1987 Brat 4WD, 4spDR

[aba4430]

Guys,

 

This is my first post, so is a bit drawn out. I just joined the list last week. I bought my 87 Brat in 1993 with ~63K original miles. It has seen little use since the clutch started slipping @ early 90K mileage; has ~99.5K original miles now. We still drive it for taking stuff to the recycling center or the dogs to the vet, but I want to get it fixed up so I can start using it more routinely. Structurally/mechanically, it is in excellent condition.

 

My first mission is to get the clutch fixed and I had decided to get it done professionally at a Sub dealership, but when I heard it was at or above $700 for the job, I started rethinking. Then I joined this board. Heard about it from someone I sold 3 of my 1991 Legacy Factory service manuals (our 1991 Legacy AWD SW was totalled in 1993 in Harrisburg, PA), a few months ago. This is an excellent list with plenty of encouraging type information for the do-it-your-selfers. So now I want to attempt the replacement myself. One advantage is that I have a daily driver and so do not care if the job takes me more than just a few days.

 

I also owned a 1981 2WD 2DR hatchback GL that I bought at 16K miles in 1987, drove for almost 145K miles prior to selling it in 1999. The car is still running from what I hear. I have the "How to keep your Subaru alive" (through 1984 models) book by Larry Owens and it was invaluable in helping me keep the 1981 car in tip top mechanical condition. I hear there is an updated version of this book available now (through 1988). However, there are instructions included in the older version of the book on how to remove the Engine and I am assuming the instructions for the 1984 Brat included will apply to the 1987 Brat.

 

I would appreciate any advice, pep talk etc. as I have done nothing beyond driveshaft replacements, valve adjustments (HB only), brakes, water pump/radiator removal & installation, oil pump replacements, starters, alternators, distributors etc. between the 3 Subaru's (very little to the Legacy and the Brat). I am willing to purchase the monster engine hoist that Sam's Club sells for ~$170 to make my job easier. Plus I believe that Subaru prices are the best for a Clutch kit. After the clutch repair, there are several other items I want to tackle also and will keep in touch with the board for advice and/or updates.

 

Sincerely,

 

aba

[northguy]

Do a few searches for clutch repair, visit the repair manual section of the board, take a weekend and go to CT and visit Moosens - learn from the master - and then you'll be ready to tackle about anything the Brat has to throw at you. Just beware that if the body is in good shape, there will be those of the dark side that will attempt to disuade you from repairing it. The give away will be "...but of course, you could sell it to me. It's not worth much, though...." If it's not all rusty, hang onto it. A Brat that is clean with 90K on the clock is almost unheard of on the East coast. - and, you don't need an engine hoist to pull the motor in a subaru. I can pick one up myself, and I'm no brute of a guy. Feel free to ask questions here, the members are very helpful. But you may save yourself some time and do some searches first, as a lot of things have been archived that have been brilliantly covered.

[aba4430]

Hello,

I bought my engine hoist and am getting ready to order clutch parts now. For the clutch, I want to go with genuine Subaru parts. So far, Subaruparts.com has given us the best prices (vs. the Tallahassee and Valdosta dealerships), ~$150 for the clutch kit - includes the disc, pressure plate, throwout bearing and pilot bearing. I will also order the front (may not replace) and rear (will replace) crankshaft seals. While the engine is out, I will also retorque the head bolts and also replace the valve cover gaskets (I have) and the oil pan gasket (need to order). I do not have the special Subaru head bolt socket - will a crow foot wrench work? Anything else that I need to replace? Finally, is Subaruparts.com a Subaru dealer and what kind of reputation do they have amonst the list members? Quite a few questions to answer!

Appreciate it.

aba4430

[Aldoat]

I myself have never had any problems ordering from Subaruparts.com. In fact, they always surprise me by shipping items to me air frieght instead of the ground shipping they charged for. I have always placed my orders online and have always looked up my own part #'s from my parts book (85&86 2D and MPV (Brat)). Only once have I had to speak to anyone there on the phone and when I did it was to add something to an order already submitted. They were most helpful and attentive.

 

Oh, and while you are at it, order the two little spring clips for the throwout bearing. They are cheap and well worth using new.

[aba4430]

Appreciate the prompt response. I too have a Subaru parts manual. It covers the '85 to '88 1600 & 1800 2D plus MPV models - absolutely wonderful. The clip part numbers are 30539-AA000. I will go ahead and order 2 of these.

