Torque Bind 2004 Subaru Impreza WRX Automatic 4EAT GDA 48T EJ205

[WRXAuto]

I have put in a bit of research on torque bind for the year 2004 Subaru Impreza WRX Automatic (4 speed sportshift).  When at very low speeds on full lock turns for eg. parking or turning the car around, I notice what I understand to be torque bind.  I took the car to my local transmission specialist who drove the car in circles and mentioned the car probably needs new plates (I assumed rear LSD plates), I have looked into this more online and now think that the rear LSD is not a serviceable part and must be replaced should it become problematic.  (I have read that Subaru LSD's sometimes need replacement after about 60,000 miles.  My car has done about 75,000 miles (it is right hand drive, and in kilometres).

 

The transmission specialist advised differential oil change, and this was done for both the front and rear differentials.  The car worked better, but there was still torque bind, noticeable at low speeds.  When turning a corner, I think that I can feel the rear LSD working, this makes me believe that the problem might be the plates in the transfer clutch (transfer case).  Other threads on various forums have suggested that a transfer clutch plate set change or duty c solenoid replacement might fix the problem.

 

Would a faulty rear LSD cause torque bind, or is it likely that the plates in the transfer case need changing.  If the plates were to be changed, is it advisable to change bearings in the transfer case, eg. roller/thrust/ball bearings? and the AWD clutch drum.

 

I have read people's advice on other threads about changing the differential oil, which I have, and it would seem some of them then fix the transfer case components (clutch pack/solenoid), should the problem not go away with the differential oil change.  Is it likely that this will work?  It would seem that very few change the differential oil, and then change the rear LSD before the transfer case repair, is this likely down to the cost of changing the LSD compared to the cost of changing some of the parts in the transfer case.  I would not like to change the parts in the transfer case, and then have to change the rear LSD as well, if the transfer case parts replacement did not fix the problem.

 

I think that the 2004 GDA Subaru Impreza WRX Automatic's LSD is a R160 Suretrack (4.44?) but am not certain.

 

My car is driveable as it is, and I didn't buy it to do lots of sharp turns at low speed or to reverse around corners.  I like long drives at the speed limit.  But I would prefer everything to work 100 per cent correctly.  I will take the car back to the transmission specialist, but I want to gain as much information as possible about this before committing to what could be quite a financial outlay.

[wtdash]

Hi and welcome from the UK,

Not many experts on the European Subarus on this forum, so you may want to go Down Under an check with your mates there.

 

USA didn't get the 'sport shift' (dangit!) option until maybe 2008+ as I looked in to adding it to my '02 WRX, which I could not.

 

On the NON-turbo models in the US we had the FWD fuse (to disable the AWD via the Duty C) either in the fuse box or by the passenger strut tower. My '02 didn't have it being turbo'd.

 

If yours DOES it may help confirm, but based on what I read above it could be either the transfer clutches or rear diff so the FWD fuse wouldn't help in either case.

 

My suggestion is to the do what is commonly recommended on this site: Drain the ATF from the pan (about 4 qts/liters), Refilll, drive through all gears and repeat 2 more times. So, Drain>Refill>Drive * 3. That may also help w/the TB.

 

As you likely know only 1/2 the fluid is in the pan; the other 1/2 is in the Torque Converter (TC), so doing it 3 times gets the majority out of the TC, too.

 

It might be useful to lookup the Trans and rear diff info on opposedforces.com - it has an EDM/European Domestic Market section that probably covers yours. Try this: opposedforces.com/parts/impreza/en_g11/type_25/

 

It shows Right-Hand drive option, too.

 

Under +Train>Differential, it lists 4.44 as your Final drive ratio...depending on the build date. That should've made the AT-equipped WRX even better off the line (mine was S-L-O-W - even w/the TC and valve body upgrades I installed).

 

 

Good luck/Cheers,

TD

Edited August 25, 2016 by wtdash

[1 Lucky Texan]

this is unlikely to be the rear diff, and if your rear diff is LSD, it is a sealed unit with its own separate fluid so, the gear oil in there will not affect the viscous unit.

 

there have been people with the odd driveshaft u-joint or carrier bearing or even front axle problem that can somewhat mimic torque bind. And of course, running non-matching tires will induce TB. tires must be the same brand/model/size and near each other in w ear.

