I and another member's 2010+ Outback has burned oil. Found some more information, anyother members w/similar complaints?

[SnatchedHatch]

I was browsing another Subaru site, and someone posted this in regards to this topic. It states that apparently this problem is not limited to a few examples,

I wanted to ask you all if you have experienced unusually high Oil consumption in your new Subaru's?

 

Ours has only shown this problem twice, and defective piston rings (as it reads below) could explain that, as our car was under heavy load and driven for hours on end. In fact, those were road trips, and there is another, more disheartening account of a similar experience at the end of this post.

 

Here's the scoop:

 

Forester,
Legacy, Outback, Impreza and Crosstek vehicles made since 2011 have
defective piston rings which cause the cars to burn oil, possibly
causing engine failure.

"This design defect may be denied warranty coverage by the
manufacturer and result in some owners having to pay for costly repairs
to the engine," said the Haverford, Pa., law firm Chimicles &
Tikellis, in a prepared statement. "Subaru may even relay to customers
that the excessive oil consumption is considered normal."

This might sound familiar to Robert of Laramie, Wyo., who told ConsumerAffairs he can't wait to become a former Subaru owner.

"Soon I will be rid of this 2012 Subaru Forester and will never buy a
Subaru again. The oil consumption has been a quart per 1,000 miles. The
manual said that this is normal," Robert said in a recent review. "The
dealerships have been unconcerned and unwilling to try to stop the
consumption 'as it is normal.'"

Nothing normalConsumers rate Subaru

There's nothing normal about that kind of oil consumption, Robert said.

"The car has 26,000 miles and 26 quarts of synthetic oil have been
poured in it between the recommended oil changes. ... I have owned very
many other models of cars and trucks (probably over 50) and never had
one that consistently used over a quart between changes even though some
had over 200,000 miles on them. This poorly designed and supported car
is unacceptable. Subaru got me once never again!"

Faye of Big Canoe, Ga., also finds herself buying a lot of oil.

"I purchased my 2013 Subaru Outback February 2013. I have servicing
done regularly. However, from the very start, my oil light comes on
between 2500 to 3000 miles after an oil change. I was told by the
dealership that this is normal for these cars because they do not have
as much oil as other cars."

Like others we've heard form, Faye finds that explanation unacceptable.

"I had a Toyota Highlander for ten years, 210,000 miles on it and
never had any problem like this. Unfortunately, it was totaled by a
falling tree, and everyone encouraged me to get a Subaru. Nice car, but
not truly reliable."

Models named

The models named in the suit are:

2011-2014 Subaru Forester 2.5L2013 Legacy 2.5L2013 Outback 2.5L2012-2013 Impreza 2.0L2013 XV Crosstek 2.0L

ConsumerAffairs readers have had similar problems with models not covered by the lawsuit.

"Our 2010 Outback failed on a road trip in a cloud of smoke a few
days and less than 1,000 miles after an oil change and 23-pt. inspection
at the selling dealership. We're told the engine block would need
replacement -- $5.200 -- and a $1,300 teardown to see what other engine
parts would need replacement," said Kames of Milwaukee. "The Outback
used immense quantities of oil; we began changing every 1,500-2000 miles
and always carried oil because the light went on frequently. Dealers
that checked said no biggie."

 

Mark another Subaru not covered by the lawsuit (if there is one), we have a 2011 Subaru Outback 3.6R.

Luckily, it's only noticeably burned on the two trips, however driving from the Midwest to Florida apparently dropped it's oil extremely low. I wasn't there, but my family took it to a dealer. At least a quart burned on that trip, I'll find out more details soon.

The first trip definitively burned about a quart, driving ~900 miles in several days.

Edited November 19, 2014 by SnatchedHatch

[TKFlight]

I've read up on this actually, there are people who have no problems at all with oil consumption in those cars. Then there are people who have abnormal oil consumption going on and no signs of any leaks.

