bushbasher Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 I'm trying to make the hybrid rear axles with slip cups at both ends as some here have done. My question is how the frick do I get the stock outer joints off. The haynes manual is useless, but they came together somehow, so theres a way to get them apart. Plus it's been done before. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 It's a CV on the outside right? If so then you must use a press. Beleive me it's like impossible without one. I beat on one for like 10 minutes, and finally got the joint apart but still could not remove the inner race from the axle shaft.... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted June 17, 2004 Author Share Posted June 17, 2004 it wobbles around on the splines. Is it beaten past some lump on the splines to get it on? edit: are ea81 axles different than ea82 axles on the outer cv? Does this double slip idea of putting ea82 cups on each end of an ea81 axle mean that I need to have an ea81 axle to put on a slip-cup outer cv? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 I *thought* that EA82 rear axles had DOJ's on each end like an EA81 rear axle - but since I don't have an EA82 in front of me I can't verify that. If it's a CV on the outer end then I *think* the inner race is held on by a spring clip that slips into a groove on the inside of the race. DOJ's come apart easy, but CV's are basically impossible unless you have a press handy. As for using an EA81 axle, you can't because they are too short for an EA82..... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 Yep the EA82 is a CV on the rear outer and it does have a spring clip, some pop right off with a good blow of the brass hammer, others wont budge with a vice and a 10lb sledge, and a hyd press is the only way. I’ve rebooted several axels and if doesn’t come easy I just disassemble the inner DOJ and replace the boot from that side. I’m wondering why you would need the extra extension of two DOJs? Is it because you are changing the suspension layout? Or is it to get more wheel travel? How will the DOJs handle the steeper angle, that’s normally the limiting factor with CV/DOJ joints. Anybody know the max safe operating angle for the subie joints? Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 All the EA81's have DOJ's on both ends. Works fine. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcbrat Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 apparently the ea82 inner (DOJ) has a bit more travel to it (longer). good if you have tweaked the suspension on your ea81, and need a bit more travel to help preserve the axles I have too much down travel right now, so I'll be getting different shocks, and most likely some limiting straps as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted June 17, 2004 Author Share Posted June 17, 2004 Im doing the double doj mod because I need an extra 1/8" of slip to stop the axles from pulling apart at full droop with my suspension lift. I will do away with the suspension lift later and go 6" body lift, but I want this mod for future long-travel coilover experimenting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 Update: I have made double slip joint axles using ea82 dojs on both sides of an ea82 axle. On the outer, I had to weld a washer to the axle inboard of the joint to act as a stop so that the axle wont push through the star. This means I will have to take the inner doj off to replace the outer boot because the washer prevents the boot from sliding on from the outer side. as for welding on the axle, we'll see how that works out Another way to do it would be to stick the outer doj star on a lathe and cut a groove inside the splines to use the snap ring that the cv originally used. Right now, I have about 3.5" of suspension lift (I designed it to be 2", but the fact that the arm is on an angle causes a component of the weight of the vehicle to go through the arm instead of the coilover. This makes the coilover not compress enough. At least thats my theory) Anyways, with 3.5" suspension lift at full droop I have an extra 1" of slip available and about another 1" of downtravel. Also, it sounds as If I was lucky. It only took a few good taps with a ball-peen to get the cvs off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 keep us informed. if you get more travel out of the axles. i know mikew was doing some swapping from the rear axles between ea81 and ea82 to get more travel. if you find a good way and that they are holding up. take pictures of the process and write up a how to. i'll put it on my website. that's if it's ok with you and you aren't trying to sell them. if they hold up let me know. Jared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 I was just discussing this thread with Calebz and Turbone the other day. It appears that not all EA82's had CV's on the outer joint. A lot of EA82's had DOJ's on both ends already. Just like an EA81. So if you just find some of those axles that already have DOJ's on both ends you should be golden..... they are out there - I just saw some the other day, and Calebz said he has 3 sets of the double DOJ's in his garage. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 I was just discussing this thread with Calebz and Turbone the other day. It appears that not all EA82's had CV's on the outer joint. A lot of EA82's had DOJ's on both ends already. Just like an EA81. So if you just find some of those axles that already have DOJ's on both ends you should be golden..... they are out there - I just saw some the other day, and Calebz said he has 3 sets of the double DOJ's in his garage. GD Wonder if someone oculd track down a part number or year/make/model those fancy double DOJ axles came on EA82s and could just get some that way Or maybe they were swapped on from another platform? I wouldnt mind a set! Keep up the custom hacking there brushbasher; this is some neat stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 Im not into trying to make money here, or keeping any knowledge to myself. I want to see the betterment of subarus everywhere, and I get a wealth of information for free on this board thanks to guys like you. They are on the back of my car now and fit and allow tons of flex but I'll have to test the durability of the mod before I call it a success. If they work well I'll definitely give you a write up and a few pics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Im not into trying to make money here, or keeping any knowledge to myself. I want to see the betterment of subarus everywhere, and I get a wealth of information for free on this board thanks to guys like you. They are on the back of my car now and fit and allow tons of flex but I'll have to test the durability of the mod before I call it a success. If they work well I'll definitely give you a write up and a few pics! Ya ya ya... just another excuse to go OFFROADING! I see right through you.