No cranking. Motor starter & battery is good.

[Suba_GL_87]

91 Subaru legacy 5 speed...base ej22.

 

I've been find it out... Starter motor, battery is good.

So, any idea why no cranking?

 

Clutch Starter Safety Switch failure?

If not? What's else?

Please help.

[Suba_GL_87]

Clutch Starter Safety Switch Is good. 0.2 OHMs voltmeter.

 

What's else?

I was went to auto store for test motor starter, he's said its passed. :-/

But I hear near the engine "click" when I trun the start.

But dashboard & headlights is light on

but clock time is off.

[mikaleda]

Could be the main supply wire, try using a jumper cable from the starter to battery and try starting it again

[Suba_GL_87]

It's 12.5 volts battery and did was jumper cable.

Still clicky.

[mikaleda]

If you've verified the power supply to the starter try jumping from the power supply to the trigger post if it still clicks than its your starter contacts, common problem

[1 Lucky Texan]

try hitting the starter with a piece of wood and re-try to start. The Contacts in the solenoid can be corroded and fail - or be intermittent.

 

Corroded battery cables could be part of the problem too but, not uncommon for an older starter to need new contacts and plunger. Rebuild kits are available on ebay and elsewhere.

[Suba_GL_87]

I did remove motor stater and to oreily for test said passed.

Cable is good.

 

Mikaeda- I did jumper cable on own the battery to motor stater(B+ and ground?)

It's not even on.

[1 Lucky Texan]

those starters can be intermittent due to corroded/worn contacts in the solenoid - well known problem. Might work on a test bench, then not work next time.

 

try hitting it with a piece of wood, try to start, hit again, try to start - a few times.

 

also, if you turn on the headlights when you try to start, do they dim almost to dark, or, not at all?

Edited November 14, 2014 by 1 Lucky Texan

[mikaleda]

A starter can pass a bench test but fail when under load, i'm willing to bet it's your starter contacts

[Bushwick]

If the starter is working but clicks, and the battery is good, check your grounds from the engine to battery, AND the grounds from engine to body. My 79' Mustang had a V8 transplant from a turbo 4 my step dad did. When I got the car, it'd click. He didn't add enough ground wires and it caused the main ground to overheat. I jumped the block to the chassis with a 4-way tire iron and it started, so that was an easy fix.

 

 

Try this:

 

Take some heavy gauge jumper cables. Jump the NEGATIVE terminal at the battery (make SURE the battery post clamps are TIGHT and clean and still connected) and ground the other end at the alternator (casing tab on exterior or anywhere a clean ground exists on alternator; stay away from the alternator charge bolt). Take the 2nd cable and ground the engine block to a clean metal body panel. Try cranking. If it starts, then you have some bad grounds. Easiest fix is to buy some pre-made braided steel neg. cables and ground the block to chassis, and REPLACE the factory neg. cable running from the battery. I'd also inspect the actual clamps feeding the battery as they can, overtime, corrode internally within the crimp and cause issues.

 

Next, check the positive cable that feeds the starter. They can corrode over time as well.

 

If any main battery cable is hardened into position, that means it's overheated to the point that it hardened like that. Overheating happens when there aren't enough grounds to support the current flow (poor neg. wire) or the positive wire has corrosion or is weak (positive wire bad). Replace as needed.

 

Also, if your car has one, check the fusible link under the hood. My 95' has one in the underhood fuse box by the battery. Was at grocery store a few months back, parked car, went it, came back, and a no start. Knowing it had no prior symptoms, I suspected a wire and checked. The fusible link (basically a wire that looks like a small jumper) had a burn spot in the center, and was corroded. I wiggled it and the car started. I had to reuse the heavy duty, high quality spade connectors and bought the "grey" fusible link wire Auto Zone sells. I tried the "black" wire first, but it got too warm from normal engine running so it was beyond the current rating. The factory connectors were very carefully pried open at the crimps with a pick and needle nose pliers, then grey wire was fed through. I recrimped then soldered the fusible wire to the connectors for added sealing and to limit any possible arcing from a stray wire. The "grey" link has yet to get warm.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Bushwick

[Suba_GL_87]

1-lucky-texan-

I've been anything clean positive/negative cable, clean firewall grounds, good battery & motor stater too.

 

Yes, headlight was no light (dark) when tried to starting.

No clicking!

Edited November 15, 2014 by Suba_GL_87

[1 Lucky Texan]

if the headlight dimmed a LOT during the start attempt, I think the next test would be to see if the engine can be rotated by hand at the crank pulley. If so, perhaps the starter is shorted internally???? seems unlikely since it works on the bench. If not, the engine is probably seized.

 

Was the car working fine, then just wouldn't start?

Edited November 15, 2014 by 1 Lucky Texan

[Suba_GL_87]

if the headlight dimmed a LOT during the start attempt, I think the next test would be to see if the engine can be rotated by hand at the crank pulley. If so, perhaps the starter is shorted internally???? seems unlikely since it works on the bench. If not, the engine is probably seized.

 

Was the car working fine, then just wouldn't start?

Yes, I did rotated to TDC for couple times.

Motor stater is passed when go to auto store.

Yes, was running champ during cold weather (15temp) to foods store after that was totally dead.

 

No clicking...

Edited November 15, 2014 by Suba_GL_87

[lmdew]

Check the voltage under load!

Both leads to the battery, check Voltage

Have some one try to start, check Voltage, you should see a voltage drop under load

Move the positive lead to the Starter terminal, check voltage

Have someone try to start the car, what's the voltage drop

Move to the positive going to the starter motor, down stream of the starter contacts - repeat.