Its weird its like some cars got faulty parts then some got non-faulty parts, maybe a supplier issue?

[SnatchedHatch]

I've read up on this actually, there are people who have no problems at all with oil consumption in those cars. Then there are people who have abnormal oil consumption going on and no signs of any leaks.

 

Its weird its like some cars got faulty parts then some got non-faulty parts, maybe a supplier issue?

Hmm, like the connecting rods of the Fieros, could be.

 

Just an idea, it's been years since these have been made in Japan. Maybe there's an inconsistency in the quality of assembly?

 

I don't want to bash Subaru NA, just a thought.

[TKFlight]

Auto Manufacturers  do change suppliers and use different items/materials in motors due to different motor designs. I doubt this is a case of a design flaw, seems like just a mediocre part made out of mediocre material. This happens with a lot of auto companies, you see a lot of this stuff and that's why I don't understand why people decide to never drive this such auto manufacturers car again. They are more than likely to have problems with another auto manufacturers vehicle than they are with another, its the way it is. Some years auto manufacturers have a really good generation of cars, then the next gen doesn't perform as well you can't get it right 100% of the time. Subaru, to me, has been one of the most reliable auto manufacturers out there. I've had my run ins with fords, jeeps, dodges, not that they are bad vehicles Subaru has just shown to be reliable. A taken care of 2.2 can last 300K upwards, a well taken of 2.5 can last just as long if maintained. If you throw out the deadly HG issues, with the late 90's DOHC's and Subaru looks insanely good as a car manufacturer.

Moral of my story is, these people never buying a certain car again is a horrible way of thinking. Whose to say their next car wont be such a disaster? It just irritates me when people say these types of things.

Edited November 19, 2014 by TKFlight

[SnatchedHatch]

Ignorance is bliss my friend, I'm afraid

 

In Europe, Subaru is regarded as one of the most reliable manufavturer's, so I'vr heard from family.

 

Always enjoy hearing my EJ22 was a good buy ;-)

 

Update on our Outback,

Same spiel, they claim there is a certain amount of burned oil that is considered "normal" with this design.

We'll keep making service records and abiding by their oil change schedule, in the event of something catastrophic.

[TKFlight]

I wonder if using different weights and different oils would slow this down.

Check this:
http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/104-gen-4-2010-2014/52080-3-6-owners-does-your-car-burn-oil-between-oil-changes.html

44% = Oil level stayed the same for 7500miles
29% = Quart about every 3k
6% = Quart or more every 1.5k
19% = Less than a quart

Those numbers are going to be consistent through out. I really don't see the issue in dumping a quart of oil in every 3k, its maintenance. I think these people are like most of the world, I just wanna ride my car till the wheels fall off. Don't care if it doesn't last 10 years. I do understand the argument that its a new car and shouldn't be burning oil, a quart every 3k who really cares? Is that $7 synthetic bottle going to brake the bank? I don't think so.

[SnatchedHatch]

I wonder if using different weights and different oils would slow this down.

 

Check this:

http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/104-gen-4-2010-2014/52080-3-6-owners-does-your-car-burn-oil-between-oil-changes.html

 

44% = Oil level stayed the same for 7500miles

29% = Quart about every 3k

6% = Quart or more every 1.5k

19% = Less than a quart

 

Those numbers are going to be consistent through out. I really don't see the issue in dumping a quart of oil in every 3k, its maintenance. I think these people are like most of the world, I just wanna ride my car till the wheels fall off. Don't care if it doesn't last 10 years. I do understand the argument that its a new car and shouldn't be burning oil, a quart every 3k who really cares? Is that $7 synthetic bottle going to brake the bank? I don't think so.

 

Did you read my starter all the way through? I don't actually need somebody else to lay claim to this possibility:

 

"Our 2010 Outback failed on a road trip in a cloud of smoke a few

days and less than 1,000 miles after an oil change and 23-pt. inspection

at the selling dealership. We're told the engine block would need

replacement -- $5.200 -- and a $1,300 teardown to see what other engine

parts would need replacement," said Kames of Milwaukee. "The Outback

used immense quantities of oil; we began changing every 1,500-2000 miles

and always carried oil because the light went on frequently. Dealers

that checked said no biggie."

