Automatic Transmission won't shift from 1st or "slips" in 2nd

[Acehorseman]

I just purchased a 1994 Subaru Legacy wagon as a project car and the transmission has an issue I am trying to sort out.  It will shift and run in both 1st gear and reverse, but is reluctant to shift into 2nd (never got to a higher gear), and when it does, there is no power, it feels like it is slipping or not connected.

 

The fluid is red, no burnt smell, with a few small bubbles.

 

So where to start. Plan A -  I was thinking of dropping the pan, check the magnet for shavings and such, and replace the filter. 

Anything else anyone would recommend while I have the pan off?

 

Plan B - go directly to the electronics and replace the Vehicle Speed Sensor ? 

 

Plan C - ???? Band adjustment?  Clutch pack?

 

Any advise appreciated as this is my first Subaru.

 

Thanks

[ivans imports]

plan to pull trans and inspect its internals sounds like a broken band or planetary or high clutch drum 1rst and reverse use low reverse clutch drum the rest use high clutch and band and forward clutch. You could pull pan and see whats in it any meatal is bad.

[idosubaru]

Did the vehicle sit for an extended period of time?

 

Someone just recently had a 1991 subaru legacy on this forum that had issues and when he pulled the pan the screen was all crudded up with debris.  This is rare and those screens are basically never dirty, they are pointless to replace even on 200,000 miles Subaru's, i've never seen a spec in them. But...apparently this one sat for awhile and got some kind of debris in it - time, corrosion, animal, bugs...who knows but it picked up something.

 

May want to check the internal screen (it's hardly to be considered a filter though it is called that), particularly so if this car sat for any length of time.

 

How many miles?

Any check engine light?

Is the AT or transmission light blinking 16 times at start up?

Is the transmission pan dented (starving fluid flow - there is very little clearance between the pan and internal filter)?

I've seen folks have cut solenoid wires too - inspect the wiring when the pan is off.

 

Pulling hte transmission electrical harness apart will force it into completely mechanical mode - which means 3rd gear only....not sure if that's worth a shot on a trans that has current issues, up to you as a test or to get around in.  i drove one for a year with only 3rd gear.  it also locks the transfer clutches though but you can work around that but make it FWD or installing a switch on one wire to turn the Duty C on or off as needed.

Edited April 25, 2013 by grossgary

[NorthWet]

My $0.02 is to listen to (and follow!) grossgary's advice, but expect the issues that ivans imports mentioned.

 

I catastrophically destroyed the band (it's not smart to shift into reverse while doing 20mph...), and the result was only having first and reverse. 

[Rooster2]

Dropping the pan to look for shavings, and replacing the filter is not likely to solve the problem. I did that only once, and it was a complete waste of time. The only filter is a piece of mesh screen, that isn't really much of a filter at all. I found very minimal metal particles on my screen, which is normal. Reinstalling the pan was a real PITA. Just a real tough job removing the hardened gasket pieces from the pan and tranny facing. Others have said the same thing in postings there, that replacing the screen filter is a waste of time. My problem was that my tranny stopped shifting into high gear. I traded the car to solve my problem. Others have posted that the best solution in this situation, is to install a used tranny from a wrecking yard. They are cheap. Popular belief is that it is not worth the time and money to rebuild your existing tranny, if it comes to that.

[Acehorseman]

Gentlemen, thank you all for the input to this problem!  Based on the the above, my thoughts are to remove the pan, check for debri and bomb damage, especially the band mentioned,  Check the filter and if need be replace it.  If problem is large and obvious, I will go with the idea of salvaging a tranny and replace in whole, 

 

On that thought, is it possible to think about replacing it with a 5 speed manual??  Rather than another automatic??  I know in the case of older US muscle cars there are a number of issues faced on that journey, mounts, cross members, etc. and I doubt there is a large aftermarket network for aging Subarus.

 

Just for the record, the car has fairly low mileage, 86,000 km or 56,000 miles.  No check engine light or AT blinks on start up.  

 

Again, thanks to all with the ideas, I will keep you posted.

 

Aufwiedersehen!