 

Record the voltage readings, this will tell you where the problem lies.

 

Some great electrical training at: www.brighterideas.com  Load Pro tool is great, but if you can check the system loaded and connected you can get by without the Load Pro.

[mikaleda]

Okay just because the "auto parts store" told you the starter was good out of the car, doesn't mean your starter is good.

1.) Verify main positive power supply, and not just that it has voltage.

2.) Verify grounding

3.) If both of the latter is good then verify starter by jumping the trigger (the small wire) to the power supply (the big wire)

4.) If all of the above fail to make the starter operate, then you have a problem with either nutrel safety switch, ignition switch or power supply to the ignition circuit

 

Those are the only things that will cause the starter failure in your car once you nail it down to one of these then we can move forward in diagnosis

[1 Lucky Texan]

I'd still be suspicious of; bad cables, bad battery and bad starter contacts/plunger. But I admit, it seems a little odd.

 

12.5 with no load doesn't necessarily mean the battery is good.

 

 

[DerFahrer]

What 1 Lucky Texan said.

 

A battery reading 12.5 volts with no load on it is a bad battery, especially right now in cold weather. A good battery should read in the neighborhood of at least 13 volts - preferably 13.5 to 14.0 volts - with no load on it.

 

That explains your clicking (that means there's enough juice for the starter solenoid to engage the motor, but not enough to turn the motor) and also your headlights dimming.

Edited November 18, 2014 by DerFahrer

[mikaleda]

What 1 Lucky Texan said.

 

A battery reading 12.5 volts with no load on it is a bad battery, especially right now in cold weather. A good battery should read in the neighborhood of at least 13 volts - preferably 13.5 to 14.0 volts - with no load on it.

 

That explains your clicking (that means there's enough juice for the starter solenoid to engage the motor, but not enough to turn the motor) and also your headlights dimming.

You can't tell if the battery is bad just by voltage, 12.5 in the cold could be a good battery or a bad battrry. The only real way to tell is to load test the battery

 

All that 12.5 is telling you is that the battery isn't at full charge, its still %80 charged. If the battery is good that would be enough to make the starter motivate.

Edited November 18, 2014 by mikaleda

[1 Lucky Texan]

it's my understanding that 12.6 is about the highest a charged battery will show but, as said, if the capacity of the battery is reduced by sulfation or ???, it may not be able to supply the current required to spin a load like the starter. You can string 8-9 AAA batteries together and measure 12+ volts, they won't start a car though.

 

But I think he said jumper cables failed as well which made me wonder about the cables (it is an older car) or some weird issue with a short in the starter.

 

symptoms seem weird - but still point to the same 3-4 items.

 

take the battery in for testing.

Edited November 18, 2014 by 1 Lucky Texan

[Bushwick]

What 1 Lucky Texan said.

 

A battery reading 12.5 volts with no load on it is a bad battery, especially right now in cold weather. A good battery should read in the neighborhood of at least 13 volts - preferably 13.5 to 14.0 volts - with no load on it.

 

That explains your clicking (that means there's enough juice for the starter solenoid to engage the motor, but not enough to turn the motor) and also your headlights dimming.

 

 

What are you talking about? A battery with 12.5V is good. That's usually about where they are at after the car first shuts off. If the engine is running, the alt is producing the voltage and it should be 13-14V.

 

 

Did you try adding the extra grounds to the block like I suggested? A ground can't be verified from a "visual" only. Ground the block to the battery, and try starting. Did you check the fusible link? When mine went, it wouldn't start but I believe it still had some accessory stuff working.

[DerFahrer]

 

Sorry, I had a blond moment.

 

That said, 12.5V isn't necessarily good. A repair shop's battery diagnostic tool will tell you the battery is on its way out at 12.5V, and tell you it needs immediate replacement at 12.4V.

[mikaleda]

 

Sorry, I had a blond moment.

 

That said, 12.5V isn't necessarily good. A repair shop's battery diagnostic tool will tell you the battery is on its way out at 12.5V, and tell you it needs immediate replacement at 12.4V.

Actually if the battery holds above 9v with half the CCA put to it for 15 seconds its considered a good battery, I tested a lot of battery's when I worked at a service center Edited November 18, 2014 by mikaleda

[1 Lucky Texan]

Actually if the battery holds above 9v with half the CCA put to it for 15 seconds its considered a good battery, I tested a lot of battery's when I worked at a service center

 

 

this seems close to what I've read. If you have 10 volts during cranking, that's a pretty good battery. If the OP's headlights are going dark, there is either a poor battery being used, or tremendous voltage drop across wires or ground or +12 connections somewhere.

 

that battery should be tested. Even a fairly new battery can be degraded by a few excursions to 'dead' discharge. Sulfates build-up on the plates every-time that happens.

Edited November 18, 2014 by 1 Lucky Texan

[mikaleda]

I know most new battery's have additives in them so they are "maintenice free". The additives just make them produce less gas. even battery's that have removable caps are still cibsidered maintence free just not maintenice proof. All this means is less pure lead in the battery, which makes them more expensive, less service life and they don't take abuse well. The heavier the battery the better

 

I could really get into newer style batteries, but I think the thread is getting of track a bit, I think I might start a new thread in the off topic section about this.

[1 Lucky Texan]

here's a thread with an 'odd' starter failure; http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/109-gen-3-2005-2009/151474-3-0-no-start.html#post2245418