Dead Forester

[Corpy]

I’ve got an ’05 Forester X with the EJ253 SOHC, non-turbo
engine. It’s got about 140k miles on it now and is an auto. I’ve had on-again,
off-again problems with misfires for the last 20k miles. These may or may not
be relevant to the problem I have now.

Starting about 20k miles ago, I had intermittent

stumbling/rough running and would occasionally get the blinking cruise control
light problem. It was worse in wet weather and, sure enough, I popped the hood
at night and saw arcing from a plug wire to the intake. Once or twice I would
get the CEL and checking the OBD codes got P0304 – misfire on #4. I replaced
the wires and, because I had a new one on hand, the coil pack. That solved that
problem. I’d had no ignition problems since then, until now.

About four weeks ago I was on the freeway to work and the

Forester got a case of the shakes. It literally felt like I was on a rough
patch of road. I got a CEL and pulled to side of the road. When I plugged in my
Scangauge, the OBD code I got was P0000. No idea what that’s supposed to mean.
The engine felt like at least one cylinder wasn’t firing at all. When I got out
and opened the hood, the engine was vibrating wildly. I killed the engine,
tried starting. It would start but kept running roughly. After about 10 minutes
of fiddling with the plug boots, to make sure they hadn’t come loose, I tried
her again and though she cranked for about 5 seconds without effect the engine
sputtered to life and then ran great – no hesitation, no vibration. It was like
nothing had happened at all.

This happened two more times, unpredictably, over the last

weeks. Finally, I was driving home yesterday and it happened again. This time,
though, she didn’t self correct and I haven’t been able to get the engine to
start again. Here’s what I’ve done:

-  Replaced Crank position sensor

-  Replaced Cam position sensor

-  Replaced all spark plugs

-  Tried a new coil; no change

 

I had a shop change the timing belt, tensioners and water
pump at about 115k. My first thought when this began was that the timing belt
had jumped a few teeth, but I can’t imagine a timing belt could “jump back” and
correct itself, so I discarded that theory.

Another possibly relevant symptom is engine ping. This
Forester had always had a bit of ping since I bought it (115k) but it got much
worse over the last couple of months. I normally run 87 octane regular. When I
ran 93 octane premium, the knock went away. I was thinking a bad knock sensor
might be part of the problem, but I don’t think it would stop the engine from
running at all if it failed, right?

 

Any ideas? Bad ECU’s my next thought. I was also thinking it
may just be a wiring harness problem to the crank or cam position sensors, but
I’m intimidated by the thought of cutting up my wiring harness to try and find
a bad wire. Plus, all the connection seem to be in great shape. Could it be a
stuck exhaust/intake valve?

 

[mikec03]

I have an 02 and a couple of older subarus.  I can't say that the problems that I've had are identical to your history but similar.

 

1.  Oil on the ignition wires even if subsequently wiped off.  Common problem for your engine.

2.  Fuel pump failure.  When turning on ignition, don't crank, listen for 1 sec of pump running.

3.  MAF failure.  Did they switch back to the MAF in 05?  The MAF failure is intermittent and doesn't always set a code. 

 

Although, it would seem odd to your symptoms,  I suggest that you to pull for the timing belt covers and check timing just to rule it out.

[mikaleda]

Change you spark plug wires with good quality wires ngk or beldin lifetime.

Edited April 25, 2016 by mikaleda

[Corpy]

I'm getting good spark at the plugs. When I pulled the old plugs yesterday, they looked perfect. No pitting, no corrosion - good color. I doubt it's the wires. But can't hurt; I'll try to swap those this evening and see what difference it might make.

Edited April 25, 2016 by Corpy

[mikaleda]

I'm getting good spark at the plugs. When I pulled the old plugs yesterday, they looked perfect. No pitting, no corrosion - good color. I doubt it's the wires. But can't hurt; I'll try to swap those this evening and see what difference it might make.

These cars are sensitive to wires so if your not using really good wires they could still be the problem.

[1 Lucky Texan]

seems unlikely the system could pull enough timing to cause as severe a problem as you have - but, changing the knock sensor is cheap and easy - may relate to the prev. problem of pinging.

 

scan again for codes - might be a more-useful 'pending' code.

 

try a squirt of starting fluid or brake cleaner to see if it fires.

