1997 Legacy repair advice needed

[TypeOPositive]

I've done some reading around this forum and a few other subaru flavors and have come to the conclusion that I've made a good purchase! This vehicle isn't perfect, however. As the title suggest, the car could use a few repairs. Things like this are to be expected from something of this age. These items include Shifter linkage (side to side play while in gear) + front axles + oxygen sensors + hatch issues + rust repair

 

Alright, so one problem at a time.

 

The more I read, the more i realize that cheap Chinese axles aren't gonna cut it like they have on my previous vehicles. For this reason, I've decided to order a set through MWE. Since I'll be waiting on this pair of axles to arrive to me, I've taken the time to get under Lucienne (My 2.2L Legacy's name!) I became a bit more familiar with how much more car I'm working with (having previously owned several Geo Metro's.) 

 

I'll attach pictures of the control arms, but I'm unsure how I want to proceed with replacement/repair. I'm torn between replacing bushings + repainting vs replacement with aftermarket (via rock auto.) I've eyeballed whiteline and Kartboy replacement bushings. I'm trying to balance cost effective with longevity. While I have the car on stands, I don't see why I shouldn't do something about this issue.I wouldn't like to run into a similar problem as the axles where the OEM parts are of higher quality and could be salvaged/repaired for a similar amount of money to replacing with lesser quality. 

 

 

I'm currently throwing codes P0141, and P0420. As told to me, the car previously had a catalytic converter failure. The rear (Downstream?) oxygen sensor (which I believe is throwing the heater circuit code) is an Ultrapower (P/N > 2343088) and was replaced <10k miles ago. I was told by the previous owner that the front oxygen sensor still needs replaced. I find this odd since these codes seem to point towards the rear sensor. Are Denso O2 sensors sufficient or should I seek out OEM replacements?

 

My hatch currently opens and closes, but it does not lock (Brighton model, so only the key locks it I assume.) I am not sure if this is because of the rusted plate that the hatch handle attaches to or perhaps the tumblers for the lock mechanism need lubrication. But I've read about 100 different opinions on what to use when lubricating locks. Basically, the key will not spin the lock in either direction. 

 

Aside from that, I would like to nip the rust cancer in the butt. Living in the rust belt sucks. Having owned geo metros that rust to death, rust scares the hell out of me. I have a small patch on my rear quarter that's clean through, it's smaller than the size of my fist. I believe that removing all rust and welding in new metal will be the best option. However, paying a shop to do this is expensive. Prohibitively expensive. Really, the exterior appearance is much less important to me than the underside of the car. I think it would be a good practice to learn how to handle this on my own (if at all possible.) Especially considering the rust appearing on the underside of the suspension components. I'm not even sure if I can afford the proper tools (Needle scaler+large capacity air compressor vs media blaster)

 

I'll continue to read and take notes as I wait for advice. I appreciate everyone's time who takes the time to read or make any suggestions. I'm sorry this is such a long post. I'm still getting comfortable with the search function, please be gentle. 

 

 

[Olnick]

Re: Shifter linkage.  Most likely worn-out or missing bushings in the "boss joint"--the universal type connector that joins the linkage rod from your gearshift to the tranny stub-out.  I did mine about 10 years ago--a real PITA job but well worth the effort!

 

For some reason I can't post a link here, so try an advanced search for "Shifter Bushings"--limit it to New Gen/90s Legacy forum--put my user name, Olnick, in as author . . . should get you some info.

 

Re:  Hatch Lock.  My son's '96 Outback had the same problem.  Key wouldn't even turn!  So once, when we had the interior panels off the hatch, I noticed the lock cylinder was easily accessible.  I removed it, soaked it in penetrating oil, washed it thoroughly with brake cleaner.  Years of dirt, grime and gunk came pouring out--afterwards it worked like new!

 

Good luck.

[1 Lucky Texan]

I'm not sure there's a lot wrong with what i can see in the pics. I may be wrong but, don't a lot of people live with rust like that?

 

that said, look for Febest bushings at Amazon. Polyurethane will be VERY noisy and harsh. I think also there are lower control arms that also have a new balljoint already in them. Considering the difficulty in swapping that inner bushing - and all the rust, entire new arm (AKA transverse link) seems attractive.

 

that 0141 code seems to point to a wiring problem or  burned out heater circuit in the rear sensor.

 

a car as old as yours may have an exhaust leak - that can cause the P0420, but many other things will too. A cheap diagnostic test is a vacuum gauge. probably free loaner from parts store - you can find a list of problems it can show on-line.

