95 Legacy L timing belt job.

[nicholi2789]

Hey everyone, so i decided I would take everyone's advice and getting the timing belt done on my 95 legacy. It has 264k on it and I have no idea when it was done last. I ordered this one:http://m.ebay.com/itm/260925109309?_mwBanner=1 off eBay. It came highly recommended by several experienced members on this site.

I've been considering this for a couple weeks now and have read as many tutorials as I could find and am confident I can do this. I had a couple questions about the job though.

One is that I see the kit comes with 5 seals. The four cam seals and the fifth one. The fifth gasket would be the crank seal right? It doesn't say on the kits description. Another thing, what will I use to seal the water pump? I've heard RTV silicone will work but other said it won't. Any opinions from somebody who has actually done this?

Another thing, this model of the Subaru is a NON-INTERFERENCE engine correct? Everything I read says that it is. Just wanna make sure as it makes this job a little easier.

And lastly, does anyone who has done this before have any recommendations or cautions for me for a person who's a newbie on timing belts? Are there any other seals or small things I should take care of while I'm in there?

Also, does anyone have a sheet of the torque specs on every individual component? I wanna make sure to get everything right. I have the FSM for this but it's in PDF form and I can't find the right page.

Thanks

[nicholi2789]

Hey everyone, so i decided I would take everyone's advice and getting the timing belt done on my 95 legacy. It has 264k on it and I have no idea when it was done last. I ordered this one:http://m.ebay.com/itm/260925109309?_mwBanner=1 off eBay. It came highly recommended by several experienced members on this site.

I've been considering this for a couple weeks now and have read as many tutorials as I could find and am confident I can do this. I had a couple questions about the job though.

One is that I see the kit comes with 5 seals. The four cam seals and the fifth one. The fifth gasket would be the crank seal right? It doesn't say on the kits description. Another thing, what will I use to seal the water pump? I've heard RTV silicone will work but other said it won't. Any opinions from somebody who has actually done this?

Another thing, this model of the Subaru is a NON-INTERFERENCE engine correct? Everything I read says that it is. Just wanna make sure as it makes this job a little easier.

And lastly, does anyone who has done this before have any recommendations or cautions for me for a person who's a newbie on timing belts? Are there any other seals or small things I should take care of while I'm in there?

Also, does anyone have a sheet of the torque specs on every individual component? I wanna make sure to get everything right. I have the FSM for this but it's in PDF form and I can't find the right page.

I know this is a butt-load of questions but it's necessary. I like to know everything I can and have every contingency covered before hand.

Thanks

Edited January 9, 2015 by nicholi2789

[ocei77]

Many videos etc on youtube. In the NewGen stcky above there is reference to T belt how to's.

The fifth seal is for the crank.

Remove oil pump , check and retighten screws on back. Will need a new o ring.

Do not use the paper gasket for the water pump. Generally the original metal can be reused. If not, oem.

Take your time

 

O.

T belt sohc.pdf

[nicholi2789]

Many videos etc on youtube. In the NewGen stcky above there is reference to T belt how to's.

The fifth seal is for the crank.

Remove oil pump , check and retighten screws on back. Will need a new o ring.

Do not use the paper gasket for the water pump. Generally the original metal can be reused. If not, oem.

Take your time

 

O.

Thanks for the reply. Yeah the oil pump was the original reason why I wanted to do this belt (plus I knew it needed to be done anyways, and wanna fix my cam seal leaks). I figured that it was the crank seal just wanted to be sure. Where can I get the O-ring for the oil pump? O-reilly's?

[nicholi2789]

Also, as I said before, this car is old and has seen alot of miles. Is there anything I should worry about breaking when doing this job? Like the timing cover bolts or anything else I don't know about?

[idosubaru]

correct - noninterference

use a Subaru water pump gasket - they're metal stamped/far superior than anything else.  no sealant needed

 

it's fairly simple really - the timing bolts like to rust and stick inside the inserts int he rear cover and just spin, so the bolt never comes out.  that's annoying.

 

the 22mm crank bolt is a beast - you gotta get it tight when reinstalling or it'll back off - a lot of people don't install it tight enough.  easier on an automatic since you can lock it in place through the bell housing access hole and flex plate holes.

 

tighten the backing plate screws on the oil pump, one or more will be loose for sure.

[Olnick]

Great questions!  The 5 seals confused me too, so I called them.  Seems they had forgotten to shoot a catalog pic for the EJ22 so they just used the one for the EJ25!  They'll send you 2 extra cam seals.  The odd size seal is for the crank.

 

Most of us use Permatex "Ultra-Grey" to seal the oil pump. It's acceptable to Subaru, although  "Anaerobic" is the preferable one.

 

Do a search here (USMB) or on Google or in a Haynes manual for the sealing pattern.  Main thing, don't glob too much on--just a narrow bead along a specific pattern.

 

Yes, your '95 EJ22 is a non-interference engine.

