96 legacy AT oil temp lights,engine stalls

[Lakesong]

I bought a 96 legacy a few months ago to use as a dog mobile for my for labs. It had hit several deer and looks bad but drove well,engine sounds very good, at tranny shifted smoothly. A few days ago my wife tried to jump a stuck motorist. A few miles down the road check engine light comes on and car stalls. Codes indicate misfire cylinders 3 & 4, plus code p1101 indicating a problem with neutral position switch.

I checked plugs and wires on 3 & 4 plugs looked good but worn. Checked wires and it ran as normal. Next day after driving 20 min or so AT oil temp light comes on and engine stalls. Had to wait for engine to fully cool and car starts. Drove home,she seemed to shift normally but when I left idling for a while AT oil temp comes on and car stalls and will not start until cools down. Other than AT light not throwing any codes. My dogs would appreciate any help as would I.

[Rooster2]

I am having trouble figuring out why there would be a connection between AT oil temp light, followed by engine stalling. Is the engine perhaps over heating as well. Did you observe where the coolant temp gauge was pointing? Prolly a good start would be to swap in new plug wires and spark plugs.

 

Have you pulled out the ATF dip stick to check fluid level. It is located up by the firewall on driver's side?

[Lakesong]

Thanks for suggestions. I didn't notice temp gauge. Will check that and do plugs and wires tomorrow. AT fluid is at proper level and appears clean.

[Rooster2]

Before changing plugs and wires, drive the car again. Watch the coolant temp gauge to see if you have over heating. If so, then head gaskets are generally the culprit causing over heating on your model motor. Air bubbles can be seen in the radiator over flow tank to confirm bad head gaskets. Changing the plugs and wires is a nasty job. There is hardly any room to use a driver and socket to swap in new plugs. It requires several different size small extensions to extract the plugs. You will learn to cuss a lot during the extraction process. I have read advise regarding loosening the motor mounts so engine can be jacked up, and tipped up a little to one side, to make sparkplug removal easier.

[ccrinc]

Your wife likely fried your alternator when she jumped the other car.  If it's not done just right, this is all too common.

What else is common?  The AT light is a warning light in a Legacy for a bad alternator, which is kind of insane, but true.  PLUS, your trans fluid is NOT affected by this at all.  It's not having to "cool down"...what's happening is that your (obviously strong) battery is gathering up just enough power to get the car to start again.  This won't last long, however.  Hopefully, all this is not stressing your battery into death mode too.

 

Have the alternator tested.  Don't  go through all that other crap until you do that!   I've seen it, I've had it happen to me as well, and it's pretty common knowledge.  

 

Edit: Oh, also...check to make sure it's not just a faulty alternator belt.  Sometimes it really is just the simple things.

 

Emily

Edited September 2, 2015 by ccrinc

[Lakesong]

Yesterday tried to start so I could check temp gauge as it ran , would turn over but not start. Finally got to start but had to pump gas to keep running. After a bit ran without foot on gas for about a minute,temp gauge hadn't moved,then stalled. Again would crank occasionally stutter but not start. Changed out plugs and wires(remove windshield washer reservoir makes this not too difficult,wouldn't start. This morning tried again and fired up but again had to race engine to keep running. As it warmed up able to run at lower rpm, down to @1250 rpm. Below that she stalls. Temp gauge reads in normal range, still no codes showing and at oil temp light doesn't 't come back on. A any ideas on what to check next?

[idosubaru]

I'd cover the basics first:

 

1. do you have spark at all 4 cylinders?

2. do you have sufficient fuel - i simply pull the one hose at the fuel filter and crank the engine - if it pours out, that's a good sign it's fine.  no or low flow is usually obvious in my experience. 

3. timing belt - is it properly aligned?

4. is the engine turning fast enough to start?  (battery weak?)
 

you'd be wise to get a full timing kit for it soon - the pulleys and tensioner are prone to failure and bend valves when they do.  Gates kits on Amazon are $130 for everything and can be install in well under 2 hours, particularly if you've got no rust to deal with.

[idosubaru]

Oh - and do you have or has this car ever had any remote start, alarm type systems on it?

[logic23]

if it was jummped incorectly the computer might be fried

[ccrinc]

if it was jummped incorectly the computer might be fried

 

OR the alternator!  Did you read what I posted?

 

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=280993

 

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070127112736AAqwYEK

 

Bad ground between the battery negative post and the body, engine and alternator case.

 

Charge the battery again and start the car. Then, with the engine

running at around 1000 rpm, measure the voltage across the battery --

should be around 14 V, but I suspect you will find it lower. Then

measure the voltage between the battery negative post (not the cable

clamp) and the car body, the engine block and the alternator case (three different measurements). Use a digital Voltmeter

that reads at least to one tenth, and better, one-one hundredth Volt on

its lowest scale. The voltage between the negative post and the other

points should be less than a few tenths of a Volt, but I suspect in your

case it's well over that. That indicates a bad ground, or more than

one, between the battery, body, engine and alternator. This will prevent the alternator from charging the battery, but not cause the battery warning light to come on until the car stalls due to lack of power.

 

If that's the case, it's then a matter of finding where there's a bad ground connection.

