A 2.5 liter turbo-charged Legacy sedan?

[vcliburn]

FIRST, why doesn't the WRX STI come with an available 6 or 7 speed auto transmission (with manual-mode paddle-shifters)?  By limiting the WRS STI to only a manual tranny, an entire segment of the driving market is being ignored.  If Audi can do it with its A4/S4, A6/S6 & A8 cars, and BWM with its 3 series, series, With such an available option, WRS STI sales would go through the roof!!  

 

SECOND, why doesn't the Legacy sedan come with the same 2.5 liter, 305hp turbo charged engine that's in the WRX STI?  With this high-performance option, Legacy sedan sales would surely go through the roof!!  The 2.5 liter, 175hp engine that's now in the Legacy sedan is anemic, at best. 

 

                                             

[Dj7291993]

The WRX is available with an auto, but it's the CVT.  Just not in the STi Trim.  I don't think Subaru wants to continue making "normal" autos.  Also, they'd tick off a lot of their die-hard fans.  A lot of performance enthusiasts see an automatic as the Anti-Christ of motoring.  Now if it were a true sequential, that might be different.

 

Second, they did make a Legacy 2.5 GT, stopped selling it in America after 2012 iirc.  They still sell it in Japan, even in an STi version... just not here.  I'd love to see them bring it back, or make one with a twin-turbo H6.  Unfortunately, our fuel economy requirements aren't exactly encouraging them to do it.

[vcliburn]

Thanks for the update!  So, the WRX is currently available (in the USA) with a CVT (but not in the STI trim). Do you know what the hp/torque rating is for that trim model?  What makes the WRX STI special to begin with is its turbo-charged 305hp engine!  Anything less than that is a compromise.  Was the legacy 2.5 GT engine equivalent to the WRS STI?  Why in the world was it discontinued?     

[Dj7291993]

Yes, it is.  The non-STi models use the new FB series engine, the STi still uses the EJ25.  This FB20 is 2.0L, 268hp, 258ft/lbs.  Still turbo'd, a little bit higher boost, just not quite as big or powerful.

 

As for the discontinued, it was probably sales.  Although, judging by how few people seem to know about it, I'd say it was mostly on them for not advertizing it enough.  You can find them used, but they didn't make a whole lot.  We've got the largest volume Subaru dealer in the USA in town here, and when Subaru was still making them, they said they were special order.  Kind of a bummer.

 

If you want more info on the WRX, it's all on Subaru's website.

 

Edit:  To my knowledge, it was the same engine in the Legacy as the STi, but it may have had minor differences.  It was a turbo'd 2.5L with a 6-speed manual transmission.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Dj7291993

[86BRATMAN]

The engine is different, the pistons and heads are different. And they used a smaller turbo, different ecu tune, different intake manifold and intercooler. The STi engine code is ej257 and the legacy gt is ej255,ypu can google search to find more details on the differences. But both are realistically just as capable of making good power.

[vcliburn]

As far as not putting out a top-notch auto trans version of the WRX STi is concerned (supposedly to remain loyal to the so-called "die-hard" manual trans enthusiasts), I would hope that the folks at Subaru are a lot smarter & wiser than that.  Auto trannies have come a long way since the days of the slow, inefficient slush boxes of yesteryear.  In fact, today's 6/7/8 speed auto trannies are a lot quicker and more fuel efficient than their manual counterparts.  Just look at the Audi "S" line or the BMW 3 Series.  Those die-hard "purists" who want a manual gear box can always have one.  But for Subaru to simply ignore the ever-growing number of drivers who only want an auto tranny is simply bad decision-making.  And as history indicates, it shows in the final sales numbers.    

 

And yes, Subaru should definitely bring back the turbo charged 2.5L GT version of the Legacy sedan...but this time in BOTH a 6-speed manual version AND a lightning-fast 7/8 speed auto gear box with paddle shifters.  Such a car would easily go head-to-head with the likes of a Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution, Audi's new S3 (available in Europe not yet in the USA) and BMW's 3 Series.  

 

Oh, and one final thought...IMHO, Subaru should drop it's inefficient and unremarkable 3.6L 6-cylinder version of the Legacy and replace it with (you got it) an upgraded version of the 2.5L GT as mentioned above.  Enough said.

Edited September 29, 2014 by vcliburn

[keith3267]

What might make more sense for Subaru from a marketing standpoint would be to use the turbo 2.0 from the WRX, tuned for gas mileage ala Ford's ecoboost. It would still have more power than the NA 2.5 but get better mileage.  In reality, the higher purchase price combined with the shorter engine life would not really be a savings for the customer, but as a marketing tool, it works for Ford.

[belacane]

The Legacy GT is a turbo charged 2.5 with approximately 250bhp.

It's been done.

[Dj7291993]

As far as not putting out a top-notch auto trans version of the WRX STi is concerned (supposedly to remain loyal to the so-called "die-hard" manual trans enthusiasts), I would hope that the folks at Subaru are a lot smarter & wiser than that.  Auto trannies have come a long way since the days of the slow, inefficient slush boxes of yesteryear.  In fact, today's 6/7/8 speed auto trannies are a lot quicker and more fuel efficient than their manual counterparts.  Just look at the Audi "S" line or the BMW 3 Series.  Those die-hard "purists" who want a manual gear box can always have one.  But for Subaru to simply ignore the ever-growing number of drivers who only want an auto tranny is simply bad decision-making.  And as history indicates, it shows in the final sales numbers.  

 

 

BMW doesn't use a normal auto in their M series.  They use a sequential, which as I had said, would be a whole different ball game.  But those take a lot to develop.  BMW can put the money into R&D for those, as they have a large performance market.  Subaru, at least for now, only has one big performance line.  And a sequential, at least one developed for performance, isn't going to be comfortable enough for a family car.  Subaru is focusing on developing the CVT as their replacement for the traditional automatic, and have been working with the technology for it since the Justy.  The CVT does a whole lot better for fuel economy and comfort, which is what most of their customers would like to see.  Now, from what I've read, the new CVT in the WRX does pretty well, and is improving greatly as a performance transmission.  But STi isn't going to put their badge on a car with it until it's to their requirements.  Why do you think the STi is the only new car they are selling still using the EJ engine?  In the next few years, maybe they will get the tuning on it just right, and we'll see it with an auto in the form of a CVT.  If they can get it's responsiveness right, it could be incredible, as you will always be in the power band.  But, at least for now, it's not ready.

[1 Lucky Texan]

is the trans in the Nissan GTR made by JATCO? Seems like it might be put in a STI.