BratWarrior Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 (edited) Alright! I'm starting a thread on the resurection of my 1985 Subaru BRAT GL. A little backstory... I purchased this thing in 2012(?) from an old dude on Craigslist. I wasn't looking for a BRAT, but just stumbled upon it while looking to get a car. I always loved BRAT's but sort of forgot about them over the years. When I saw it, I HAD to have it. So off I went to Welches, OR to pick it up. One issue... I never drove a stick! Ha! So I jumped into the fire and had to learn on the drive home. On the drive the BRAT started losing power and surging and dying. I pulled over and looked under the car to see the catalytic converter glowing BRIGHT red. Uh oh. I called the previous owner and he kindly had it towed to a shop and had his mechanic check it out. He figured the cat was deffective/clogged and installed a new one. I just barely got the BRAT home. Same problem. So what did I do? Joined the USMB! -The day I got it home after a much needed wash- Since I feared the new cat was melted, I took a rod and punched out all of the comb. Still couldn't get it to run right. Rebuilt the Hitachi carb, cleaned and tuned as much as I could. No change. I was at my wits end. I thought I'd been had. Then I decided to reach out to GeneralDisorder (Rick at Superior Subie and Import (before he had the shop)). He generously let me tow the car to his house to see what was up. Without much effort he figured it out! Are you biting your fingernails yet??? It was the ignition control module in the disty! It wasn't screwed down! Halleluja! From there we went over many other things and he imparted a wealth of knowledge. I am eterrnally grateful! So without going into the entire history of this BRAT, here is the short: Ditched all emissions junk, replaced ill-fitting header with a stock one, did the Weber swap, new 185/75/13 tires, new fluids, wires, water pump, DEEP cleaning, yadayadayada. It ran GREAT for a couple years. Out of town trips, Seattle hills, off-road camping, snow, etc. A really creat Bi-Drive Recreational All-Terrain Transporter. So what happened? It developed a few serious oil leaks that went unnoticed. This was my only car and I didn't have the time or space to address every issue it had. I heard some ticking and thought it was noisey lifters. Blew a headgasket, replaced it. ATF flush. New oil. Tick got worse. After a few hundered miles, KNOCK KNOCK! The damn thing siezed. And I was moving that week. Kill me. SO I towed the dead BRAT to my new apartment (with a garage!) and there it sat. For a year and a half. Life got in the way of wrenching, but now it's time to give this beast a new life! I will be updating this picture heavy thread regularly thoughout the build. I hope it helps people and I hope you help me! -Here is how it sits now. Sad, sad BRAT.- Edited June 23, 2016 by BratWarrior 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 (edited) There is a ea81 on craigslist if you need a new hydraulic lifter block. http://portland.craigslist.org/clk/pts/5649276882.html Edited June 24, 2016 by turbosubarubrat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 24, 2016 Author Share Posted June 24, 2016 Thanks for the tip! I have a good solid lifter block with real nice cylinder walls that I was going to rebuild. I have read that the hydro block has a better cam because of the larger base circle. I do plan on getting a Delta torque grind. Is the hydro really that much of an improvement? There is a ea81 on craigslist if you need a new hydraulic lifter block. http://portland.craigslist.org/clk/pts/5649276882.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 I forget what the horsepower difference is but it's something like 10hp. The hydro heads also have bigger valves. If you wanted to you could use hydro heads with the solid lifters. Keep a eye out for a ea82 carb'd intake they bolt right to the ea81 and have better air flow for the weber. I'm pretty sure i've seen this brat around Sandy before you bought it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 24, 2016 Author Share Posted June 24, 2016 I forget what the horsepower difference is but it's something like 10hp. The hydro heads also have bigger valves. If you wanted to you could use hydro heads with the solid lifters. Keep a eye out for a ea82 carb'd intake they bolt right to the ea81 and have better air flow for the weber. I'm pretty sure i've seen this brat around Sandy before you bought it. From what I understand, there is no HP difference between the hydro and solid motors. The HP difference is with the small valve and large valve heads. The HP difference is only 1HP. What I am concerned about is the lifter noise. From what I've read, the hydro motor is quieter when stock, but with shaved heads and a cam grind, it can be quite loud. I wonder if the solid lifter motor has the same issue since the valves are adjustable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 ^^^ if not even worse Explaining to people why your custom hi-performance Subaru engine sounds like rocks in a blender = priceless 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 From what I understand, there is no HP difference between the hydro and solid motors. The HP difference is with the small valve and large valve heads. The HP difference is only 1HP. What I am concerned about is the lifter noise. From what I've read, the hydro motor is quieter when stock, but with shaved heads and a cam grind, it can be quite loud. I wonder if the solid lifter motor has the same issue since the valves are adjustable. Straight from GD http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/13863-gen-1-ea81-hp-difference/ about the hp difference between the two. You can adjust the valve clearance on the hydro's as long as you know how to do it. It's covered in the 84 fsm that covers ea81's and ea81t's. I did it on a 83 turbo wagon that i resealed after the previous owner left the engine in the back of the car. For the higher horsepower ea81 builds i've seen people have stuck with the solid lifters. If you want more power out of the ea81 stick some ea82 spfi pistons in it, ea82 intake, hydro heads, and some porting. If your looking for parts for it Matt at ssi (works work rick) is your go to guy. He can get you anything you need for a ea81. