maugli Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Hi Guys, First time writing here but been reading for a while. There has been many threads on a swap of EJ25D for Ej22. I might have missed it, But i really did not see any feedback on performance of the OBW with 2.2. Is it worth to lose 20 HP on a swap. How much difference is there with 3 people? If there is a write up on this please point me toward it. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prwa101 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 haha someone just aked this same quistion two days ago. ill be doing the swap when my ej25 goes. much more reliable, youll feel no diffrence in loss of power people say. and the ej22 is non interference not like the ej25. waaaay better -Prwa AAE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishy Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Putting a 2.2 in place of a broken 2.5 is common and highly recommended. While you have the 2.2 on a hoist or bench you should really do the timing belt, idlers, water pump, and other such upkeep items and then shove it into the car and enjoy it for the remaining life of the body. I'm pretty sure the 2.2 from 96 and up ARE interference motors though which makes the often-neglected timing belt an important item when you have great access to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 I have read about it. That thread did not address the comparability after the swap. I have several 95 ej22 ready to go instead of ej25D. I have built a few ej22s for experimental aircraft use. There are many of these little engines flying in rotor craft and airplanes. I just wondered, since the OBW is a bit heavier then the L wagon and has the larger diameter tires, how much of a difference people that have done the swap do see. But i will trust your opinion and install a 2.2 in to 98 OBW with 132K on it. But i do appreciate everyone's response on this matter. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 The thr4ad on top is a good read... told you i am blind.. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 i have swapped an ej22 into a 97 GT and a 98 obw. the GT was worse than the outback. both of those cars have the 4.44 final drive ratio, but the GT has smaller tires than the outback. larger than the legacy, but smaller than the outback. this makes it ''quicker'' off the line and sportier. but at 75 mph on the hiway there just isn't a whole lot of umph left when passing. you can punch it so it down shifts but then you are in higher RPMs. i have since put on outback struts and larger tires and ti runs much better. i went to outback tires bot that threw the speed o off so i am now running in between tires. larger then legacy and GT but smaller than outback. the speedo is happy, i'm happy and the car has good acceleration and power. the 98 outback with the ej22 is fine. it isn't a sports car, but it runs fine , goes fast and does the job. most drivers who have done this swap say you cannot tell the difference. i always thought that an ej22 with a manual trans would be a perfect match. they offered this in 96 from the factory, but not since. but i don't own / drive manual trans cars. oh well. in the 90s, most of the legacys were offered in the european and asian markets with the ej18. in the US the legacy was only offered with the ej22. i don't think the same can be said for the outbacks but i don't really know. i do know there are a lot of ej20s in asian cars and we never saw those in legacys so if you are into ""POWER"" find and rebuild an ej25 or swap in a turbo engine. but if you are into going to work, going to the store, picking your kids up, and going on vacation, swap in an ej22. you will never regret it. i haven't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I have a 99 with the 2.5, and a 98 that I had a 2.2 put into. Both are automatic. I drive both, so I "hands on" experience on a side by side basis. Yea, the 2.2 looses some power, when compared to the 2.5. In most daily driving, the loss is not a big deal. In merging onto on going traffic on an interstate ramp, full throttle is weak, but again you get used to it. Switching to the 2.2 is a good solution, when a 2.5 craps out. I would do it again for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 15, 2012 Author Share Posted June 15, 2012 now that is a confidant answers. Then 2.2 it is :-) Thank YOU gentlemen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 25, 2012 Author Share Posted June 25, 2012 Well.., the swap went uneventful. Everything bolted on like it should. Took me 6 hrs by my self. Took it for a drive.. and Speedometer is not moving. GOt a code for a speed sensor A. TO late to look at it. The most important thing is. The power loss is negligible. 98 OBW with 2.2 is a definite winner. Want to go faster?... press harder on a pedal. No more ej25D for me. Not worth it. I would rather build a Frankenstein. Pj yeah.. the airbag light is on... and it is a manual read? Sucks!