 

kcg

[ivans imports]

I rebiuld alot of 4 eats takes me about 1 hour to teardown and go thru one they are very good about just fixing whats broken and get out. You dont even have to pull the pan to change clutches just diff and tailshaft.

[mikaleda]

I have seen mentions of people doing a 5 speed swap in the older cars, but on the newer ones the autos are usually stronger. Wow that was painfull to type but I don't care what anyone says I love my 5speed and would not trade it for any auto even though they have known problems with the input bearing.

On another note, I would listen to Ivan, he seems to be very knowledgable about the 4eats in my opinion.

[ivans imports]

have done the 5 speed swap is a pain and hard to get check engine light out I think the 4eat is 90 % stronger than 5 speed i do 5 standards for every auto. And a'm considering the 4.44 4eat as the new offroad trans to replace the 5 speed high low as is way stronger and reverse is bulet prof. I absoluty torture the 4eat in my race buggy and it holds up when i ran a deul range 5 speed i blew 1rst 2nd and low in one race mind you was runing a 2.7 turbo six with nos

[presslab]

I agree it's probably some bigger problem.  But you could always try adjusting the brake band, it's not that hard to do on the car.  Loosen the lock nut a few turns while holding the adjuster.  Then thread in the adjuster until it's just snug.  Subaru recommends something like 3 turns out from snug, the Transgo kit recommends 1.5 turns out.  Then tighten up the lock nut.

[Acehorseman]

Again, thanks for the good ideas and possible solutions.  I will follow Ivans and others advise and stick with the 4EAT.  So next weekend, it will be time to drop the pan and see what the damage looks like.  I will take pictures and keep you all posted on any progress.

[NorthCoast]

I've got the same issue right now too.  Man I wish Ivan was closer.

 

My pan was dented so I pounded it out and changed the filter.  Minimals shavings and everything else looked ok so I put it back together.  Still no luck.

 

Once it's in 2nd it shifts fine through the rest of the gears but getting to 2nd is a PITA.

Edited April 29, 2013 by NorthCoast

[NorthCoast]

Adjusted the band and all is well.

[ivans imports]

closer wont do you any good have 6 subarus in a line waiting takes months to get in my shop have a crazy wait list. A good idea is to take detailed pics of how it comes apart  so you can refer to them when puting it back together. Eg pics of witch way toringtons go were tubes and drums go ect. If band addjustment helps the band is very close to being worn out probly just temp fix have seen them run and work with no coating but drum takes a beating

[CrankyAl]

I have a slipping 4eat in my 93 Legacy and have been thinking about trying the band adjust. Dumb question. How the heck do you get to the adjustment nut and screw. Only thing I can tell there must be a special very long set of wrenches to get to the thing. Any help much appreciated.

[NorthCoast]

Long arms not long wrenches.

[CrankyAl]

Mighty small working area to get two hands and two wrenches into. With all the hoses and electrical bundles in the way. Removing the starter would make more room. I will figure it out eventually.

[ivans imports]

flex socket taped to long extention or stubby 17 mm wrench if you can belive it have never addjusted one in the car cause if it needs to be addjusted it needs to be replaced is just a temparay fix

[CrankyAl]

I feel like a dunce. First it took me weeks to find the damn adjustment screw and lock nut. When I finally found it I thought that you get to it from the engine bay. DUH....I was under the car today and found out you can access the adjuster from underneath the car!

I did manage to get a stubby 17mm on the lock nut but couldn't budge it. No hand strength left in these old hands. Bummer, I will try another day. Thanks to all for your help.

[johnceggleston]

 

if it needs to be addjusted it needs to be replaced is just a temparay fix

ditto !!

it must need to be adjusted when the trans is first built.

why else would they even put it there?

 

kind of like the ''idle set screw'' on the throttle body. don't need it, don't touch it.

Edited May 8, 2013 by johnceggleston

[presslab]

Subaru has a procedure for doing the band adjustment on the car.  They wouldn't write a procedure if they didn't think it was worthwhile to adjust the band.

http://www.northursalia.com/techdocs/pdf/transmission/band.pdf

 

In tight situations where I can't turn a wrench with enough strength, I'll use a small pry bar to apply the force to the wrench.