entyceingvws Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Hi All. CEL issues...First post. New to Subarus, jumped in heavy over the last month...(2 EG33 motors. A 97 SVX and a Brighton donor for 96 outback) I have just finished a 96 Brighton 2.2/5spd swap (with Diff) into a 96 2.5/Auto swap. (My first Subaru swap) I had CEL codes, P1702 and P0403 but grounded PIN 50/81 and hooked up PIN 78 to Neutral Switch...(based on lots of research...) I have a scanner which is how I know the codes but now it is showing no codes but CEL is still on. I am using the 2.2/5spd and ECU from the Brighton donor. Not sure what to do. Thanks! Sorry about the pic, still figuring out this system Edited August 23, 2016 by entyceingvws Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 HI, You've likely got an EGR code, for one. The 2.2+5speed had NO EGR - most likely. But ALL '96-'99 EJ25D's should have it. Read THIS. The ECU won't overcome the lack of EGR, from what I've read. But the EGR code shouldn't affect perfomance. The car should run on the 2.5 ECU, too, as they weren't trans-specific back then. * *Tangent: I found out the SEDAN w/the 2.2 from '96 has the charcoal canister in the back like the '97+ Outbacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 23, 2016 Author Share Posted August 23, 2016 Thanks. So even though I have it all set up with the 2.2 ECU it sounds Like it doesnt matter? Ive seen that link even as of yesterday but didnt think is applied...Based on that link and what you are saying is that I need to get a EGR intake manifold? So his system can even work? Is there a way to "Trick" or PIN the wires or computer to get rid of it? If the ECU's are not trans specific...then it would seem as though it wouldnt matter which ECU? I did hook up the 2.5 ECU after all error codes where gone and it really struggled to start and stay running. I also have here in Utah emissions testing so there has to be a solution or my project (so far) is a waste. There has got to be an inexpensive(?) way to do this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 There has got to be an inexpensive(?) way to do this RE: EGR: If you find it let us know....that's why I created my post. If you search on here you'll find many EGR-related posts. None that I've read solve the issue. :-( 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 23, 2016 Author Share Posted August 23, 2016 By the way the CEL light is an all the time while flashing somewhat fast and constant. So it seems as though I need to buy a 2.2 EGR intake manifold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 Yes, 2.2 EGR-equipped IM from a '95-'98 2.2 - Impreza or Legacy. The flashing CEL is.....weird. I think that's for 'active' codes, maybe? Are the GREEN diagnostic connectors under the dash connected? They should NOT be for normal use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 23, 2016 Author Share Posted August 23, 2016 I will check. I did a brief check but didnt see anything green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 Drop that plastic piece - just below the steering wheel- like 3 screws and 30 seconds, and you'll see a bunch of wires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 23, 2016 Author Share Posted August 23, 2016 I dropped the plastic piece and on the right side of the wheel are 2 blue plugs. A light blue and a darker blue and they were plugged in together. I unplugged them. Is that a possible CEL issue? My light is still on. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 24, 2016 Share Posted August 24, 2016 Green - like these. Every Subaru from '90-200? has 'em, AFAIK. I don't know about the blue plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 24, 2016 Author Share Posted August 24, 2016 What a spaz I am. I could have sworn that you said blue. Ill check tomorrow. I did drive the Outback for the first time and it felt great! Once I get done with this project for my wife. i will start on the SVX 4.44 trans swap! Really looking forward to restoring that one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 24, 2016 Author Share Posted August 24, 2016 CEL IS ALL GONE!!!!!!!!!! I finally found the green plugs and they where connected. So I undid them and all CELS gone. I guess the question could be...Why would they be connected, if they are not to be for "normal use"? Thanks again!!!!! Time for Safety and Emission inspection! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 24, 2016 Author Share Posted August 24, 2016 Well.... my enthusiasm is short lived. I went to do my safety and emissions and the light came on. After unplugging the green plugs the CEL light went off and went back on after driving it a bit. It failed with error code P0505 "Idle Control System". I got back home and used my scanner to clear it and the CEL went off...thats were I am at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Throttle cable too tight? Someone could have messed with the throttle stop screw on the throttle body. Does your scanner show live data? TPS should sit at 0% at closed throttle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 25, 2016 Author Share Posted August 25, 2016 Throttle seems fine, same settings as before with the 2.5, feels good and what it should be. Not sure about the scanner, I can look. Its not mine, I borrowed it till I get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 I guess the question could be...Why would they be connected, if they are not to be for "normal use"? I'd guess the previous owner (PO) was diagnosing the issues before they sold it and never bothered to UNplug 'em. BTW, you should be able to swap the Throttle Body from 2.5>>2.2 so the ECU sees the same....er, you swapped ECU's so scratch that...probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 26, 2016 Author Share Posted August 26, 2016 Thanks "Wtdash" for getting back to me, I thought I lost you. As mentioned above I took it to get