[TypeOPositive]

Olnick,

 

I had my suspicions about the Ujoint for that play. I will look up your existing thread on that. That's excellent news about the hatch lock! I was really hoping to be able to secure the vehicle. I will have to splurge and buy a new plate. Is it worth doing that for the other rusty bolt on plates on the car, or could I just clean them up and repaint them? Seems like breaking bolts would be the biggest concern there.

 

Texan, 

 

You're probably correct that many people live with rust like that. I'm likely just being obsessive since every vehicle I've had since 2008 ended up with swiss cheese frames, and eventually rendered the vehicles undriveable. 

 

Those Febest bushings are priced right, about $60 less than OEM ... Each! I'm guessing the second gen outback fitment issue talked about in the review for the transverse link doesn't apply to the legacy?

Do you have any reccomendations on the brand for the control arms should I choose to replace the entire assembly? 

 

I'll have to more carefully examine the wiring to the downstream sensor. Heat shields seem to hinder the view a bit, but I'm sure a mirror would work wonders. I do have a new set of manifold gaskets, and they have been off before. Perhaps I should replace those before I buy any sensors at all. 

[Olnick]

TypeO+ . . . a good resource for small parts--hatch lock plates and such--is junk yards, especially Pull n' Pays.

[upnorthguy]

Are Denso O2 sensors sufficient or should I seek out OEM replacements?

 

Denso O2 sensors are perfect and are OEM equivalent.   When I bought one a few months ago Rockauto had the best price for that downstream sensor (about $50 as I recall).  Look around online for a 5% RA coupon to save a few bucks.

[1 Lucky Texan]

I don't recall what brands were at RA for that LCA. maybe others have experience with it.

 

not sure either on you fitment question. If Febest lists a part for the legacy, it should fit. There is about 1 inch difference becaiuse of the Outback's lift.

 

wish i was more help.

[TypeOPositive]

Olnick,

 

It appears local junkyards don't have any Subarus. Blessing or a curse? I've tried to look around for same era parts cars as well. No such luck! 

 

Texan,

 

I'll follow up with Febest to determine the best option on my budget. I will also try and avoid the Polyurethane bushings.

 

North,

 

Thanks for the input. I feel more comfortable ordering those replacements now.

 

I'm thinking for my application, a pneumatic needle scaler is a bit excessive. I've read about a couple of successful jobs using grinders with knotted steel cup brushes. I wouldn't know what to follow up with, (cleaning, priming, and painting, etc) though. I'll see what I can find out through the vastness knowledge banks of the google. 

 

Thanks for your input everyone!

[lstevens76]

If you can't find any in junkyards there is a sale section here and you can also ask people here to look for you in there local junkyards.

[idosubaru]

i wouldn't bother with the rust - no way you'll get it all.  i've done a bunch - there's so many layers and folds behind that rear quarter panel and other parts the you can't get it all out.  you'll replace a bunch but there's more rust down in there that's going to come out.

 

i'd leave all that suspension and bushing stuff alone and just drive the car.  make repairs/upgrades based on assessment.

 

then i'd plan on getting a rust free southern/western car in a couple years to replace what you now have.   fly out and drive home.  it is SOOOOO worth it.  ends up being cheaper, better car, less maintenance, it's a win win all the way around.

[TypeOPositive]

lstevens76, I've taken pictures of the parts I would like to replace and will make a post in the appropriate section to see if a kind forum member would pull them for me!

 

grossgary, I have 4 years left on my current path in college. Do you think my attempts at slowing down the decay to extend the life to that time frame, or am I being optimistic? It makes sense to me (at least in theory) to knock down the surface area existing rust has to operate on and try and cover it up. Removing one of the three elements rust forms under SHOULD stop it, but I know better. I've never tried and watched the aftermath either. The best I can find are before and after shots of "rust restorations" on forums where people are performing repairs on cars costing 4x what my Brighton did new. 

 

I'd LOVE to find a southern car in the next couple summers. Do you have to do anything to the under body of those once you get them?? I had planned my next vehicle to be from a snow free state (away from the ocean!), but i was not patient in my search. 

 

Is putting a tachometer into the empty space in the dash a plug and play thing for Brighton wagons?

[Fairtax4me]

You need to replace those front control arms.

 

Post here in the classified section and im sure someone can ship you a set of much less rusty or rust free used arms for less than buying two new cheapos.

[Olnick]

Re tachometer:  Many folks have done it and it sounds pretty easy.  Try searching here on USMB using these titles: 

Installing a factory tach and Brighton Instruments.

[TypeOPositive]

I made a post in the wanted section of the marketplace. I thought the control arms looked rough enough to replace while I had them off. I'll buy bushings while I'm at it. 

