Back to Subaru after 30-year hiatus. Need advice!

[riverguy]

I had several Subarus in throughout the '80s and loved them dearly.  They got me places in our deep snow that took out every other 4x4.  I'm moving back there in a few months and would love to get back into Subarus, but I hear so many stories about head-gasket failures, front differential failures, etc.

 

So my question is this: for a top budget of $10K (including sorting the car I buy), what should I be looking for that has the least issues?  I hear about some of these failures that have gone on for many model years.  I'd love an Outback, would settle for a Forester.  Oh yeah, no turbos and I need an automatic.

 

Also, most cars in my price range have at least 100K miles on them.  Is that pushing the shelf-life for most Subarus?

 

Any help would be appreciated!

Edited December 21, 2017 by riverguy

[1 Lucky Texan]

2010 Forester would be good.

[sparkyboy]

Get another 80s sube :-)

They are great with the ej22 swap. In fact there is a gl-10 with an automatic in Wyoming or something (not sure where you are located) but alas you don't want a turbo...

For way less than 10k you can get a nice mid 90s outback or a first gen forester.

Just get a 2.2, 2.0 or 1.8 and you won't have to worry about head gaskets. But if you find something good with a 2.5 just get it, they are still good engines. My 99 obw had the 2.5 and she never let me down. But certainly install new head gaskets for peace of mind.

Oh and 200,000 miles is just getting broken in for a Subaru.

You can have an earlier one, which is better because they are non interference, for around 4k for a really nice one. Imho subes started getting ugly after 99.

I have an 86 GL with an ej22 swap and she is fantastic, i would definitely take her over a newer Subaru!

Cheers man!

Edited December 21, 2017 by sparkyboy

[heartless]

currently own a 2002 Forester with 234K on it, and I do like it, but if I could, I would go back to the Legacy based wagons.. they just feel more "planted" to me.

the Forester is lighter, taller, and a shorter wheelbase - gets tossed around on windy days pretty good. I came out of a lifted 95 Legacy wagon for this one.

 

The other half has a 2006 LL Bean Outback with the 3.0 H6 - it is not without its own issues - mostly worn out suspension bushings and needs new rear struts, but still feels more planted than my Forester does.

 

100K on a Subaru is not that much, in the grand scheme of things. One thing to be aware of, however, is timing maintenance is due at that mileage... and not just slapping a belt on it either - but a full timing service, including all pulleys, water pump, etc.

[GeneralDisorder]

The man wants to spend 10k DOLLARS not 10k HOURS working on an engine swapped 80's pile that's worth $75 in scrap metal. He didn't post this in old gen. Sheesh.

 

GD

[sparkyboy]

Well he never really specified how new the car has to be, if I had 10k to spend on a car, I would personally spend around 4k on a very nice, low mileage 96 or 97 outback or early forester with a 2.2, they do still exist amd come up on CL from time to time. Spend 1k at a shop getting a new t belt and everything.

Then I can spend five or six k on something really cool.

[riverguy]

The man wants to spend 10k DOLLARS not 10k HOURS working on an engine swapped 80's pile that's worth $75 in scrap metal. He didn't post this in old gen. Sheesh.

 

GD

Actually, I'm an old-car nut and I would be in heaven if I could find an '84 GL 4X4 wagon, all restored like new.  I LOVED those cars and I always felt that the '84 was the last of the classic Subies.  I used to enjoy pulling these 4X4 macho pickups out of our local ditches with my Subarus.  Those things would climb trees!

 

But then, My Lovely Bride doesn't share my thing with old cars, and this is gonna be our "family" car, so it needs to not look "embarrassingly old."  I really like the 2008-9 era Outbacks, and maybe I'll just find one of those and do the head gaskets and timing service on it.

 

Is the 2.5 the engine with the chronic head-gasket problem?  Shame on Subaru for continuing to sell known defect!

[1 Lucky Texan]

a super clean gen3 H6 car would be awesome.