Thx,

aba

[ShawnW]

Don't retorque the head gaskets.

[GeneralDisorder]

Yeah - that's a negative on the head bolt torque. Don't bother - you could cause more problems than you fix.

 

GD

[aba4430]

Update:

 

I ordered a bunch of parts from Subaruparts.com on 4/21/04. They sent me a confirmation, but silence since then. I have tried to call them several times, but noone answers, I guess they are busy and do not have too many folks on the phones etc. Also sent them an e-mail two days ago, but no response. I am getting a bit impatient. Of course, my card just has the charge amount authorized, not posted. I was planning on replacing the clutch this weekend, but will be a no-go until my parts come in. I may try and pull the motor out though!

Regards,

aba4430

[bratman2]

Be sure to have your flywheel turned at a machine shop. No need to go this far and have shuddering and stuff. Also Qman had posted a couple of years ago that it was easier to drop the transmission to change the clutch than to pull the engine. I had already pulled my engine.

[Meeky Moose]

personally i say pull the engine.. its pretty straight forward and you don't have to have a jack holding the trans up.. i can get an ea81 out of a soob in 2 hours.. without a engine hoist.. 2 people can lift it out.. complete it might wiegh 200lbs at the most, lol..

 

sounds like you have a good handle on mechanics.. and if you take your time and remember where everything goes, i'm sure the job will go easy for you..

 

good idea on the crank seals, bad idea on the head bolts.. ya might do the oil pump and water pump while its out too, its a bit easier..

 

good luck..

[MilesFox]

pulling the motor is easy. you do not need to take off the starter to pull the motor or replace the clutch.

 

might as well replace the rear crank seal since the motor is out.

try this to remove the flywheel:

use a 10 or 12mm wrench, box end on a pp bolt(once it's removed) and butt the open end against the engine stud this will allow you to remove or torque the flywheel mounting bolts.

 

if you dont have a torque wrench, tighten down by hand (snug with a wrench, but no torque on it.)then torque 1/4 turn. same for pp bolts

[P K]

I just replaced the clutch on my 82 Brat two months ago. It was the easiest job ever with great advice form the USMB peoples.

 

Removed the battery, radiator, and anti-pitch rod. (If you have air cond, it will be more difficult to get the evaporator? out too. - to have room to slide motor forward into front grill) Unbolted the exhausts, dropped them a bit and rested on a wood block. Removed two engine mount bolts, removed starter. Removed the other 3 transmission bolts (4th came out with starter).

 

Used floor jack to jack up motor . Used tie-down to pull motor to front of engine bay and hold it. The motor pulls away from the transmission (wiggle), and rests on the floor jack being held forward with the tie down. I think I may have also had to free up fuel lines etc for more slack. You can use the engine hoist in same manner. If you remove fuel lines,just pull motor out for easiest access, but not really necessary.

 

Then remove pressure plate bolts and assembly comes out. The motor turns pretty easy to get to all bolts. Flywheel can unbolt for re-surfacing. It is tight, but enough room to wrench and get everything out and back in. Throw-out bearing assembly, and clutch lever too.

 

It all went back in using the plastic clutch alignment tool too. What a sweet deal - about 6-8 hour total for me. Thanks USMB.

 

r/PK

[GeneralDisorder]

You don't need to pull anything to do the clutch. You can just pull the engine forward and get in there. I've done it at the JY many times. It's tight, but with the radiator removed, it's not too bad.

 

GD

[baccaruda]

yeah, and if you move the engine, you'll have the radiator out and you can take the radiator somewhere for a checkup. be prepared to replace it, and if you do, get a model with 2 rows of cores (it will likely be an automatic transmission compatible radiator) and don't spend more than $120-$130 on the radiator.

 

I didn't see any talk of changing the rear main seal while the engine/trans are apart, but you should do that too.

[aba4430]

Folks,

 

Appreciate all the information. I received all my parts from Subaruparts.com on Tuesday, so I am getting ready to take the engine out today. Purchased a $2 Motormite clutch alignment tool from Advance yesterday. It is part number 14529 and I hope it is the right one. The list of things to do include the following, so far:

1. Clutch (both bearings, 2-clips, pressure plate and disc).
   
2. Rear seal - this is just an orange colored 0-ring sort of thing. Amazing that such a part does so much. I also have the front seal, will inspect it closely - may not replace.
   