 

'dropped' valve guide might cause a severe but intermittent problem - they can shift back and forth...vacuum test might spot that.

Edited April 25, 2016 by 1 Lucky Texan

[Corpy]

Texan,

 

I did a shot of ether and it didn't change. I had already ordered a knock sensor from Rock Auto before it crapped the bed this weekend. It should get here this afternoon.

Reading up on the dropped valve guides  and it sounds (unfortunately) like a prime candidate. I've had a bit of oil consumption since I bought the car (about a quart every 3k). The previous owner was a near-mentally handicapped woman who I wouldn't be surprised went 10k between oil changes. How would I do a test to confirm the valve guide issue? Any way I could snake an inspection camera into the head to take a look?

[mikaleda]

 

Reading up on the dropped valve guides and it sounds (unfortunately) like a prime candidate. I've had a bit of oil consumption since I bought the car (about a quart every 3k). The previous owner was a near-mentally handicapped woman who I wouldn't be surprised went 10k between oil changes. How would I do a test to confirm the valve guide issue? Any way I could snake an inspection camera into the head to take a look?

If they are bad enough to cause missfires and the problems your having a compression test should tell you

[idosubaru]

read the check engine light codes with another scanner.  i've seen 05+ stuff not register on one scanner but register just fine on another. 

 

if you don't have another one to try, stop by one of the auto parts stores and have them read it with their scanner - it's free at most chains. 

[1 Lucky Texan]

i'd check timing - probably OK.

 

if no fire with ether, could be a no spark issue - especially if the car turns over with what 'seems' like normal compression (this "Rrrr,Rrrr,Rrrr,Rrrr" repeated. and NOT either ; "rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr" fast, nor, "Rrrr,Rrrr,reeer,Rrrr" with one fast like a dead/low comp. cylinder

 

 

so, basically severely messed-up timing or , no spark.

 

I suppose an intermittent, now bad, Crank Position Sensor is possible.....

Edited April 25, 2016 by 1 Lucky Texan

[ccrinc]

You said you've had pinging problems for a long time.  According to my information, you should have been able to run regular unleaded with no problems.  Since you couldn't, that's pointing toward air/fuel mixture in some way.  Knock sensor, MAF/MAP, etc.

 

If it's as bad as you say, I'm going out on (yet another) limb here and thinking you have a cracked ring landing on a piston.

 

As for testing, compression is always a good one, but a leak down test will better tell you WHERE the problem is coming from, unless you have obviously bad compression in one or more cylinders.  I don't know why, but 2005 Subarus just had some really oddball issues.

 

There is another thing that comes to mind: make sure all your grounding straps are secure.  See your owners manual or a repair manual: there are several. 

 

Emily

[Corpy]

Waiting on a compression tester from my local parts store. Should have it today. Praying it's not the valves.

[ferret]

Instead of retyping in this forum, here's an answer I posted over on the Forester Board back in 2010: http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f88/low-idle-stuttering-erratic-jerking-various-rpms-76450/index3.html#post887065

Edited April 27, 2016 by ferret

[logic23]

You said you've had pinging problems for a long time.  According to my information, you should have been able to run regular unleaded with no problems.  Since you couldn't, that's pointing toward air/fuel mixture in some way.  Knock sensor, MAF/MAP, etc.

 

If it's as bad as you say, I'm going out on (yet another) limb here and thinking you have a cracked ring landing on a piston.

 

As for testing, compression is always a good one, but a leak down test will better tell you WHERE the problem is coming from, unless you have obviously bad compression in one or more cylinders.  I don't know why, but 2005 Subarus just had some really oddball issues.

 

There is another thing that comes to mind: make sure all your grounding straps are secure.  See your owners manual or a repair manual: there are several. 

 

Emily

The reason is that everything subaru made after 04 has all kinds of issues related to the cheap , low quality parts( chinese).  All kinds of stuff is failing on my customers 05 and up soobs that we never had to mess with in earlier soobs.  05 is the begining of the steady decline in "reliable" subarus

[ccrinc]

First, NDC outsourced their bearings to China (OEM to Subaru)...we quit buying them.  Then ACL did, except for their race bearings, which are unobtainium.  We refused to use King bearings years ago, but their quality has improved exponentially, especially on their race bearings, so that's what we use now. 

 

Still, 2005 had some really quirky issues over even later years.  Years of change always do that.

Emily