[sparkyboy]

See if you can get a car for your wife for around 6 or 7k.

You can certainly get an 05-09 with an h6 for that, and those have timing chains instead of a belt, but the 2.5s are still good. Why no turbo? My buddy has an 05 xt and she's a sweetheart!

Anyway save some money for yourself for something like this, but the second gen GLs are getting scarce!

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/165400-85-subaru-wagon-gl-leone-4wd-dual-range-5-speed-std-for-sale/?fromsearch=1

[idosubaru]

Get one without extant headgasket issues that way you know it hasn't been overheated/run low on coolant. 

 

1. FB engine

2. H6 engine

3. EJ25

 

I prefer for sale by owner so i can verify no blown headgaskets.  the most likely ones to end up on the dealer lots are trade ins from the first sign of ominous issues or repair quotes.  and some of them fail in such a way they're hard to diagnose and can go weeks or months between symptoms - making them prime candidates for trading in, ending up on lots for sale and you get hosed. 

 

the H6's have fewer headgasket issues and they happen at higher mileages. 

[Fairtax4me]

Subaru isn't the only brand with head gasket problems. But if you ask me they are the easiest to fix when they do go bad.

The 2.5s are perfectly fine engines, the major problems that many people associate with the 2.5 usually come from neglect and/or abuse. Neglecting to change fluids/ check levels will kill any engine no matter who made it.

 

For your price range you're probably looking for something between 2010-2014ish depending on mileage and options. A forester with the FB engine (timing chains instead of a belt) would fall right into that price range. Same with an early 4th gen Outback.

[idosubaru]

He’s right the EJ is fine and maybe even a better candidate in some ways. Just get one in good condition and well maintained.

 

The 2000-2009 EJ25s with original factory installed headgaskets are rather simple, they just start leaking externally and get worse over a long period of time. No big deal - no overheating, no oil and coolant mixing, no symptoms, so you can keep driving it with zero concern. You’ve literally got months to plan your repair so there’s no reliability risk and done right you won’t ever have to do it again.

 

In those terms the EJ is less “risky”. The EZ 6 cylinder engines have fewer issues but they are more likely to cause overheating and require immediate attention. The 00-09 EJs with original headgaskets don’t strand you or overheat, they just slowly leak externally.

 

So those are a great option in those terms particularly do someone like you who seems knowledgeable and mechanical enough to pay attention and make good decisions.

[sparkyboy]

I noticed that you put family quotations, that means you don't have kids huh? You guys been married long? I would guess not.

This is the first ad i found.

See if she likes something like this:

https://boulder.craigslist.org/cto/d/1998-subaru/6433478466.html

[sparkyboy]

https://boulder.craigslist.org/cto/d/subaru-outback-llbean-93k/6430148886.html

This one is cool if she wants something nicer than that.

Then you have some money if and when you find that 84 you would love to have. Or maybe buy someone a really nice Christmas present.

10k will easily get you two nice Subarus

[heartless]

Well he never really specified how new the car has to be, if I had 10k to spend on a car, I would personally spend around 4k on a very nice, low mileage 96 or 97 outback or early forester with a 2.2, they do still exist amd come up on CL from time to time. Spend 1k at a shop getting a new t belt and everything.

Then I can spend five or six k on something really cool.

 

the Forester never came with a 2.2 in the US..

[3Pin]

lots of people have put a 95 2.2 in a 98 forester.  perfect swap for a bad 2.5  That is what i think he meant.

 

2000-2005 outback have a great tank like feel.  interiors 2005 and newer a little more plastic and lighter on the fee in IMHO.  Like the h6 engine.  Lots of fun and more ponies in the mountains.  parts are more expensive for it though.  

 

I would find a newer nicer outback at 7-10K or a project 2000-2004 with a bad motor or trans and put in a new lower mileage engine and or trans, do everything it needs and go look for some snow drifts.  LOL.

