trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Ok i came here before thinking i had a bad front wheel bearing,well i found out that it is not the front but the back(and both),because there is play. With the car in park i can push on the top of the and feel play,the drivers side a a little play,but the passenger said has at least twice the play. I just bought the car 2.5 weeks ago,and thought it was brakes making the noise. The problem is after the down payment i am kinda broke till the 2nd,and even then i have the first car payment, car ins. and my phone bill,i won't have any money to spend on repairs until the 16th. Do you think it will be okay to drive on it until then if all i am doing 10 miles each way to work 5 days a week,and mabye 5 miles to the store every so often? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carfreak85 Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 First, what sort of car is it? We can't help you at all if you don't tell us what you're working with. You're going to have to use your common sense on the condition of the bearings. You can drive them until the wheels fall off, but you will potentially be doing damage to other components that will end up costing you more in the long run. Your best bet is to not drive until you can get the car fixed. Not to get all preachy or to put you down, but my biggest concern is that it sounds like you bought a car that you couldn't afford to buy outright and now can't afford to maintain it. A pre purchase inspection would have gone a long way towards A) making the car more affordable by pointing out the necessary repairs to the seller, and would have shown you the true condition of the vehicle, giving you the chance to decide if you really wanted to take on the repairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 By coincidence I am having a rear wheel bearing done today, roughly an hour and a half job, plus $60 or so per bearing. I am just having the one needing it done, and the mechanic upped his labor charge to $180 from $100 this morning maybe because it was going to be a pressed in job. This wheel has been making noise for a year and a half, sometimes alarming during all that time. Usually bearings, CV joints etc. take a long time to go totally bad, regularly examine them would be my recommendation. You could go back to the seller letting him know what the problem is, in some states buyers of used cars have a lot of options working through the state AG especially if the seller knew he was palming off a problem on an unsuspecting buyer. But first give the seller a chance to address the problem, which he may do if he made a significant profit on the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Author Share Posted November 25, 2015 First, what sort of car is it? We can't help you at all if you don't tell us what you're working with. You're going to have to use your common sense on the condition of the bearings. You can drive them until the wheels fall off, but you will potentially be doing damage to other components that will end up costing you more in the long run. Your best bet is to not drive until you can get the car fixed. Not to get all preachy or to put you down, but my biggest concern is that it sounds like you bought a car that you couldn't afford to buy outright and now can't afford to maintain it. A pre purchase inspection would have gone a long way towards A) making the car more affordable by pointing out the necessary repairs to the seller, and would have shown you the true condition of the vehicle, giving you the chance to decide if you really wanted to take on the repairs. Sorry i should have said it is a 2005 Subaru Impreza 2.5RS. i don't have another car,and the nearest bus stop is 4 miles away I am buying from a dealership,because i NEEDED another car,and it was the only one i could find that would work with me for only $750 down,and a broken car as trade. I had picked this car because the engine is perfect,and i truly thought it was the brakes when i first looked at it,if it had been brakes i could of afforded to do it on my next paycheck and just do it myself,but it turned out to not be what i expected. By coincidence I am having a rear wheel bearing done today, roughly an hour and a half job, plus $60 or so per bearing. I am just having the one needing it done, and the mechanic upped his labor charge to $180 from $100 this morning maybe because it was going to be a pressed in job. This wheel has been making noise for a year and a half, sometimes alarming during all that time. Usually bearings, CV joints etc. take a long time to go totally bad, regularly examine them would be my recommendation. You could go back to the seller letting him know what the problem is, in some states buyers of used cars have a lot of options working through the state AG especially if the seller knew he was palming off a problem on an unsuspecting buyer. But first give the seller a chance to address the problem, which he may do if he made a significant profit on the deal. If it helps the passanger is bad enough that when i push on the top of the wheel i can hear a small clunk/thunk,the drivers side i just feel play. I'm not sure i want to go back to them,because while they did work with me on the fact that the radio had gotten stolen the day before i bought it(someone had forgotten to lock it after a test drive) and the let me have the aftermarket radio from my trade,but they were to stupid to install it,the salesman just tried to plug in the harness from my last car and tried to plug it in the subaru harness and then asked me if the radio was working before,i just ended up doing the radio myself. So i am not sure they would even do the wheel bearings,and even if so i don't know if i would trust them. Also