 

If the the car car burns over a quart in one day, what's to say it wouldn't reach an irreversible level? I mean, yes, we can keep buying oil and putting it in, yes we can stop and check the oil every hour of a drive.

It is a new car with less than 40k on it, that wouldn't be unreasonable right?

 

Then there's the whole issue of Subaru laying claim to the problem but insisting it was known, and is known, and is completely our responsibility.

That's unreasonable to expect, especially if someone hadn't known and drove that Subie into the dirt.

 

F*$k that TK, my family is not shelling out $5-7k because of some shortcoming in the manufacturing process. Subaru should own up to that.

 

My family looked long and hard at an Outback back in 97-98', thought it was solid ride for our family. Nope, it's image of reliability at the time made them choose the roomier Sienna. In fact, we stuck with Toyota's, and I Nissan, til a few years ago.

 

What I'm trying to say is Subaru's have had that major "flaw" to their name, and finally in '11, after being convinced by family in Colorado (rep Subies!), they gave the newest Outback a shot. "Oh the head-gasket issue has been thoroughly taken care of... "

 

NOPE  ??    ...suck it!!    Suck that oil up like it's leaking out the block.

 

I wouldn't put the matter so lightly TK

[TKFlight]

I'm not putting the matter so lightly, I should of worded it differently. If you are burning a quart a day then I'm on the boat with the people wanting to rip subaru's head off. The people complaining about having to dump a quart in every 3k I'm not siding for.

Agreed they should own up to it if someone has a serious oil burning problem.

[mikaleda]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

[SnatchedHatch]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worry some they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

[SnatchedHatch]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worrysome they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

[SnatchedHatch]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worrysome they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

[SnatchedHatch]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worrysome they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

[SnatchedHatch]

Newer Toyotas arnt any better. I worked on an 11 seqoia it was constantly breaking down, it had 90k miles on it and we had already replaced the brakes twice, had to replace the rear hatch latch twice and had tons of problems with the traction control

 

Lessen here, all car manufactures have problems at some point. It doesn't mean the entire brand is junk

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worrysome they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

[SnatchedHatch]

*double post*

Edited November 21, 2014 by SnatchedHatch

[mikaleda]

Agreed, it does not, but problems with the engine or traction control, worrysome they be.

 

Problems with ECS and TCS are a nightmare, how did they resolve it?

I think it finally got resolved by changing the brake booster, it had a TCS sensor in it Edited November 20, 2014 by mikaleda

[Fairtax4me]

Moral of my story is, these people never buying a certain car again is a horrible way of thinking. Whose to say their next car wont be such a disaster? It just irritates me when people say these types of things.

Maybe they'll buy GM?

 

I've heard more and more complaints of this problem lately. The thing is, I've read of plenty of older soobs doing the exact same when running synthetic oil. The synthetic is thinner, and while that's great for starting ease and fuel economy, it means the oil is more likely to vaporize during engine operation, especially at high engine speeds (3,000rpm) during constant highway cruising.

 

Half a quart to one quart in 3,000 miles can be considered normal, but it seems to me that subaru is far behind the times for oil change intervals. Honda has had 7500 mile change intervals all the way back to 1990, possibly longer than that. Most European makes have had 7,500-10,000 mile change intervals when using synthetic oil, for at least 15 years now. Pretty much every auto maker I can think of actually, has a change integral of at least 5,000 miles. If any car were to burn a quart of oil over the course of a change interval I would certainly consider that normal. 2 quarts if its on the first 10-15k miles. But any more than that and there is a definite problem.