 

There's tons of excellent material here on USMB--try a search.  I pulled some stuff for you earlier but couldn't get it to link to a post!  Will try again later.

 

And keep asking questions!!!

[lewisd]

It took me a while but I was able to do my 99 2.2 legacy's thanks to all the advice and help here. Like GrossGary said, the 22 mm crank bolt can be tough. I used extension on my breaker bar and got hefty torque ratchet bar from Harbor freight to tighten back on. I've got 75,000 on it since. Good luck

[nicholi2789]

Don't know why this got posted twice. So about that.

[nicholi2789]

So I'm assuming the tensioner that comes with this kit is for the 2.5 liter only? I know the 2.2 tensioner is the hydraulic one. So basically it comes with a tensioner I can't use?

[Olnick]

The Mizumo kit you got does not include a tensioner--it has the new roller w/bearing that mounts on the tensioner.

 

The water pump gasket is metal, the equivalent of a Subaru OEM gasket.

 

I think it's best to get the oil pump O-ring from a Subaru dealership--it's only a couple of bucks.

[upnorthguy]

In the FSM, go to the engine section. in the version of the FSM I have the timing info is in the pdf named "MSA5TCD95L5458".  Torque specs are there.

 

I found that the plastic on the timing covers likes to break when the frozen nut/bolts are turned, and you end up removing the cover .  Zip ties work to resecure them if you don't break it too badly.  Spray with some penetrating oil before.

 

Getting out the seals can be a bit tricky (I didn't want to score anything).  Spend $13 bucks on this Lisle seal puller.  Makes removal so easy.

 

Beergarage.com has a nice pic tutorial on a bunch of stuff, including the oil pump.  It also has the o-ring part number (806919050).

[idosubaru]

So I'm assuming the tensioner that comes with this kit is for the 2.5 liter only? I know the 2.2 tensioner is the hydraulic one. So basically it comes with a tensioner I can't use?

 

You have to buy the actual tensioner separate for the old style tensioners, the kits don't generally come with those.  The newer style kits often and easily have the tensioner included with the kits.

 

It's not a 2.5 or 2.2 difference.  2.5, 2.2, 1.8, 3.3 (SVX) tensioners are all identical, same thing.  There are only two new gen tensioners from 1990 - 2009, old style is 1990-1997 and new style is 1997+.

 

Yours is a 1995 and that is the correct kit.  They never come with the tensioner - it's just the tensioner pulley.

 

The good news is the old style tensioners are reliable - far more reliable than the new style which should be replaced every time.

The bad news is they are getting old and yours has a quarter million miles...

 

You have to buy it separate in the older style tensioners like you have. 

 

If you buy a new style tensioner bracket (or get one) you can use the new style tensioner.  3 bolts, swap tensioner brackets and then you can use the other style tensioner and get the kit...obviously to late for you to do that.

[nicholi2789]

Hmm.. I see now. Well hopefully the old tensioner is still good. I honestly don't have the money to spend on more miscellaneous parts. I read that if you can compress that tensioner by hand then it is no good. Seems pretty obvious to me .

[heartless]

Hmm.. I see now. Well hopefully the old tensioner is still good. I honestly don't have the money to spend on more miscellaneous parts. I read that if you can compress that tensioner by hand then it is no good. Seems pretty obvious to me .

 

yup, pretty much.

 

if it is still good, compress it very slowly! trying to compress too quickly will damage the internals. I do mine in a large bench vise - snug it in so it doesnt fall out, then maybe a 1/4 turn at a time (just until there is resistance under a light touch) letting it rest between turns for 5-10 minutes while I do other things...

 

If you do need a replacement, RockAuto.com has hydraulic tensioners (old style) for under $70 (Dayco & DNJ - $61.79, Beck-Arnley - $68.79) and thier shipping is usually very quick.

[mikec03]

 

I found that the plastic on the timing covers likes to break when the frozen nut/bolts are turned, and you end up removing the cover .  Zip

ties work to resecure them if you don't break it too badly.  Spray with some penetrating oil before.

Getting out the seals can be a bit tricky (I didn't want to score anything).  Spend $13 bucks on this Lisle seal puller.  Makes removal so easy.

 

This is really good advice [as is all the advise in the replies].  Be prepared to buy the longest tie wraps you can find.  If most of the cover screws don't brake off,  I'd be surprised.  The lisle seal puller really works nice.

 

I'm surprised that no one mentioned the crank bolt torque.  In the instructions for the 95, I think it says 65 ft lb.  However, in later years it was revised upward to 130 ft lbs.  Definitely use 130 ft lbs.

[nicholi2789]

This is really good advice [as is all the advise in the replies]. Be prepared to buy the longest tie wraps you can find. If most of the cover screws don't brake off, I'd be surprised. The lisle seal puller really works nice.

 

I'm surprised that no one mentioned the crank bolt torque. In the instructions for the 95, I think it says 65 ft lb. However, in later years it was revised upward to 130 ft lbs. Definitely use 130 ft lbs.

