Giovara Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 (edited) I have a 2002 Legacy L wagon with 140k miles. It is an automatic. Today I was running errands with it and it overheated. I heard some noise with the A/C and then it idled funny and started blowing warm air. I started going down the road and the air got cool again and was fine until I got to the grocery store. I left it running because my wife and son were staying inside. When I got back my wife had turned off the car because she said it started making the noise and running rough again. I got in the car and started it up and noticed the temp gauge was 3/4 of the way up. I parked it in the shade and let it cool. I turned off the A/C and headed home which was about 8 miles away. I got it home fine and the gauge stayed right where it was supposed to. I let it cool in the driveway and then I turned it on and turned on the A/C. It was not blowing cold. I could hear the compressor click on then immediately click off. I looked online for a bit and found some info about the cooling fans. I tested my fans by unplugging them and running a positive and negative wire directly from the battery to the fan motors and neither fan would come on when I did this. What would cause both fans to stop working? Could the compressor of shorted out my fans? Edited July 24, 2012 by Giovara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giovara Posted July 25, 2012 Author Share Posted July 25, 2012 Is the A/C and the cooling fans linked? If the cooling fans quit does the A/C quit? I notice in the fuse box the A/C relay is located between the main fan relay and the sub fan relay. I wouldn't of thought that they needed each other to work though. Does anyone know anything about this or have had a similar experience? I don't want to replace the fans if I really have a different problem that will short them out again. Thanks for any light yall can shed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 It sounds a little strange that both the main and sub fans would suddenly go faulty like that, though if you truly tried connecting power directly to the fans from the battery, and the connections were good and the battery charged, and they didn't work, that appears to be what happened. The ECU controls the cooling fans based on various inputs, such as temperature, vehicle speed and whether or not the a/c compressor is on. At low speed if the fans aren't working, you will notice the a/c start to blow warm because it cannot simply reject all the heat out the condensor. Conventional single stage R134A systems have a maximum temp differential of about 90F. example Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 perhaps the fans share a common ground somewhere? odd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 (edited) the op said that they connected ground and positive directly to the battery to test fans and neither fan was working. it seems weird that both fans would quit at the same time though. those style fans should be brush less which means a short could have fried the circuits in the fan, but what would have shorted out both fans at the same time is what the question should be. i have a question for the original poster. when you connected the fans directly was there any sign of draw like a spark? and also can you spin the fan blades freely or are they froze up? Edited July 25, 2012 by mikaleda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giovara Posted July 25, 2012 Author Share Posted July 25, 2012 I took both fan out of the car and tested them on my work bench. I found out that when I tap on the motor it will come on. There seems to be a short inside both motors. Does anyone know how to rebuild these? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I took both fan out of the car and tested them on my work bench. I found out that when I tap on the motor it will come on. There seems to be a short inside both motors. Does anyone know how to rebuild these? that's weird - might be fun to dig into them but, they're 10 years old - unless you got lucky and there was a very clear, obvious problem that could easily and reliably be repaired, I think you'd be better off with replacements. has this car ever been wrecked? maybe those aren't the original fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 junk yard if you want replacements last time i was there a set of legacy fans were less than $20. the thing i would be worried about is what messed them up in the first place and will it happen again with your new fans. good luck hope all goes well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Its a very common issue for the fans to fail and when "tapped", can come back on. At this point, I would suggest replacing the motor as it is servicable by itself so no need for the blades or cage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Buy a couple replacement fan motors. Most likely one has been out for a long time and the other just joined it. The car will easily run off one fan without any complaints or obvious signs of distress. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giovara Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 Ill probably just get two new motors but I had to take them apart so I would know what actually broke. When I took them apart it was obvious what happened. The carbon motor brushes were wore down in both of them. It reminded me of the spring loaded flint in a bic lighter. Once the flint is wore down the lighter is shot. These carbon pieces have a copper wire that comes out of them. The copper wire stays on a track and when it hits a certain point on that track it comes to a stop. I noticed there was still a lot of carbon left, it was just being restricted by the copper wire. So I decided to frankenstein it just to see what would happen. I cut the copper wire and grinded down the nub on the carbon pieces(two carbon pieces per motor). Then I soldered the copper wire to the spring that pushes on the carbon. Now the carbon is not restricted by the wire and it gave it some more room to wear. I put them back together and they both are working great now. I think you are right GD. One must of gone out and the other followed. I always have the A/C on so that fan must of been keeping everything quiet until it finally went out. Thanks for the help guys. I hope this might help someone else if they come across a similar problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 very informative good response Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 I've bought brushes before - many years ago - at the car parts place. Wonder if they could match-up some new ones for ya. good detective work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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