[riverguy]

I've been finding quite a few 2000 - 2009 Outbacks in super condition with the head-gasket and timing services already done.  I'm thinking that any of these that are actually in well-maintained condition with service verification records would be a safe bet?  Most have 120 - 150K miles on them, though, so there's still drive-train issues just from all the miles.

 

Are there any particular drive train problems with these cars?  I had a 2001 for a while a few years ago and the front differential ate a bearing.  Two techs told me that this was a common problem with those years.  Any info on that?  Maybe just common when you don't change the oil on schedule?

[riverguy]

Get one without extant headgasket issues that way you know it hasn't been overheated/run low on coolant. 

 

1. FB engine

2. H6 engine

3. EJ25

 

I prefer for sale by owner so i can verify no blown headgaskets.  the most likely ones to end up on the dealer lots are trade ins from the first sign of ominous issues or repair quotes.  and some of them fail in such a way they're hard to diagnose and can go weeks or months between symptoms - making them prime candidates for trading in, ending up on lots for sale and you get hosed. 

 

the H6's have fewer headgasket issues and they happen at higher mileages. 

You listed the EJ25 and not the EJ20.  Any particular reason for that?  Is the EJ25 reputed to be more reliable?  I kinda thought the EJ20 was the bulletproof one.  Wrong on that?

[Bushwick]

If you are moving to a snow/salt state, consider buying it in CA as rust hopefully won't be an issue. If you can keep the rust at bay, the rest is easier to maintain.

[riverguy]

If you are moving to a snow/salt state, consider buying it in CA as rust hopefully won't be an issue. If you can keep the rust at bay, the rest is easier to maintain.

I'm in CA and moving to OR in April.  There's a great selection in OR, prices are lower to start with and there is no sales tax.  CA is 9.85%.  Registration is also cheaper in OR.  OR does not use salt on the roads, and if the car is from inland and not the coast, rust is less of an issue.  Cars from eastern OR are great because the whole eastern half of OR is high mountain desert.  No rust!  Also, every place is so far from every other place that accumulated miles are all easy highway.   I was a dealer in OR for years and did most of my buying there.

 

A relevant question:  Does anyone know if the emissions systems on CA cars are any different from cars delivered in the other states?  That could be another reason for buying a OR car!

[heartless]

CA emissions are stricter, from my understanding (more "junk" added)

 

As far as drive train goes - a lot is dependent on general maintenance. If the car has been taken care of, there should be few problems, altho there is always that one outlier

 

my 95 Legacy had the 4EAT and a bit over 200K miles when I got it - it got abused by a teenager and had 1st & reverse fail (we got it cheap) - swapped in a used tranny with around 150K on it and never had another problem - sold the car with 265K on it when I got the Forester.

 

My 2002 Forester also has the 4EAT - currently just about to roll over 235K, as far as I know, it still has its original tranny - shifts smooth as silk when warmed up (a little bit harsh in cold weather, but still smoother than some cars i have had over the years).

 

A cared for Subaru can easily see 300K or more, depending on where you live. Here in Wisconsin, they die from rust cancer, not drive train failure. In places that don't use salt, it should be easy to make one last. 120-150K is barely broken in with a Subaru.

[Fairtax4me]

You listed the EJ25 and not the EJ20. Any particular reason for that? Is the EJ25 reputed to be more reliable? I kinda thought the EJ20 was the bulletproof one. Wrong on that?

Far as I know the EJ20 was only available in the US in the Impreza WRX (turbo), and most of them get flogged pretty hard.

[riverguy]

Well folks, thanks for all the info!  It helped me sort things out.  My focus is now on an Outback, 2001-2 on up to maybe 2009.  Condition, service records and mileage are more important than year.  There seems to be no shortage of them here in CA or OR, and I'm leaning toward buying one in Oregon so I won't have to register it here in expensive CA for the few months we're still going to be here.  If I can find one from eastern OR, that would be ideal, since most of the accumulated miles there are highway, and nothing rusts there.

 

Merry Christmas to all!