Hot dang, 130 ft/lbs?! I'm gonna have to borrow a better torque wrench. Mine onky goes up to 80 I think. Hmm that's gonna be tough. Maybe I'll just reef it down as tight as possible then cruise it down to the tire shop real quick and have then torque it for me. Crap now im really worried about that tensioner. What are the odds that it's still good on a car this old? There's really no telling is there? I mean dang, i don't have 70$ to drop on a tensioner. Edited January 10, 2015 by nicholi2789

[heartless]

if you have been driving the car with no timing issues then chances are the tensioner will be fine - worn out tensioners will allow the belt to jump time - especially when given a kick of the long pedal to try to beat a light that is about to change (been there, done that with my 90 - lol)

 

95 is still non-interference, so it is no real big deal if it does jump time - just the headache of the down time & resetting the timing.

[nicholi2789]

if you have been driving the car with no timing issues then chances are the tensioner will be fine - worn out tensioners will allow the belt to jump time - especially when given a kick of the long pedal to try to beat a light that is about to change (been there, done that with my 90 - lol)

 

95 is still non-interference, so it is no real big deal if it does jump time - just the headache of the down time & resetting the timing.

Alright. Well that makes me feel better cause it definetely has not had any timing issues. It doesn't look like anyone has been in that timing cover for years though. I really can't afford down time as this car is my main commuter but I'll do what I have to do.

I'm just really hoping that replacing these cam seals and crank seal stops the oil leaks so it won't leak oil onto the exhaust and smoke anymore. Anyone else had that issue?

When I drive it for more than ten minutes it will smoke a little bit after I shut it off until the oil burns off. I looked under it and it's all leaking from the front of the motor. A mechanic said it was from the cam seals. Super common issue. Hopefully this fixes it.

[heartless]

if it is all coming from the front, then yeah, the cam & crank seals should resolve most of that problem - oil pump reseal will help too.

Just make sure the new seals are seated in straight and evenly - a light coat of new oil (smear a little on with your finger tip) will help them slide in easier.

Edited January 10, 2015 by heartless

[nicholi2789]

if it is all coming from the front, then yeah, the cam & crank seals should resolve that problem.

Just make sure the new seals are seated in straight and evenly - a light coat of new oil (smear a little on with your finger tip) will help them slideYep, easier.

Yep, I really hope it does stop the smoking.That doesn't exactly make girls rip their clothes off in their haste to get in my sexy car Haha. I've watched/read a ton of material on this job and have compiled a list of things I will need for it. It will be the most major repair I have done thus far but I feel confident I can pull it off.

[heartless]

i feel confident you can pull it off, too.   If I can do it (50+ yr old female), anyone can! LOL

 

it does seem intimidating for one that has never done it, but it really isnt all that hard to do, just time consuming and a little bit fiddly.

the timing cover bolts, and the old, hard oil seals will give you the most grief - just be patient and you will get there.

[nicholi2789]

i feel confident you can pull it off, too. If I can do it (50+ yr old female), anyone can! LOL

 

it does seem intimidating for one that has never done it, but it really isnt all that hard to do, just time consuming and a little bit fiddly.

the timing cover bolts, and the old, hard oil seals will give you the most grief - just be patient and you will get there.

Haha, yeah thanks. I'm pretty good at figuring technical stuff out and using tools so it shouldn't be a problem. My only hesitance is that I will break something and get stranded. Lol.

[porcupine73]

Another thing, what will I use to seal the water pump? I've heard RTV silicone will work but other said it won't.

It uses a metal gasket with no silicone.

 

Another thing, this model of the Subaru is a NON-INTERFERENCE engine correct?

right, '95 2.2L would be non-interference.

Are there any other seals or small things I should take care of while I'm in there?

Could do the left hand cam cap o-ring.

Also, does anyone have a sheet of the torque specs on every individual component? I wanna make sure to get everything right. I have the FSM for this but it's in PDF form and I can't find the right page.

The main one of concern is the crank pulley. Originally it listed only like 70 ft-lb or so and a lot of them loosened up which then messes up the keyway for the crank sprocket. I think most people go up around 130 ft-lb, it's a pretty stout bolt.

 

If you're in a rust belt area or the vehicle was in a rust area be prepared for extra time to get the old bolts out. I.e. the timing belt cover bolts, crank sprocket might be rusted on the the crank, things like that.

Edited January 10, 2015 by porcupine73

[nicholi2789]

Could do the left hand cam cap o-ring.The main one of concern is the crank pulley. Originally it listed only like 70 ft-lb or so and a lot of them loosened up which then messes up the keyway for the crank sprocket. I think most people go up around 130 ft-lb, it's a pretty stout bolt.

 

If you're in a rust belt area or the vehicle was in a rust area be prepared for extra time to get the old bolts out. I.e. the timing belt cover bolts, crank sprocket might be rusted on the the crank, things like that.

And the cam cap O-ring your talking about, that is on the front of the driver side cam right? Rear cam seal?

And the one on the passenger side is on the back really hard to get to?