for options you were talking about i live in texas,are there any options for me? Because when i asked about the brakes when i was buying the car all the salesman said was i might want to get them done soon,but one of the mechanics said they MIGHT work with me and replace them for no labor if i bought the parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 (edited) If there is play, you're eating the tires on every drive. Bearings aren't likely to cause you a crash, but will accelerate lots of other issues. if tires wear enough, you'll start getting torque bind in your drivetrain and may be sacrificing your transmission and differential. On the cheap, you can probably get a used pair of rear spindles from a junkyard and swap them in. Takes about an hour per side and wont require much more than a good socket set and a socket for the axle nuts. But I'd at least stop by and tell them what's going on. If there's no warranty they are under no obligation to do anything. (As is sales put the responsibility of knowing the car on the buyers shoulders) But considering it's only been a couple weeks, they may value your business and satisfaction enough to help out - even partially. All they can do is say no, which puts you no worse off. Most of us can talk you through swapping a rear spindle. It's a few steps past a brake job. If you've worked on cars, it's not a big job. You can do it the driveway. Edited November 25, 2015 by AdventureSubaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I don't think dealerships can just palm off problem vehicles, even by writing "as is" on the title. You can check in with your state AG consumer affairs to discuss options with them if the dealer does not help solve the problem: https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/cpd/consumer-protection Many used car sellers are notorious for leaving buyers with significant problems like this, it is bad business practice and unethical to flip vehicles without doing their due diligence on the car before flipping it to you. Bearings usually go slowly, as I indicated at least a year and a half on my 99 Outback with no noticeable effects on any other functions of the vehicle. I would definitely have the dealer make good on the car especially with likely buy price as a trade in, etc., of $1000 or so and sale price of maybe $4000, just a guess. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Author Share Posted November 25, 2015 (edited) If there is play, you're eating the tires on every drive. Bearings aren't likely to cause you a crash, but will accelerate lots of other issues. if tires wear enough, you'll start getting torque bind in your drivetrain and may be sacrificing your transmission and differential. On the cheap, you can probably get a used pair of rear spindles from a junkyard and swap them in. Takes about an hour per side and wont require much more than a good socket set and a socket for the axle nuts. But I'd at least stop by and tell them what's going on. If there's no warranty they are under no obligation to do anything. (As is sales put the responsibility of knowing the car on the buyers shoulders) But considering it's only been a couple weeks, they may value your business and satisfaction enough to help out - even partially. All they can do is say no, which puts you no worse off. Most of us can talk you through swapping a rear spindle. It's a few steps past a brake job. If you've worked on cars, it's not a big job. You can do it the driveway. The tires still have a lot of tread and are not showing weird wear yet,do you think with that it would be safe JUST for the 3 weeks until i can afford to replace them? Because i just checked all the junkyards sites within 30 miles of me,and none have any impreza's at all lol... EDIT: no forester's or legacy's either... Edited November 25, 2015 by trainergames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 If you bought it at the dealer you should have at least a 30 day partial warranty. Read your contract, talk to sales, etc to find out more details. I'd oped a case about it right now so you have it on record as being an issue ASAP that way if you have to pester them to cover the bearing they won't come back and tell you it's past the 30 days. When the bearing gets really bad it can damage the hub or knuckle necessitating replacement. The bearing didn't go from fine to having play in the couple weeks you've owned the car, that's BS, they need to take care of you on this one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Author Share Posted November 25, 2015 If you bought it at the dealer you should have at least a 30 day partial warranty. Read your contract, talk to sales, etc to find out more details. I'd oped a case about it right now so you have it on record as being an issue ASAP that way if you have to pester them to cover the bearing they won't come back and tell you it's past the 30 days. When the bearing gets really bad it can damage the hub or knuckle necessitating replacement. The bearing didn't go from fine to having play in the couple weeks you've owned the car, that's BS, they need to take care of you on this one. I just read through the paper work i signed when i bought the car,and one said on it in big letters "AS IS NO WARRANTY",i know i should have been more careful when buying the car,but this is my second time buying a car for myself and i am 26,so i am young and dumb lol. I will try to talk to them,but i don't know if they will be willing to do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Here is a blurb from the state of Texas on consumer rights, I would give them a ring to explain the situation if you don't get help from the dealer: https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/cpd/buying-a-car-used-or-new How much in total are you paying for this vehicle with initial payment and payments plan?