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 25, 2016 Author Share Posted June 25, 2016 ^^^ if not even worse Explaining to people why your custom hi-performance Subaru engine sounds like rocks in a blender = priceless Hahaha! In your experience, are the solid or hydro motors louder after a "performance" build? I don't want that loud sewing machine tick as this will be a daily driver. Straight from GD http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/13863-gen-1-ea81-hp-difference/ about the hp difference between the two. You can adjust the valve clearance on the hydro's as long as you know how to do it. It's covered in the 84 fsm that covers ea81's and ea81t's. I did it on a 83 turbo wagon that i resealed after the previous owner left the engine in the back of the car. For the higher horsepower ea81 builds i've seen people have stuck with the solid lifters. If you want more power out of the ea81 stick some ea82 spfi pistons in it, ea82 intake, hydro heads, and some porting. If your looking for parts for it Matt at ssi (works work rick) is your go to guy. He can get you anything you need for a ea81. Interesting. As far as the jump in HP is concerned though, here is a post from 2007 that states what I was saying. The HP gains come from the introduction of bigger valves. Those were introduced in 1983. So the hydro and solid motors do produce the same HP as long as they have the larger valves. From GD "All 83+ engines were large-valve. Solid or Hydro - doesn't matter." from this thread- http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/79317-ea81-big-or-small-valve-head/?hl=%2Bhydro+%2Bsolid+%2Blifter&do=findComment&comment=660522 So what I am trying to determine now is, are there any real benefits of a hydro motor other than not having to adjust the valves every 15k miles? What I am thinking is use a solid lifter motor with large valve heads and a hydro cam, since they are a better candidate for a cam grind. My plan is to use the Ea82 pistons, deck the heads .020, Delta torque cam, and possibly port/polish the intake. Not too concerned with the Ea82 intake since the gains are minimal. Thanks for the tip on Matt. I will hit him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouKoff Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 Keep in mind changes in valve train geometry with the shaved heads and cam grind. I think you mentioned it earlier too but delta likes to use the hyrdo cam because of the bigger base circle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Interesting. As far as the jump in HP is concerned though, here is a post from 2007 that states what I was saying. The HP gains come from the introduction of bigger valves. Those were introduced in 1983. So the hydro and solid motors do produce the same HP as long as they have the larger valves. From GD "All 83+ engines were large-valve. Solid or Hydro - doesn't matter." from this thread- http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/79317-ea81-big-or-small-valve-head/?hl=%2Bhydro+%2Bsolid+%2Blifter&do=findComment&comment=660522 So what I am trying to determine now is, are there any real benefits of a hydro motor other than not having to adjust the valves every 15k miles? What I am thinking is use a solid lifter motor with large valve heads and a hydro cam, since they are a better candidate for a cam grind. Had a 84 brat with the original engine that had the smaller valves only 98k on odometer but the brat was beat. I have 3 sets of solid lifter heads just sitting. Some gains for a hydro block are they have extra castings so you can mount a ea82 or ea81t power steering pump on them. I think solids are the way to go on that kind of build too since you can fine tune them until there quiet. I went to all 3 of the pick n pulls some what close yesterday there is a 84 wagon at the sherwood location. It's tan with tan interior. It remember the passenger side fender being in good condition can't remember about the drivers. It had a uncut factory radio and tape deck console in good shape i just didn't need another extra or i would of grabbed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 26, 2016 Author Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) What JY had the uncut tan stereo console?!?! Edit: you said Sherwood. I'm on my way! Thanks for the tip!!! Edited June 26, 2016 by BratWarrior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 27, 2016 Author Share Posted June 27, 2016 Had a 84 brat with the original engine that had the smaller valves only 98k on odometer but the brat was beat. I have 3 sets of solid lifter heads just sitting. Some gains for a hydro block are they have extra castings so you can mount a ea82 or ea81t power steering pump on them. I