Edited August 26, 2016 by 1 Lucky Texan

[idosubaru]

Easy:

1.  replace transmission fluid (not the differential fluid - front and rear diff fluid doesn't even come into contact with the rear extension/4WD components so that was pretty much pointless to replace which is why it didn't help). 

need to do a few drain and refills or a flush

 

2.  if that doesn't alleviate the issue then replace the clutch plates and file down the grooves on the drum

 

3.  if hte AT light is blinknig 16 times at start up then you probably have a Duty C solenoid failing, replace that.   some people replace it preventatively while doing the clutches so it's all new - they rarely fail but if you're paying all that labor it might be nice to just be done with it. 

 

No - the 4EAT is robust and there's no components in the transmission that really ever need replacing - it's just the clutch plates, Duty C, and front diffs (which are rarely repaired anyway) that sometimes have issues. 

The rear differential has nothign to do with this - Subaru rear differential failure is basically unheard of - 90% of the "failed rear differential or 'i replaced my rear differential'" comments you hear are misdiagnosis and incorrect.  heck i'd guess it's even higher than 90. 

[WRXAuto]

grossgary, 1 Lucky Texan, wtdash.  Thank you for your responses. 

What you have recommended will be my course of action, transmission fluid changes, new clutch pack?, new duty c solenoid?

I will update this thread when it's fixed.

SB

[WRXAuto]

Update on this post.

 

I have now got this problem fixed.  I basically did what I mentioned that I was going to do.

As far as changing the transmission oil first to see if it fixes the problem, I agree with that, if that fixes it, why go further?

The situation with my car is that the car was making noises from the rear end, that I needed fixed, I guess that one of the problems being at the rear end would suggest that the transmission oil is probably not the only problem.

 

I researched more and more about transfer clutches and valve assemblies (and solenoids) over the winter months.  I was at work thinking about what I was going to do, and when I was going to do it, all through the winter months.

 

I figured out roughly what parts I was going to need, through threads like:

 

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/72866-4eat-duty-c-solenoid-clutch-pack-replacement/

 

and:

 

http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f89/rear-differential-install-127805/

 

I then went about matching the parts to the numbers that would suit my car.

I think that a lot of Subaru parts have the same name, with different numbers for different models.

 

I decided that the transfer clutch plate set definitely needed replacing, and got what I thought was the correct valve assembly for my vehicle.  (plus transmission case gasket, oil seal, drive plate 3, etc.  (and an automatic transmission filter).

 

I chose to replace the rear differential bearings (left and right), and rear differential pinion bearings (front, rear), I also got the relevant side seals, differential gasket, oil seal, o rings, etc.

 

I also got rear wheel bearings, and rear differential support bushings.  I tried to ensure that I had the correct parts to seriously improve my vehicle.

(I imported the car myself from Japan (online) and there was no way I was going to all that trouble for the car to have the problems listed on this website, and to not get them fixed).

 

I had trouble getting parts in the U.K. from Subaru, and had to import a lot of the parts myself from overseas, Japan, U.S.A., Germany.

Subaru Impreza WRX Automatic's were never officially sold in the U.K. and most if not all of them are personal (or grey imports).  There are many places selling Subaru aftermarket parts, but not many for Automatics in the U.K.

The foreign exchange rates this winter weren't great (all time lows?), and I made real efforts to get what I needed without overdoing it.

 

I basically, got one of the best transmission specialists for classic and sports cars in the U.K. to fit what I had.

 

They removed the rear differential, and rebuilt it with the new bearings. 

They removed the transfer case and rebuilt it with the new plate set transfer clutch.

They changed the transmission oil and automatic transmission filter.

I got what I wanted, I worked for it, got the parts, had the specialist fit them, and the car drives exactly how I had hoped.

 

I had the car, I had the motivation, I got it done, and I am pleased.  It took months of research, and hours and hours of working out and planning.

I don't think that the problem was actually the valve assembly transfer clutch, but with the rest of the work I am pleased.

 

I went to a Japanese Car Festival, and one thing you realise is that these guys spent a lot of money on their cars, so if there is work you want done on your car, it's going to cost you.  Another motivation is starting a thread on a forum like this, stating you will update the thread when it is fixed, which is also a motivation.

I'm happy.