 

See this thread: 97 Legacy Outback fried 2 new alternators...so far

 

...and from our very own USMB: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/109850-sluggish-performance-check-your-alternator/

[Lakesong]

Back in town. Yesterday Fully charged battery ,new plugs and wires. Also tightened throttle cable to race engine a little to keep her going long enough for me to get out of car and under hood. Still no start. She cranks strongly. Occasionally sputters but no go. A shot of starter fluid in air cleaner and she fires and runs for @ 10 sec then quits. Today got her to fire and start, then quit after @ 20 sec. After a few more tries got to fire again this time pumped gas a little and she smoothed out.took foot off gas and ran well Rams @ 2000. After a minute or so Rams dropped to @ 1250 on tach. Ran a bit rough but kept running. After a bit Rams jumped to 2000 again for 15 to 20 sec. Then back to 1250. Cycled like this 4 or 5 times before dropped from 2000 down towards 750 then stalled. Cranks but won't start. Have charger on battery waiting for cool Dow/charge to try again. Also tried starting with charger on jump start setting. No go. Does any of this fit with alternator issue that has been suggested? By the way I have a 1997 sub legacy to use as a parts car so can swap out any sensors or relays easily enough if needed. Only difference is the parts car is manual tranny and a 97. The (hopefully) working car is a96 with auto Tracy.

[Lakesong]

A few other things. Checked spark all four cylinders. All firing. Also pulled hose coming out of fuel filter. Seemed good flow of gas ,doesn't gush out but flows fairly good especially when held below level of filter, or is this just siphoning gas?

[Lakesong]

Took battery out and had tested . Showed bad so bought new battery. Started right up, ran for @ 20 minutes or so then died. Wouldn't restart. Temp gauge was normal entire time. Threw charger on battery for a few hours and she fired up again. Let it sit for a day or so. Now won't start again.

[Fairtax4me]

Make sure all the breather and PCV hoses are connected to the intake properly and none are split/broken. Make sure the intake tube is clamped tight at both ends.

 

Is the check engine light on? Have you checked it for codes?

 

The ECU will try its hardest to get idle speed down to proper 700-750rpm and will do several things in attempt to get there. Loosen the throttle cable so it's not pulled tight. If the ECU thinks the throttle is open it will run too lean when starting. Will set codes for idle speed and possibly throttle position as well. And if you had the battery disconnected you should disconnect it again so the ECU can relearn proper idle fuel settings at closed throttle instead of trying to run on the current setting where it's seeing 10% throttle all the time.

[Lakesong]

Tightened throttle cable to original setting ,disconnected battery and reconnected. Fires right up idles at @ 1100 rpm. As she warms up rpm slowly settles to @ 700. As temp begins rise before reaching operating temp ,rpm drop and engine stalls before I can give it some gas. Now cranks strongly but won't fire. Oh, I found a disconnected vacuuming hose the other day when car would start but idle surging up and down. Solved that issue. Rechecked today and found all normal.

[Lakesong]

This morning fires right up, runs at @ 1500 rpm then settles to1100 rpm fairly quickly. Checked voltage at this point reads just under 14( @13.7 or 13.8. As temp rises rpm drops to @ 700. Same voltage reading. I shut her down at this point before she reaches normal operating temp. Let her sit @ 5 minutes. Starts up no problem. Idles for a few minutes, just before temp gauge reaches normal operating temp she stutters and immediately stalls. Try to restart, she catches stutters and stalls 1 time. After that she cranks strongly but no go. Battery shows 12 volts with key off, same with key on but not running. Also checked for bad ground as suggested above. I don't have digital voltmeter,used what I have. Needle didn't move on lowest setting(1/20 volt scale). I saw on another thread with some of same issues a suggestion @ a temp sensor, could this be issue. Will try to figure out which sensor this is and swap out from my parts car to check.

[Fairtax4me]

Might have a bad MAF sensor. Does your parts car have a MAF you can swap in?

[Lakesong]

Swapped out engine temp sensor, charged up battery, fires right up this morning and stalls out again after a few moments. Planning on swapping out crank poison sensor , cam position sensor and will try MAF sensor as well if others don't help. Thanks

[lstevens76]

Have you had the alternator tested?  The battery was fried, possibly from the jumpstart, so you need to check the alternator.

[ccrinc]

Have you had the alternator tested?  The battery was fried, possibly from the jumpstart, so you need to check the alternator.

 

DUH!!

[Lakesong]

Yes, alternator tested ok. Swapped out crank and cam position sensors ,MAF sensor and engine coolant temp sensor from my parts car. No go. She cranks but won't catch. Will try again in morning. Seems to be the pattern, starts first thing in morning runs til almost at operating temp, stalls out and will not restart til next morning. Charging battery or jumping doesn't help. Will let you know if it starts tomorrow.

[Lakesong]

Just tried to start . No go , just cranks. Does this sound like it could be an issue with fuel pump? If I listen by fuel filler with cap removed or at le tribal connection in bed of wagon I hear a click but nothing else when key switched to on position with car not running. Not sure what I should hear though. How can I test this. I'm at a loss. Anyone have any other ideas?

[Lakesong]

I had alternator tested out of vehicle. Can't get to run long enough to get somewhere to get tested in vehicle. Tested fine. Could this still be the issue.

[bgambino]

I'm not sure you tried this yet.

Run it....let it do it's usual stall.  Then spray starter fluid and see if she fires up for the 10 seconds.  If she does and stalls, try just cranking.  No start? Try starter fluid again.

It may be fuel is cutting out for some reason.  Maybe a fuel issue

[Lakesong]

Thanks, I'll try that when I get it started again. Now she won't start second morning in a row. That was when I was generally able to get her to run. May need to switch back all the sensors I swapped out from my parts car. Won't get a chance to work on it again to Sunday. Will let you know what's up.