 

I'll also make a point here towards people talking of the oil light coming on. Subaru doesn't have oil level sensors in any of their cars that I'm aware of. So when the oil light comes on its because the engine has lost oil pressure. The oil is so low at that point that there isn't enough left in the oil pan for the oil pump to suck up into the pick-up tube, and the pump is sucking air instead. At this point the engine has lost far more than one quart of oil!!! Being ONE quart low will never cause the oil pressure lamp to turn on. Most engines have a reserve oil pan capacity of about 3 quarts of oil. That means that if the engine holds 4.5 quarts of oil, when the engine is running there will be 1.5 quarts of oil in circulation through the engine and three quarts of oil still in the oil pan. That means you need to lose between 2.5 and 3 quarts of oil for the oil pan to be sucked completely dry during engine operation, and cause the oil pressure lamp to turn on.

If one quart is burned away, that still leaves 2 quarts in the oil pan, which is more than enough to allow the oil pump to continue pumping oil.

 

When the oil pressure light is coming on, the engine has lost at least 2.5 quarts of oil (more than half the capacity for most Subarus).

[MilesFox]

Not subaru related, but i had an oil bay customer with a toyota dual vvt engine who declined the recommended synthetic oil because his car consumes due to a factory defect where the #3 piston rings were installed upside down.

[SnatchedHatch]

Not subaru related, but i had an oil bay customer with a toyota dual vvt engine who declined the recommended synthetic oil because his car consumes due to a factory defect where the #3 piston rings were installed upside down.

There's so much wrong with that statement..wha ..why hasn't it been rectified?

 

See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.. until there's a serious problem?

That's how Nissan handled the problem with the precat/exhaust manifold assembly on my SE-R... althought there was an extremely high chnace you'd reach the stage of engine/brick mode. Still, they never officially released a recall.

Edited November 21, 2014 by SnatchedHatch

[darsdoug]

There's so much wrong with that statement..wha ..why hasn't it been rectified?

 

See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.. until there's a serious problem?

That's how Nissan handled the problem with the precat/exhaust manifold assembly on my SE-R... althought there was an extremely high chnace you'd reach the stage of engine/brick mode. Still, they never officially released a recall.

[TKFlight]

That's how Nissan handled the problem with the precat/exhaust

manifold assembly on my SE-R... althought there was an extremely high

chnace you'd reach the stage of engine/brick mode. Still, they never

officially released a recall.

 

Strange. My mother has an exhaust problem with her Nissan Altima, the dealer said it had an exhaust leak so it was brought there. Before it was brought there it had a really bad smell sometimes, on the passenger front side. Came back and it still has the same intermittent smell. Smells like burning JB Weld, I know that because I needed a quick fix for my jeep exhaust for a few days. Boy did it stink.

[SnatchedHatch]

 

Strange. My mother has an exhaust problem with her Nissan Altima, the dealer said it had an exhaust leak so it was brought there. Before it was brought there it had a really bad smell sometimes, on the passenger front side. Came back and it still has the same intermittent smell. Smells like burning JB Weld, I know that because I needed a quick fix for my jeep exhaust for a few days. Boy did it stink.

The Sentra SE-R's problem was only on some Altima's, all SE-R's had a design flaw in the ceramic substrate in the cat that was part of the exhaust manifold.

It could cause an overheated cat,after crumbling up and getting sucked back into the engine. Poor combustion would clog the cat.

 

What was the issue with yours?

[TKFlight]

Exhaust smell in the cabin. There's a bad smell sometimes when you get out of the passenger seat, really can't explain it. I know nissans have catalytic converter issues, but there are no check engine lights or anything strange going on. The exhaust in the cabin is fixed but the strange intermittent smell outside the car is still there.

[bluedotsnow]

speaking of cats I was about to say 1 quart every 1000 miles?!?! that can't be good for the cats! poor little fuzzy cats, but seriously all that burned oil sounds like a clogged cat to me after 40-50k planned obsolescence???

[SnatchedHatch]

 

THE CATS WILL BE NEXT

Edited November 22, 2014 by SnatchedHatch