 

I was unable to find out exactly what the Febest bushings are made from. I've had an email with their sales department for the better part of a week now.  A phone rep mentioned that when he installed them, they looked a lot like polyurethane. I wonder if using the recycled rubber does anything positive for their properties compared to competitors. The price point is hard to beat, so it's likely I'll buy theirs vs OEM.

 

I'm still pretty conflicted about the underside that's rusty though, that sway bar is also pretty gnarly looking. I'm sure some fresh bushings there couldn't hurt either. 

 

Also, I couldn't just let a sleeping dog lie. I put the rear on ramps and it doesn't look so hot either. I'm not sure if anything needs replaced immediately, but it isn't very reassuring. Might be ahead of the game to look around at parts cars. Probably just as rusty though...

 

At minimum, I need to clean off the rear differential to see if it's leaking, or if it was just changed in a hurry / overfilled. The buildup is only on the rear of the cover, and none in front of that. The two bolts that seem to be secured to that cover are corroded beyond recognition... What have I gotten myself into?

 

Edit: By two bolts, I'm not talking about the drain / fill plugs. The two above those 

 

Thanks again for the tips and suggestions!

Edited June 20, 2015 by TypeOPositive

[1 Lucky Texan]

I HAD poly and dumped them for Febest. Drastic improvement in harshness.

how they would compare to fresh OEM, I dunno.

you can read the entire 'saga' here; http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/99-do-yourself-illustrated-guides/48910-lower-control-arm-rear-bushing-transverse-link-replaced-prothane-03-outback.html


I still have the new inner bushings (I THINK) and the slightly used rear bushings. Dunno how much shipping would be but, make me an offer. Unless you plan to lift your leggy, you won't need the actual mount so, shipping will be a little less if I pull the parts out of the mount. Some folks say the housing isn't different enough to matter.  And you will want to source some new grease to put on them after you clean them up.

a new kit though is not expensive. If you are gonna track the car or run it off-road - or if it was never on anything but the smoothest pavement, poly would be good. Tightens up the steering responses a little, makes 'takeoffs' and braking feel, uh - more 'immediate' I guess. hard to explain.

Edited June 20, 2015 by 1 Lucky Texan

[TypeOPositive]

Ohh! That's good news about the Febest bushings! I've sent you a PM Texan

[ccrinc]

Just a comment: MWE axles are the best! I won't use any but Marshall's on my own car. 

[1 Lucky Texan]

Ohh! That's good news about the Febest bushings! I've sent you a PM Texan

 

 

Just to be clear, if I can locate everything, i have used (less than 10-12K miles) Prothane bushings already in front LCA rear Outback housings, and unused Prothane inner bushings. They are harsh going over sharp transitions (like uneven concrete expansion joints for instance)

 

The Febest rubber units have been fine since I installed them. Also, user grossgary here at USMB has used them many times with no issues.

Edited July 13, 2015 by 1 Lucky Texan

[1 Lucky Texan]

it's Prothane kit 16-201 (mine's red) but, not sure if it will fit a 97.

[TypeOPositive]

Would it be better to pick up a set of used OEM control arms or a set of new ones from rockauto?? I still need to buy those and bushings.

 

 

I was also looking into performing a transmission / differential fluid change since I have the half shafts on the vehicle now. I have read that I will not be able to drain the entire transmission (3.7 quarts for Manual transmission according to the service manual I have), but I can repeat the procedure to change the vast majority of the fluid.. I've read the rear differential takes nearly 1 quart. Do I change the front differential fluid? 

 

I figured I would go OEM with Subaru extra-S(unless someone has a better suggestion) but have wondered if the item number listed on amazon is correct (via amazon) #=SOA427V1700

[Fairtax4me]

Manual trans will drain about 90% of the old oil out, and front diff fluid is shared.

Extra-S is highly recommended by many. Order 5 quarts on amazon and you'll have enough to do the trans and rear diff and have a bit left over.

 

I would go with a used set of OEM control arms if you can get some that are fairly free of rust. Aftermarkets don't usually last long.

[TypeOPositive]

Alright, I'll attempt to source those used in good shape then. Insanely expensive to buy new... That's ridiculous.

 

I might price the Extra S at the dealer too, worth a shot anyway. 

 

Thanks for the tip.

[Fairtax4me]

Most dealers dont sell extra S by the quart, if they have it at all. Only a few of the online dealers sell it in quarts, most of which bottle it themselves.

[TypeOPositive]

Are there other suppliers? The amazons indicate that it's actually a different product. I'm guessing I could email a different buyer to verify. 

[Fairtax4me]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B007L6Q1EK/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1436753509&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX110_SY165_QL70&keywords=SOA427V1700

 

This one is through Fred Beans Subaru. They were one of, if not the first, to bottle and sell Extra S by the quart.