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 you probably forgot to plug in the speed sensor connetor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 25, 2012 Author Share Posted June 25, 2012 checked before work this morning... the sensor is plugged in. will look this evening Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 i perfer the 2.2 with the 2.5d heads i like to keep the heads with car if at all posibble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 26, 2012 Author Share Posted June 26, 2012 what advantage to that? i heard of 2.2 heads on the 2.5D block but not the other way around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted June 26, 2012 Author Share Posted June 26, 2012 BTW, the sensor was bad. easy enough to test . Just have another set of eyes with ignition on inside the car monitoring the speedo needle. Unplug the sensor and plug in the working sensor . Then rotate the sensor with your fingers. If needle moves... the comp and cluster OK. Lucky i had a used sensor in the tool box. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted June 26, 2012 Share Posted June 26, 2012 The addvantage is that the heads match the intake and give better power out of the 2.2 was not the heads that were problem on the 2.5d was the bottom end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share Posted July 5, 2012 Well. the car drives fine. a do get the Check engine light coming on every few days or so. P1156 undocumented code. something to do with MAF :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 Sorry it is not an P1156 it is 1143 undocumented code and EGR flow code showed up... i wonder why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Like you, I have a 98 with an EJ22 motor installed. My "new" motor came from a 95 Subie. I had a shop do the installation last Fall, and the results have been good. I am guessing that your old EJ25 motor had EGR. Some EJ22 motors did not have EGR, and maybe yours does not. If this is the case, then you will constantly have a code displayed for EGR malfunction. On my EJ22, there are a couple of vacuum hoses that are not used. I think they may have been for gas vapor reclamation. My installer screwed bolts into the hoses to seal them off. I hope these thoughts are a help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 Hey Rooster. My 2.2 has an EGR. But looks like i have licked that code. I did pull the front canister from the donor car and also the vacuum switch from the right strut tower. The Map can stay the same. All the hoses plug in. If you look at the vacuum diagrams you can figure out how the hoses go. no 1143 fro three days now.. :-) but P0106 came up yesterday. have to deal with that now. Here is another thought. During the swap, we were told to leave the Torque converter from 2.5 and keep the flex plate from 2.5. I wonder if anyone has tried to mover the 2.2 torque converter with flex plate in the OB. Turning a smaller diameter will increase torque . the torque converter should fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Flexplate's are identical. But just to be sure I keep the TC and flexplate from the 2.5 when putting a 2.2 in it. I've always been able to get the vacuum lines correct. If the car it's going into is a 98 or later with the charcoal canister near the filler tube it just takes a little more plumbing work up front with the small rubber lines.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 the torque converter in the 2.5 trans is larger in diameter, and therefore the flex plate is also larger in diameter. i know this because i failed to change the flex plate on my first ej22 swap and i had to pull the engine back out to replace it. the 2.5 TC also holds more fluid, because it is larger, so the 2.5 trans uses more fluid than the 2.2 trans. about a pint i think. there are lots of ways to solve the vac line issues, any one that works is fine. what is the p0106 code for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I've got a pile of flexplates. They all seem to be the same. Most are marked 95 2.2 so perhaps they are all 2.2's. BUt oouldn' tsee how I'd have that many of just 2.2's around. I must not of saved them when scrapping 2.5 cars with bad tranny's after pulling the engines for some reason. I stand correccted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 The 2.2l flexplate has a deeper dish to it to take up the space of the smaller torque converter. It won't let you fully seat the engine if you try putting it on a 2.5l transmission and tc. Found that out the hard way the first time I did a swap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maugli Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 I think i have sold the P0106 code by installing a front canister and plugging the hose from the T. The torque question is still bothers me. I do believe the casing of the engines and trans are same size. The TC on 2.2 is smaller and has a different stall speed. Theoretically one should be able to install a 2.2 TC on to a 2.5 trans and drive it. I would like to test it on a dyno and see what would it do. But don't have the dyno. Turning the smaller diameter will increase the torque. I will visit a local factory in town and see if they will let me play with a dyno. A wish... but one never knows... maybe they will. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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