. But again if it's just starting to fail there may not be much vibration to feel. You may just have to run it until it gets worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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