Looking at a '98 OB ... What should I watch out for?

[BB's93LegacyL]

I'm considering a '98 OB at a dealer asking $5K.

109K miles, 2 owners. I have scheduled a test drive.

It was purchased new in Washington State where it was driven 42K miles in 6 years, then moved to SE Wis.

There is a car-fax report that shows routine service at mileage intervals, or just "vehicle serviced". Plugs replaced by a Sub dealer at 106K.

Went to auction at 93k, bought and sold by another dealer.

 

No reports of anything unusual in the CarFax summary.

 

My cursory view on the lot when I drove there on my way home from traveling on Christmas day revealed a car that appeared to be in nice shape, with no rust perforation, and looking underneath with a flashlight showed fairly little corrosion.

 

I will try to find out if there is any record of changing the timing belt when I look at the car during dealer hours.

Also, wondering what to look for as a sign of any head gasket problems when I have the chance to look under the hood. Is there a place on the engine where signs of an oil leak are considered routine and normal for this engine? VIN shows it is a "BG".

 

Thanks for any suggestions on what to look for.

 

 

[RED DEVIL]

Look at both oil and tranny fluid levels. Is it 5mt or 4eat? Look at all cv boots for rips or tears. Look at rear dif for leaks, inner cv shaft seal on front diff for wet look. When checking for timing belt also water pump and thermostat.

[BB's93LegacyL]

It has the 4 speed auto. Thanks for the ideas. I will look at those things.

[jlcbikes]

Head Gasket.  I don't knoe enough about how to check it, but that and the trans are  the first fail points, having had 4 Subarus.

[Rooster2]

Head Gasket.  I don't knoe enough about how to check it, but that and the trans are  the first fail points, having had 4 Subarus.

I have a 98 Outback, been a good car. Head gasket trouble is the weak point on this model. It presents itself as engine over heating, not oil mixed with coolant. Doubt that the dealer will have any vehicle history to tell you that the head gaskets have been replaced.

 

Unaware that there is much trouble with the auto tranny.

[mikaleda]

The biggest thing is head gaskets, IIRC they typicaly go out between 130-150k. Other than that you should check the usuals.

[djmark7]

i think you can look at the 'seam' between the heads and the block, if you can see a bit of a gasket sticking out it probably was changed, i think i read that somewhere i maybe wrong tho

[Rooster2]

i think you can look at the 'seam' between the heads and the block, if you can see a bit of a gasket sticking out it probably was changed, i think i read that somewhere i maybe wrong tho

I read something about that too, but never have seen the evidence. Seem to remember it being pointed out that the corners are where to look for the head gasket sticking out a bit.

[BB's93LegacyL]

Thanks for all of your suggestions. Does anyone know the chances of head gasket problems in this engine? In other words, is it one out of three engines that has head gasket failures, one in ten, one in 100, etc. I know any used car purchase is a gamble when you don't know how the car was driven/serviced.

 

What years' engines are known for head gasket problems. Maybe I shouldn't consider those years. 

What are the symptoms of head gasket failure in this engine? Is it coolant in oil, oil in coolant, overheating? The dealer has changed the oil and filter since acquiring the car a month ago. I will look at the oil and the coolant.

If the head gasket(s) has/have been replaced, does that end the problem for the life of the car?

 

Anyone know why these engines had head gasket failures to begin with? What was the engineering mistake?

 

Years ago, a friend owned a late 70s Subaru FE. When she took it to a reputable import car mechanic who is still in business, he said Subarus are great cars if you don't mind replacing every part at least once. That comment shaped my opinion of Subaru until I inherited my '93 Legacy FWD wagon from my late father's estate in 2006. Since then I have become a Subaru believer, and with only 157K on that car, I'm left wondering if I am really adding much of a "have to get to work on time no matter what" reliability factor by looking at a car that could need expensive head gasket replacement? I will be keeping the '93 anyway. The only thing that will cause me to let go of that car is a car/deer collision, or rust ruining the car beyond repair. I'm just trying to acquire a back-up car so I never have to worry about getting to work on time.

I imagine you can all understand why I want to remain a loyal Subaru owner.

[Rooster2]

The known head gasket problem that you are considering buying affects all Legacy models during the model runs of 1996-99. It always presents itself as an engine over heating problem, as the head gasket fails, resulting in exhaust gas entering the cooling system. Initially the problem is an on and off problem, that only gets worse. It does not result in oil mixing with coolant or vice versa.

 

It is pretty much a given that all 2.5 engines of those model years will suffer a head gasket problem eventually. Sometimes it strikes with less then 100K miles, or could strike later. In my case, my 98 head gaskets broke about 165 miles. The head gaskets on my 99 broke at about 190K miles. Once repaired with better designed head gaskets from Subaru, it is pretty safe that the repair will last for another 100K miles.

 

Otherwise, Subarus are rock solid reliable, and will run for a long time. My 99 model has 231K miles on the odometer, and the motor still runs strong, with no squeaks or rattles from the body. I expect to drive more then 300K miles with this car. I am confident I could drive a 2,000 mile round trip, and not have any motoring problems.

[BB's93LegacyL]

Update - I drove the car yesterday. The salesman was aware that the head gaskets have failed on this car as evidenced by overheating, and oil getting into the coolant. I looked at the dipstick and the oil looked clean. They acknowledged doing an oil change. I was able to bring the car into their shop to look it over, and while there, a mechanic familiar with Subarus explained what was wrong with the car and showed me the oily residue in the coolant overflow reservoir. After the engine was warmed up and shut off, there were bubbles coming from the overflow hose. The engine did not overheat while I drove the car up to operating temperature.

At the time of trade-in, the previous owner told the dealer that the timing belt had been replaced, but there is no record, nor any way of knowing if pulleys were changed as part of that job.

Car is listed by dealer for $5K. I was given a price of $3,492. as-is. The dealer quoted me a price of $2400. to do the head gaskets repair. I told the dealer I would get an estimate from my own mechanic and get back to the dealer on Saturday to let them know if I am interested in the car. My mechanic quoted $1,958. for the repair. The flat rate manual says this is a 10-hour job. I think the dealer made a mistake in their parts quote, because they listed both PT1 and PT2 head gasket sets instead of one set or the other. Their price for the two sets totalled $882. Looking at Rock, it looks like the sets by Felpro run between $130 and $140 depending on which set is called for by engine serial number.

 

I am curious about the type of damage that can occur from driving the car in this condition?  Even if severe overheating can be avoided short-term, what about the oil circulating through the cooling system?

Based on the service record in the CarFax showing the cooling system checked at about 99k and the plugs replaced at 107 K, there is no record of when the head gasket failure symptoms started.

I have decided against this car, clean as it is otherwise, because the price is too high, and I think this car would be better in the hands of a do-it-yourselfer who would either do their own repairs, or swap engines.

Thanks to all of you for letting me know what to watch for.

 

Moderators - now that I know the subject of this thread is turning toward head gasket issues, is there a way for me to to add new keywords to an existing thread?

Edited January 2, 2016 by BB's93LegacyL

[subaru forever]

hg and cluster.my cluster went out and still can not get new one working.so out $$$$ for car.my junk it