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 I was just discussing this thread with Calebz and Turbone the other day. It appears that not all EA82's had CV's on the outer joint. A lot of EA82's had DOJ's on both ends already. Just like an EA81. So if you just find some of those axles that already have DOJ's on both ends you should be golden..... they are out there - I just saw some the other day, and Calebz said he has 3 sets of the double DOJ's in his garage. GD It would be interesting to know if these double dojs made of the long travel ea82 types instead of the slightly shorter ea81 type dojs. I havent seen double dojs under any of the ea82s at the yards. So I'm out of luck there for now. edited Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 It would be interesting to know if these double dojs made of the long travel ea82 types instead of the slightly shorter ea81 type dojs. I havent seen double dojs under any of the ea82s at the yards. So I'm out of luck there for now. edited i believe that's what mike did with his. cause the EA82's are supposed to have more flex or something like that. not a 100% sure how. but i talked to him a long while ago about it. i just can't remember if i have the email of how to do what he did. and last time i talked to him about it he hadn't wheeled them too much. but i'm going a differant route all together.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 The DOJ cup itself is deeper - by about 1/4". If you want even deeper than that, the DOJ cups from a legacy are deeper yet again by about 1/4". The front DOJ cups on an EA81 and the rear DOJ's from an EA82 appear very much the same from my inspection, and all the them - EA81, EA82 and EJ have the same joint components and the same splines on the axle shafts. In fact, if you want 25 spline EA81 front axles for a turbo trans from an EA82, you can use the turbo legacy cups on the EA81 axles..... all of this stuff swaps around without much trouble. The only real concern is the thickness of the axle shaft for high-angle running..... but you could have the EA81 axles lathed down a bit to compensate for that easily enough. I just put an axle together for my EA81 wagon, and I used an EA82 DOJ, and the joint parts came from a legacy axle. I sit in the Subaru isle at the Junk Yard dismantleing axles for parts - can you tell? GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 hey GD, same with you if you have good luck with getting more travel out of them with that. please take pics and make a write up. and i'll get it up on my site. i'll have to use actual html code cause i'm away from my dreamweaver program. Semper Fi! Jared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 No problem man - I went to take a comparison shot today of the cups and my camera didn't have the flash card in it . I'll get some soon tho and post them in the album here.... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Ok - I took pictures of the EA82 here in the junk yard with DOJ's on both ends of the rear axles. It's an 86 wagon - build date of 01/86..... They are rusted on, or I would have pulled one for a better picture. Heck - if I could have gotten them off, I would have taken the cups from them..... I had to pull 4 of the other type of axles to get enough cups to make a set of EA81 "stretchy" axles. If anyone *really* wants them I could get them out.... or find another set. probably have to pound the spindle out of the wheel bearing, but they will come out. I've seen others like this too, and apparently from talking to Calebz about this, they aren't that uncommon. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 5, 2004 Author Share Posted July 5, 2004 That's weird, the underbody is corrugated? Mine isn't Oh wait thats cause the gas tank is gone. That is an interesting find, the outer looks exactly like my double doj axles, but in the pic, the inside one looks as if it is shorter than the outside one? Probably not though. Thanks for the pic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Yeah - the inner is the same as the outer - just a bad pic angle. Having to crawl under the car on gravel with a camera and greasy hands isn't easy. Here's a comparison shot of the two DOJ's - the left one is a stock rear EA81 DOJ cup, and the right one is a rear EA82 DOJ cup.... the EA82 one makes the EA81 axles stretch a lot farther.... Depending on how much extra stretch you need, you could use just one of the EA82 style cups, or if you need a lot of stretch, you could use them on both ends. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 6, 2004 Author Share Posted July 6, 2004 Do you think the stock double doj axles are found only in adjustable suspension ea82s? Just a thought. I find with double doj ea82 axles, the joints reach max angle before they reach max sliptravel. At max angle I can grab the axle and slide it back and forth about 3/4" This is good cause it keeps the joints deeper into the cups, instead of out at the edge were the cup is weakest. I think ea82 double dojs are the furthest we can go for travel using oem subaru parts, unless legacy stuff allows more angle. Theres no legacy stuff yet in the yards I frequent From my measurements, in an ea82 suspension setup with no suspension lift and equal up/down travel (which is pretty much what we have stock), a 12" travel shock/coilover would be possible. That would be quite an improvement over the stock 6" or around 9-10" with stock axles. If an ea81 axle is shorter, the max would probably be just slightly less. For more strength, maybe a custom axle could be made to use double front dojs in the back, as they are significantly larger than the rears. I'd want to figure out how to deal with the weak stubs before I go that far with the axles though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 If you want more up/down travel, then an axle built using front DOJ cups from an EA81 or EA82 would certainly do that. The joint is physically larger in diameter, and will allow for greater angles, but unfortunately doesn't fit the splines on the rear axles shaft. If you can find joint parts to fit the cup and have the same spline's as the shaft (call up cvaxles.com perhaps?) you would have an awesome axle for pretty cheap. Being larger in diameter also means they can handle more stress...... I may end up having some stubs made from chromolly. Either that or use a modified Datsun Z axle with 510 stubs, or a datsun R180 diff..... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted July 6, 2004 Author Share Posted July 6, 2004 I may go the datsun route as well if the stubs break too much. I'll be running 30s and only 45:1 with the lada tcase and a stock ea82, so the stress shouldnt be as bad as say Jared's rig. Plus I'll be in ft4wd so hard launches wont put as much stress on the rear. Thats what I'm hoping anyways :-\ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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