think solids are the way to go on that kind of build too since you can fine tune them until there quiet. I went to all 3 of the pick n pulls some what close yesterday there is a 84 wagon at the sherwood location. It's tan with tan interior. It remember the passenger side fender being in good condition can't remember about the drivers. It had a uncut factory radio and tape deck console in good shape i just didn't need another extra or i would of grabbed it. I think I am going to go for a solid lifter build with a hydro cam. Hopefully picking up that motor you posted about above this week. Thanks again for the Sherwood tip! I went today and got that console! Super stoked! Been looking for that since I first got the BRAT! The fender in the above photos has since been replaced with a non-rotted one. Someone real lucky gor the front mudflaps from that car. Hopefully it was you! Ok, on to the pics... -Uncut tan stereo console with Clarion deck! In amazing shape! Just missing the knobs...- -I also got super lucky and found a NOS Grant steering wheel adapter online! Once again, stoked.- Here is how the BRAT currently sits. I got the motor and crossmember out. One of the crossmember bolts was frozen, so I cut it out with a dremmel. Worked great! But why did I remove the perfectly good crossmember? Because I am putting in power steering! I really love to feel of Gen 2 power steering and parallel parking on hills without it has gotten really old. Haha. I have the complete setup as well as a bunch of other great parts coming out of my donor car, this 1984 Hatch. As much as I hate to rip this thing apart, I like the BRAT so much more, and the motor in the hatch has a rod knock anyway. I will be parting it out when I am through with it and will post everything on here! -The organ donor- 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 Dibs on the hatch rear seat if its in okay shape. I didn't pull anything off that wagon since i already have way to much stuff but gave it a glance over to see if any of the hard to find parts where still there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted June 27, 2016 Author Share Posted June 27, 2016 You got it. Other than some staining, it's in great shape. No rips anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 1, 2016 Author Share Posted July 1, 2016 Here's an update for ya'. Got the transmission, driveshaft, linkage, and interior consoles out. Transmission was surprisingly easy. Mounts were disintigrated. It was pretty scary! Did not get pics of that, but it's really simple. Also... Pulled the dash!!! My most feared job (actually that would be putting the dash IN). Whyyyyy did I pull the dash? Well, because I have a mint uncracked dash to swap in! Also, this is a great opportunity to get to the heater core without any cutting. I can also re-do all of the foam seals and get everything back there super clean. Wasn't too difficult actually. You just have to take your time and do some snooping with a flashlight. Here are some pics. -Linkage and consoles out, steeering wheel off and steering column dropped.- - Getting the three 10mm screws on the top of the dash. This is a little annoying, but doable. Space is very limited if you leave the windshield on (which I did). You have to pry off the 4 plastic fittings on the vents, then use a 1/4" drive socket wrench with a 10mm socket. You have to do tiny turns. Once you get the screw raised, you gotta switch to a 10mm wrench, because the socket is too tall. So for the record NO NEED TO REMOVE THE WINDSHIELD! - -Dash is out! There are three 12mm nuts under the dash (and the three 10mm on top) that arre holding the dash on. You have to unconnect all of the wiring harness terminals and unscrew 3 or 4 brackets that hold the climate control cables. This thread helped me: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/144337-heater-core/?hl=%2Bdash+%2Bremoval&do=findComment&comment=1212690 - What lies beneath your dash (driver's side)! - - What lies beneath your dash (passenger side) - - HEATER - Excited to see what this thing looks like inside. - - Dash out. I pan on swapping the cluster over to the new dash. Debating on doing the led bulb mod. I will also freshen up any wonky solder joints. - - Anyone ever use Lectra Motive? Was going to use it to clean up wiring connections and whatnot. - Ok, that's it for now. Next I will pull the seats and carpet and start cleaning! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 11, 2016 Author Share Posted July 11, 2016 Update! Got the heater and blower motor out. Haven't figured out how to get the AC box out thith the hoses to the engine bay attached. Thoughts? Took the heater apart. Definitely ordering a new core from somewhere. Can't seem to find it on RockAuto. Anyone got a link? This job was a real pain in the a**. So many hidden screws that are in real tight spots. Can't wait to do it again with my hatch! Haha. - Heater is out! Any tips on how I should prep this area before I re-install everything? I will wipe everything down, but should I add some insulation? Sound deadening? - - Heater box taken apart. I am going to replace all of the foam. It's basically dust at this point.- - Old heater core. It worked fine, but I don't want to have to do this again, so it's got to go. - - So what condition is the blower motor module supposed to be in? Mine feels brittle. RockAuto is out of stock. How concerned should I be about this? Part link: http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/subaru?a=Referer+www.ultimatesubaru.org+URL+%2Fen%2Fcatalog%2Fsubaru%2C1983%2Cbrat%2C1.8l%2Bh4%2C1267691%2Cengine%2Ccylinder%2Bhead%2Bgasket%2B%2F%2Bhead%2Bgasket%2Bset%2C5412 Probably going to tear out the rest of the interior next. Please chime in! More updates this week. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Napa was the one of the few places i found that could actually get it and didn't charge hundreds for it. When i got mine 8 months back it was $72. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 12, 2016 Author Share Posted July 12, 2016 Hmmmm. I wonder how important it is to use the exact same one. I found one for 1996-2002 Toyota 4Runners that looks very close to the Subie one. The Toyota resistor also uses 4 speed stages and the connector is the same. Check it out: http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/251874122695 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted July 12, 2016 Share Posted July 12, 2016 Napa was the one of the few places i found that could actually get it and didn't charge hundreds for it. When i got mine 8 months back it was $72. Forgot to mention i was talking about the heater core here. I wouldn't be to concerned about the blower resistors as long as they all work. It's easy enough to change in the car if it starts to go out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 13, 2016 Author Share Posted July 13, 2016 Ah. Gotcha. Yeah the resistor does seem easy to replace actually. I will check my other heater core when I pull it from the hatch. Right now I'm thinking I'll give it a vinegar soak, straighten the blades and replace the foam and roll with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 14, 2016 Author Share Posted July 14, 2016 Update. So most of the interior is out. I removed the interior AC box. The AC pipes in the engine bay were a PAIN to remove. The rubber plug gaskets were also super difficult. Took a while, and a lot of PB Blaster and swearing, but it's out. Now for some bad news... After pulling up the carpet and rocker pannel trim pieces, I discovered some pretty bad rust in the floor boards under the drivers side seat. UGH. - Interior out. Lots of junk in there. - - Gross. I'm surprised the seat didn't fall through the floor. - - More. I can see the ground. - - And more. The rocker panels themselves are in great shape, but right after the tac welds on the inside, is where things start to go south. - I have never dealt with this before, so any input is very appreciated. What I am planning to do is cut the floor under the seats of the donor vehicle and have someone weld them in. One plus is that none of the rust is in any easily visible areas. So when the new piece is welded in, it doesn't need to be real pretty. Also, what is the thick stuff on top of the sheet metal? Mine is very brittle and cracks easily. Is it sound deadener? What would go in it's place when I repair everything? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted July 14, 2016 Share Posted July 14, 2016 The sound deadening traps moisture from leaky window seals and rusts the pan out on these. On my hatch i slowly took out the sound deadening, primed it, and used herculiner on the whole thing. If you wanted to add sound deadening i would get the foil sticky type to put in after bed lining the pan. When cutting the rust out go at least a inch past where the rust is at; i would go more to be safe. If you don't there is still rust in the metals pores and will show up again a couple months later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 14, 2016 Author Share Posted July 14, 2016 The sound deadening traps moisture from leaky window seals and rusts the pan out on these. On my hatch i slowly took out the sound deadening, primed it, and used herculiner on the whole thing. If you wanted to add sound deadening i would get the foil sticky type to put in after bed lining the pan. When cutting the rust out go at least a inch past where the rust is at; i would go more to be safe. If you don't there is still rust in the metals pores and will show up again a couple months later. Ah! Well then it's gotta go! Any tips on how to remove that crap? A flat head screwdriver is a bit slow... Should I use a sawzall to cut the floor pans out? Thanks for the tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbosubarubrat Posted July 14, 2016 Share Posted July 14, 2016 I just used a deadblow, scrapper, and a pry bar that had a good angle to hit chips off with. Then shop vac'd the chips up as i went along. Just be glad it's a brat since the rest of the 2nd gens have 3 times as much. There are videos of people using dry ice with good results but it doesn't take too long to chip it out. To cut out the pan a sawzall would work fine and so would cut off disks with a grinder. With a zawzall you don't have to worry about etching glass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratWarrior Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 Rust removal has started! I took a Sawzall to the floor pan today as well as a couple other spots. It works great for the large, easy to reach areas, but I'll have to get a grinder for the tighter spots. - Subframe support all mangled up. Note the jack stand for orientation. - - I'm a little stumped on what to do here. This is the support behind the driver's seat. The steel is thicker than the other chinsy stuff. Note the fuel pump on the bottom for orientation. - 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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