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I don't think dealerships can just palm off problem vehicles, even by writing "as is" on the title. You can check in with your state AG consumer affairs to discuss options with them if the dealer does not help solve the problem: https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/cpd/consumer-protection Many used car sellers are notorious for leaving buyers with significant problems like this, it is bad business practice and unethical to flip vehicles without doing their due diligence on the car before flipping it to you. Bearings usually go slowly, as I indicated at least a year and a half on my 99 Outback with no noticeable effects on any other functions of the vehicle. I would definitely have the dealer make good on the car especially with likely buy price as a trade in, etc., of $1000 or so and sale price of maybe $4000, just a guess. Bad business practice yes. A lot of dealerships as mentioned at least give 30 days and plenty will offer some sort of warranty. But, there is also AS-IS sales. Consumers need to know the difference and realize that without a written agreement or warranty it is truly "buyer beware" At this point buying from a dealer is no better or worse than buying off craigslist or auction. You can save $$$ on the sticker price but there's no guarantees and scumbags exist who will try and pass off bad vehicles. Used to work for a very reputable used car business in Pennsylvania. We had a retail lot with lots of nice cars that came with financing options, warranty etc. These cars were thoroughly inspected by a mechanic and were top notch. We also had a wholesale lot which I managed which contained cars that were "AS-IS" the same mechanic inspected them and gave a report so we sold them with full disclosure, no financing and no warranty. We disclosed everything we know on the car and sold them way below retail but were able to make more off of them than we would have at auction. For 95% of folks this was a great arrangement in which they could make an educated decision and save some $$$. There was still that 5% who never paid attention to the AS-IS / Wholesale part and we'd get phone calls months and sometimes years later about every little issue that may arise. One was furious with a $1800 impreza that would leave a couple dime size oil spots whenever we parked his car. Of course I was polite and professional but I'm thinking "Fantastic? Lots of them leave puddles" Even with full disclosure (In writing. We gave them a copy of the mechanics inspection) we could only please so many people. And if we wanted to be sneaky, we surely could have made more $$$ in the short term. But the reputation of the business was more important. But there is NO buyer protection in these circumstances. Nor should there be. Adults buy cars. They're mature enough to know how to research and inspect a car, or pay someone if they are ignorant to automobiles. But the school of hard knocks is open in auto buying and those who ignore inspection and research often learn this quite well and will keep their eyes wide open next time. As has been mentioned before on this board - if you want a car without issue that wont ever surprise you, buy a new car and pony up the $$$. Saving money requires some risks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Here is a blurb from the state of Texas on consumer rights, I would give them a ring to explain the situation if you don't get help from the dealer: https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/cpd/buying-a-car-used-or-new How much in total are you paying for this vehicle with initial payment and payments plan?? "AS IS" -- the vehicle does not have a warranty and the seller is under no obligation for repairs" Quote from that source. It is still worth a phone call. They already said they may install them for you. Reputation is important and they may very well do it to help satisfy a customer and stand behind their cars and reputation. But they are under no obligation to do so. It's just whether they're nice guys and want to go above and beyond to serve their customers. (Plenty of businesses thrive from giving excellent customer service.) And even if they don't, it's not cause they're scumbags. You yourself said that you assumed (Mistake) that it was brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 I just read through the paper work i signed when i bought the car,and one said on it in big letters "AS IS NO WARRANTY",i know i should have been more careful when buying the car,but this is my second time buying a car for myself and i am 26,so i am young and dumb lol. I will try to talk to them,but i don't know if they will be willing to do anything. And politely, respectfully, ignorance is no excuse. Cars are big investments and we depend on them for a lot. Bearings are not a real big deal in the long run, but it could be a $3000 engine or transmission next time. Take this as a good lesson to learn for next time. Every goof and failure in life is an opportunity to grow and become smarter and more mature. "School of hard knocks" is not easy, but boy it teaches us quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 (edited) I have no problems with those terms Adventure Subaru; some sellers think a car has a significant problem that turns out to be minor after examination by a second or third mechanic--the same thing goes for doctors who dish out false negatives or false positives due to lab error or a lack of DD. We have all had problem vehicles over the years, hindsight is perfect as well as minor issues that others can be extremely unreasonable about in which case being an honest car seller can be a terrible