Head Gasket options?

[suprunner]

I'm doing all my research for my future EJ22 swap. There's a U-pull-it near me that I can pull the motor and harness at for $285. Of the EJ22 donors that they have, mileage is between 145k to 220k. Do the block internals need attention in these motors? I've heard that the EA motors are bomb-proof when talking about the block...But I really know nothing about the EJ's.

My main question has to deal with the head gaskets. I plan on replacing them no matter what. Is there anybody that makes a Multi-Layer Steel HG for these motors? ARP studs? I've heard of people reusing EJ head bolts, but coming from Toyota experience I'm worried about the "effective stretching" that happens with them. . .

I just got done working on my Toyota Supra 7MGE motor, and it now has a MLS HG with ARP studs. Anything worthwhile/ trusted?

 

Thanks,

 

Greg

[GeneralDisorder]

Not worth replaceing the HG's on the 2.2. Most of them go their entire life (usually about ~350k to 500k) without blowing them.

 

In the Subaru world, Head bolts are never replaced..... NEVER.

 

Find a recycler and get a known good runner with compression numbers, etc for $400 to $600 and call it good.

 

What are you swapping the EJ into?

 

GD

[idosubaru]

+1 to GD's comments.

 

EJ22 headgaskets dont fail unless the motor was overheated....which you don't want anyway since overheating is bad for oil and bearings too. Get one from a wreck and it's going to last the life of the vehicle if you care to maintain it properly.

 

Subaru's = never replace headbolts. That's a materials driven question, don't borrow techniques from other manufacturers who use different processes and materials.

[suprunner]

Not worth replaceing the HG's on the 2.2. Most of them go their entire life (usually about ~350k to 500k) without blowing them.

 

In the Subaru world, Head bolts are never replaced..... NEVER.

 

Find a recycler and get a known good runner with compression numbers, etc for $400 to $600 and call it good.

 

What are you swapping the EJ into?

 

GD

 

Thank you for the advice. Currently I have a '92 Loyale. Although it has served me very well, rust has started like wildfire. The city that I live in doesn't plow or put sand on the roads. They just heavily salt them. . . So I've been thinking of finding a GL, or GL-10. I want the dual range T-case... I figure that after purchasing doors and a transmission from a junkyard, I'll be in as much as another wagon. If I can find a clean GL-10, I might not even do the EJ swap. I have a light foot, so I believe that a Turbo would be a viable option for efficient power gain. I mainly want the extra "oomph" for the mountain passes that I frequent in the winter. . .

This should be a different thread, but since I have your attention... I've noticed that a lot of the cars on this (awesome) forum are using 15" wheels with lifts. Does the larger diameter plus extra rotational mass kill any gained power (of the EJ), fuel economy, or the drive train components? I was under the assumption that there aren't options to regearing? With Toyota's, there's a large aftermarket selection that makes bigger tires an option without killing the driveline. . . All of the lifts that I've seen seem to be spacer-kits. . . My understanding is that this doesn't necessarily increase suspension travel... Is the stock travel ample enough to do crawling?

 

Thank you,

 

Greg

[suprunner]

+1 to GD's comments.

 

EJ22 headgaskets dont fail unless the motor was overheated....which you don't want anyway since overheating is bad for oil and bearings too. Get one from a wreck and it's going to last the life of the vehicle if you care to maintain it properly.

 

Subaru's = never replace headbolts. That's a materials driven question, don't borrow techniques from other manufacturers who use different processes and materials.

 

 

Thank you. I'm curious about the materials aspect of this because... Toyota, Yamaha, Honda, and Subaru are Asian companies. I know that Yamaha made Heads for Toyota, and Honda. That's just one example. In the bicycle industry, there's the same kind of inter-company production/collaboration that goes on between Japan, China, and Taiwan. . . My assumption would be that these manufacturing techniques would be similar, or that there is more intermingling of parts collaborations. I'm assuming that at a minimum, Head bolts would be a Grade-8 (minimum). . . That's a very high quality metal material. Again, I know that they're at a higher grade, but I'm using "8" as an example. Even with that high of quality/tolerance they still stretch/deviate from factory specifications over time...Am I over-thinking this? Did Subaru really make their materials greater? I'm just very "gun-shy" from working on various Toyotas. From those experiences, I'm used to getting to the guts and building it back up fresh in order to feel confident. . . I just don't want to spend the money, and time, then need to get back in there again down the road. . .

 

Thanks,

 

Greg

[idosubaru]

Am I over-thinking this?

yes.

 

Did Subaru really make their materials greater?g

not necessarily "greater" - just a different design protocol. with most design choices there are advantages and drawbacks to both.

 

they are called torque to yield bolts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque-to-yield_fastener

you can google and research more.

 

Subaru doesn't use them.

 

I'm just very "gun-shy" from working on various Toyotas.

right on, i hear you. i have experienced shocks working on other vehicles that are far different than i would have anticipated from Subaru's. Heck Subaru on ocassion can confuse me. LOL I am more familiar with TTY headbolts than you are so you don't need to explain, i know exactly where you're coming from, those are nothing new and quite common. But Subaru doesn't use them.

 

good thing about new headbolts is they are clean, no need to wipe down the threads of the old headbolts. that's the most value you'll get for your dollar on those. in the end it doesn't really matter - this is a win-win because either way you choose you get the same result.

[suprunner]

yes.

 

not necessarily "greater" - just a different design protocol. with most design choices there are advantages and drawbacks to both.

 

they are called torque to yield bolts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque-to-yield_fastener

you can google and research more.

 

Subaru doesn't use them.

 

right on, i hear you. i have experienced shocks working on other vehicles that are far different than i would have anticipated from Subaru's. Heck Subaru on ocassion can confuse me. LOL I am more familiar with TTY headbolts than you are so you don't need to explain, i know exactly where you're coming from, those are nothing new and quite common. But Subaru doesn't use them.

 

good thing about new headbolts is they are clean, no need to wipe down the threads of the old headbolts. that's the most value you'll get for your dollar on those. in the end it doesn't really matter - this is a win-win because either way you choose you get the same result.

 

Thanks! I'll have to read into it more.

[MilesFox]

The newer subaru engines with MLS gaskets are the ones that fail, and therefore your presumptions to do the HG preemptively.

 

The older ej22e in 89-96 legacy and 93-97 impreza use the composite HG's that last the life of the engine with proper cooling system maintenance.

 

Don't worry about bottom ends unless you ran out of oil. Take the heads of a 300,000 mile engine and you still see crosshatches in the bore.

[suprunner]

The newer subaru engines with MLS gaskets are the ones that fail, and therefore your presumptions to do the HG preemptively.

 

The older ej22e in 89-96 legacy and 93-97 impreza use the composite HG's that last the life of the engine with proper cooling system maintenance.

 

Don't worry about bottom ends unless you ran out of oil. Take the heads of a 300,000 mile engine and you still see crosshatches in the bore.

 

Thank you for the good words. So what, if anything, should I take precaution with when installing these motors? Is A/C possible?

 

Thanks,

 

Greg

[idosubaru]

Thank you for the good words. So what, if anything, should I take precaution with when installing these motors?

install a metal separator plate on the rear of the engine. adjust the valves and install new valve cover gaskets. install a timing belt kit off ebay with all new pulleys and tensioner. reseal the oil pump and tigthen the backing plate screws on it - usually one or a few are loose. all of that is well talked about and covered here. install new cam seals and cam orings.