inspected and it failed due to P0505 "Idle control system". I got home and Hooked up scanner and saw the error code, cleared it all again and it it seems to be gone...No codes showing...Is that only because I havent driven it again? Since the green plugs are gone and P0505 was the only code and no EGR issues, does it look like I may be OK, without doing the EGR modification, you mention ? It appears that the connected green plugs was the cause of the flashing CEL. Thanks again. I know it can get old with a bunch of Noob questions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 (edited) being devil's advocate, I'm not as optimistic. The EGR is one of those 'cyclical' codes,.....meaning it may take 2-3 drive cycles (drive for x amount of time, turn off car, and repeat) before it 'pops' again as the ECU decides 'yep, there's still a problem'. I had that happen w/a emission code (bad purge valve, IIRC) on previous Subaru. After replacing the part the dealer suggested, I drove the car for almost an hour, thought it was good to go, shut it off, started it back up and the code returned. :-( So, I'd go drive it for 10 mins, turn it off, and repeat 3-4 times to see what all comes back. Don't clear any codes 'til you finish, to ensure they ALL show up. I'd suggest Googling the p0505 as that's a new one to me. But the IAC can be cleaned and adjusted. There are two Philips screws that hold down the top portion and allow it to turn left/right. I've also replaced that top portion as it just pulls straight up after removing the screws (don't lose 'em!)...there's a magnet inside so it'll offer some resistance when removed. Here's a LINK to some of the FSM's for reference. Look up using those green plugs for diagnostics to verify your other sensors are working...that's how I found my bad purge valve mentioned above. Edited August 26, 2016 by wtdash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 26, 2016 Author Share Posted August 26, 2016 Thanks a lot! I can buy an intake manifold for around 20.00 at a local picknpull yard so I guess its not that big a deal if i have to do your EGR solution. I guess I just need to make sure I find a 2.2 with EGR stuff? 96-98? 95-98? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 See if the idle code comes back. Also try cleaning the IAC valve first. Sometimes they get coked up with carbon and crud and it makes a difference to spray them out with throttle body cleaner or Seafoam. The ECU uses the neutral switch to determine when to set idle speed when you take your foot off the throttle. If the trans is in gear it won't try to set idle. I it's in Nuetral it wil try to set idle. If the neutral switch says the trans is in Nuetral, but it's really in gear, the ECU tries to set idle and can't, and will set a code, though I think its usually a p0500 code that sets when that happens. It also sets idle speed based on throttle position, which is why I asked about that. If the throttle position reads anything except 0% with your foot off the pedal, the ECU can't set idle speed. Another possibility would be a vacuum leak causing The idle speed can be slightly high, and the idle control valve will adjust as far as it can, but can't control the idle speed, so it sets a code. You can often see if this is the case by looking at the engine speed (RPM) readout on the scanner. Proper Idle speed should be on the emissions label under the hood, though in your case you need to look at the label on the car the engine and ECU came from. For manual trans it should be around 700-750 rpm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 (edited) Double Edited August 26, 2016 by Fairtax4me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 (edited) Thanks a lot! I can buy an intake manifold for around 20.00 at a local picknpull yard so I guess its not that big a deal if i have to do your EGR solution. I guess I just need to make sure I find a 2.2 with EGR stuff? 96-98? 95-98? Let me repeat, repeating, by repeating, to repeat myself. Yes, '95-'98. And Do NOT confuse the Impreza's 1.8 EGR on the '92-'95 (?) it's not the same system - OBD1. I know the 1.8 was used 'til '97ish, so it had to be OBD2 in '96, but I don't know if that's the same as the 2.2's. But a 2.2 Impreza IM w/EGR will work, too. Remember '95-'98 2.2 WITH Automatic were all EGR-equipped. Edited August 26, 2016 by wtdash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 27, 2016 Author Share Posted August 27, 2016 Thanks. Looking into that and with about 10 more miles on it...(just got a temporary sticker so I can actually drive it legally) so far no Codes have been thrown but another problem has surfaced...(not sure if I should make a new post...? Probably) Car sat for a day or so and battery was dead...(new battery) checked alternator and was dead, put in another alternator last night and while running, disconnected negative battery terminal and car continued to run but this morning after starting and pulling negative terminal, it died. So 2 alternators dead now. Could there be an issue with ECU's or ? Let me know if I should make a new post. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted August 28, 2016 Share Posted August 28, 2016 A new post may get you more 'look's...and I don't have any ideas. :-( Maybe Fairtax will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entyceingvws Posted August 31, 2016 Author Share Posted August 31, 2016 Hey WTDASH. I just bought another 2.2, EGR intake manifold with everything on it...Throttle body with hoses coming from EGR...Etc. My manual throttle body does not have the extra fitting s for the hoses from EGR. Do I need to use the EGR Throttle body? I even got all the Automatic wire harness. Does it matter? Should I swap manual harness over? Or do the EGR hoses even matter? Just want to do it right the first time... Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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