hairshirt to wear. Edited November 25, 2015 by ThosL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Author Share Posted November 25, 2015 (edited) Here is a blurb from the state of Texas on consumer rights, I would give them a ring to explain the situation if you don't get help from the dealer: https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/cpd/buying-a-car-used-or-new How much in total are you paying for this vehicle with initial payment and payments plan?? Well i looked over the paper work. i am paying $220 a month for 30 months Umm when i was looking at the car on thier site it was priced as "$̶4̶9̶9̶5̶ $3995" with the $3995 in red saying special,i was thinking mabye it was cash only price, well according to the paper work, they listed the sales price as $5995. That is $700 over blue book for that car..... Now there site says "Information deemed reliable, but not guaranteed. Interested parties should confirm all data before relying on it to make a purchase decision. All prices and specifications are subject to change without notice. " Does that phrase Allow them to change the price that much? Because in all with down payment,and trade in,plus payments,fee's and interest the car will end up costing over $8000 I know i made a very stupid mistake, and should have looked at the paper work,but i was running late for work. On the bright side i LOVE the car despite the very few problems it has. Edited November 25, 2015 by trainergames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Financing is another trap people fall into. I saw people take out 10 year loans on cars already 10 years old. They'll be paying almost double what the car was worth by the time it's either crushed and made into Kias or is still just an older DD or beater at best. But, nothing that says you can only pay the minimum. Principle is the same for mortgages, credit card debt, student loans and car loans. The faster you can pay it down, the more you save. Study finite mathematics and you can write out compounding interest as well as payment plans. It's crazy how much over sticker price folks pay on long term mortgages. SO much better to go cash only and save money in the long run. On this car though, a bearing job will sideline you til you can fix it. But your looking a couple hundred, not thousand dollars. To be expected sometimes on a 10 year old car. And blue book is a good ballpark but not any sort of rule. In rust free areas like texas and california, things tend to go higher. Nicer cars command high prices. You said you were impressed with the motor on this one. Likely the dealership knew it too and knew it would drive the value up over other cars. Fix it. Drive it. love it. Learn a lesson from the surprise so you don't repeat it next time. And pay off the car ASAP. Tax returns are often a great way to pay down principle on debt and save you so much more over time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 25, 2015 Author Share Posted November 25, 2015 Financing is another trap people fall into. I saw people take out 10 year loans on cars already 10 years old. They'll be paying almost double what the car was worth by the time it's either crushed and made into Kias or is still just an older DD or beater at best. But, nothing that says you can only pay the minimum. Principle is the same for mortgages, credit card debt, student loans and car loans. The faster you can pay it down, the more you save. Study finite mathematics and you can write out compounding interest as well as payment plans. It's crazy how much over sticker price folks pay on long term mortgages. SO much better to go cash only and save money in the long run. On this car though, a bearing job will sideline you til you can fix it. But your looking a couple hundred, not thousand dollars. To be expected sometimes on a 10 year old car. And blue book is a good ballpark but not any sort of rule. In rust free areas like texas and california, things tend to go higher. Nicer cars command high prices. You said you were impressed with the motor on this one. Likely the dealership knew it too and knew it would drive the value up over other cars. Fix it. Drive it. love it. Learn a lesson from the surprise so you don't repeat it next time. And pay off the car ASAP. Tax returns are often a great way to pay down principle on debt and save you so much more over time. I will do my best to pay it off as soon as i can,i plan on taking very good care of this car,i would almost say i love this car more than my first car lol. I am guessing they are allowed to change the price by that much with out telling me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Well, I'm guessing your signature is on it somewhere. They can sell it for whatever price someone is willing to pay for it. Supply and demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 It looks very expensive for a vehicle over 10 years old with other possible problems, "as is" contract, etc.. No contract can make you a slave to a person or company, the used car dealer still has to abide by all state and federal laws. And under the UCC elements of fraud in contracts can make the business dealing in goods and services liable for double or triple damages. You should contact first the business to let them know you are unhappy with the problem that developed quickly and see if the state agency offers any guidance on the situation. Plus you will have to examine your own finances to see if you can afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 It looks very expensive for a vehicle over 10 years old with other possible problems, "as is" contract, etc.. No contract can make you a slave to a person or company, the used car dealer still has to abide by all state and federal laws. And under the UCC