3. Clutch cable, once everything goes back together. I have had this cable since the early 90's. Bought it as a spare part from Bianchi Subaru in Monroeville, PA for my 1981 GL 2 door H/B. It is still sealed.
   
4. Resurface flywheel
   
5. Radiator check up at a shop. This one is also applicable to the automatic cars based on the presence of cooler inlet/outlet. Hopefully, the shop can seal it, it does have a slight leak to it. Or may replace it altogether - they cost @$140 with lifetime warranty.
   
6. Inspect/replace water pump.
   
7. Not sure about torquing head bolts based on F/B here - we will see. Has anyone used a crowfoot wrench (17 mm) for this? One caution is that you have to loosen the intake manifold bolts slightly prior to doing this. I did this at @75 -100K miles on my 2 door H/B when I was at GA Tech in Atlanta in the 1987 to 1989 timeframe. Had borrowed the special socket from Boomershine Subaru then.
   
8. Oil pan gasket.
   
9. Valve cover gaskets.
   
10. The oil pump was replaced @75K miles and should be fine. The truck has @99K miles now.
    
11. All bypass heater hoses.
    

Some questions now:

1. I have tried (albeit half heartedly to locate the O2 sensor on my truck, but without success. The truck has to have one and I want to replace it. Hopefully with the motor removed, I will locate it.
   
2. I am not sure whether the transmission needs to be supported on jacks, with the engine out. I have adequate jacks and jack stands, so not a problem.
   

I intend to take this job slow, as I have a daily driver and will keep the group updated on my progress or for advice.

 

Appreciate it.

 

aba4430

[aba4430]

Folks,

Took the engine out today. Since this was the first time, it took some effort but all went well. Will try to get the flywheel resurfaced tomorrow if I can, otherwise will be Monday. Will get a new water pump and radiator - the old rad. is shot. A couple of questions that I need some help with however:

1. My 1987 Brat does not have an O2 sensor - this is wierd! Did some Brat's not include one? Even my old 1981 2WD H/B had one.
   
2. There is no clutch return spring on my Brat. I guess Brat's with the hill holder system do not have a clutch return spring.
   

Regards,

aba4430

[aba4430]

Folks,

 

At the onset I wish to thank this board for the valuable information provided, that enabled me to undertake the clutch replacement effort. This is the list of items done to my Brat so far:

1. Clutch (pressure plate, pilot and throwout bearings and disc) replaced.
   
2. Replaced clutch cable. Did not replace the acc. cable, it appeared fine.
   
3. 2. Rear main seal and orange o-ring replaced.
   
4. Flywheel resurfaced.
   
5. Oil pan gasket.
   
6. Valve cover gaskets.
   
7. No torqueing of head bolts. Did not have the special socket and a crowfoot wrench did not work. However, I have special ordered the socket from Kent Moore. It is on back order and expected on 7/21/04. So will tackle this effort later.
   
8. Thermostat (Robert Shaw Gen II, 180 degree). I had bought this from Autozone years ago, but never got around to installing it.
   
9. New water pump.
   
10. New radiator. Will flush DIW/Prestone super cleaner and and fill with 50/50 Texaco orange coolant/DIW this morning.
    
11. Front cranshaft seal.
    

We reinstalled the motor on Friday evening. My wife's help was invaluable in this effort. Getting the motor in was a real pain. I found out later that something was getting hung up on the left side. The transmission was lifted @2" and everything appeared to be OK, but no-go, over and over again. However with extreme patience (2 hours) we were successful. Yesterday, I put everything together and fired the truck up. It started easily. Now I have to adjust the clutch cable properly. With the hill holder system, it is difficult to get it right. The first time last night, I could not even change gears, the clutch cable was so out of adjustment. I have it to a point now that I can change gears with the motor running. However, I have already taken more than 1/2 the adjustment on the threaded portion of the clutch cable. Looks like I have @1" pf play now. Will actually drive the truck this morning as I have to flush the cooling system. Hopefully, things will go well. Thereafter will adjust the HH cable.

 

Regards,

 

aba4430

[AlbanyNY]

congrats on your success! That's a big job for anyone especially, a newbie.

 

You saved yourself some serious money! NICE JOB!