elements of fraud in contracts can make the business dealing in goods and services liable for double or triple damages. You should contact first the business to let them know you are unhappy with the problem that developed quickly and see if the state agency offers any guidance on the situation. Plus you will have to examine your own finances to see if you can afford it. This would be 100% a waste of time. You're trying to stretch those laws to places they do not apply. None of us are entitled to maintenance free 10 year old cars. AS-IS means what it means and does not mean what it doesn't mean. Contracts signed when buying cars from dealers are legal documents. You don't sign for an as-is sale and change the rules as soon as your car needs maintenance. The phrase "buyer beware" exists for a very good reason. Consumers need to be responsible with their money or deal with the consequences of irresponsibility. It's not up to businesses to coddle us and double and triple check with us that we're making an AS-IS purchase. Or to make AS-IS contracts actually mean that they will fix whatever upsets us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 if they're really bad they'll start swerving the car and take out your ABS - if your ABS lights aren't on then there isn't that much play. you're not mentioning any of that - so I wouldn't be scared to drive it 100 or so miles, not a big deal. you'll have those warning signs when they start going really wonky. they can easily go thousands of miles - but there's so much variance there - environment, use, temps, style, driving conditions...i wouldn't call mileage accurate at all. *** If they are that bad I would recommend replacing the hub as well - if they're that bad the hub is probably damaged and will damage the new bearings in short order. Get a used complete hub assembly ( that's how yards typically sell them anyway) and install it or new hub and bearings. www.car-part.com for used stuff - find a place that has both sides for $25 each and have them shipped to you. i'd avoid the northeast due to rust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 A quick check can make loose ball joints look like loose wheel bearings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThosL Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 This would be 100% a waste of time. You're trying to stretch those laws to places they do not apply. None of us are entitled to maintenance free 10 year old cars. AS-IS means what it means and does not mean what it doesn't mean. Contracts signed when buying cars from dealers are legal documents. You don't sign for an as-is sale and change the rules as soon as your car needs maintenance. The phrase "buyer beware" exists for a very good reason. Consumers need to be responsible with their money or deal with the consequences of irresponsibility. It's not up to businesses to coddle us and double and triple check with us that we're making an AS-IS purchase. Or to make AS-IS contracts actually mean that they will fix whatever upsets us. I disagree; but since the owner seems to want to keep the vehicle he may be loath to fight for his rights where time becomes of the essence. To sell a used vehicle for $1000 over the book value "as is" seems very fishy, and it sounds like an extortion agreement. It is not coddling or pandering to consumers to suggest they should exercise and explore their rights, he would probably have a better chance in the Constitution state than the Lonestar state where Ted Cruz was AG. Deals are valid when all the lawful rules of commerce are honored, not when buyers are under duress or when there are elements of misrepresentation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainergames Posted November 26, 2015 Author Share Posted November 26, 2015 I will contact the dealership after thanksgiving and talk to them about fixing the bearings,but if refuse i will contact the finance company and talk to them about it. I'm not sure what to do if they won't help either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdventureSubaru Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 (edited) I disagree; but since the owner seems to want to keep the vehicle he may be loath to fight for his rights where time becomes of the essence. To sell a used vehicle for $1000 over the book value "as is" seems very fishy, and it sounds like an extortion agreement. It is not coddling or pandering to consumers to suggest they should exercise and explore their rights, he would probably have a better chance in the Constitution state than the Lonestar state where Ted Cruz was AG. Deals are valid when all the lawful rules of commerce are honored, not when buyers are under duress or when there are elements of misrepresentation. What rights are you referring to? Your own source for texas laws states that AS IS means as is. And what law requires dealers to price their vehicles based on blue book generalizations over what a specific car is or is not? I sold my wifes 2006 LL Bean for $2500 over what KBB quoted the value at. Both because I had done a lot of engine work, it was a rare style and exceptional car, and I'm in bay area california where all prices are over inflated. I also am currently selling a 96 outback for $800 less than blue book says it's worth because the main shaft bearing is allowing play in the trans and it will need some work to correct it to make it a long term runner. KBB is a nice resource for a ballpark estimate. It is not anything that can be kept as a standard. Especially in the legal sense. Buyer has already explained HE was in the rush, and HE assumed the noise was the brakes. No misrepresentation given. No duress. Edited November 26, 2015 by AdventureSubaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now