Reman turbo losing shaft nut within first minutes of running

[idosubaru]

Update:

 

Subaru Genuine OE reman turbo installed.

 

Car running perfectly. No smoke. Quick, smooth spool. Pulls hard to redline with no issues from turbo.

 

Now, this is just after a few short miles of testing. Need to get tags on it to take it for a longer highway drive.

 

Don't buy cheap turbo parts. Just go OE from the start.

Great. What song did you crank when turning that key for the test? Haha.

 

What all did you do since the last failure? Looks like you’re certain it was the turbo itself?

[Gloyale]

Great. What song did you crank when turning that key for the test? Haha.

 

What all did you do since the last failure? Looks like you’re certain it was the turbo itself?

 

 

We did drop the pan, replace the pickup tube o-ring, and R+R'r the oil cooler. And we didn't find anything of consequence in the oil pan either.  About a table spoon of sludge, but no chunks, and nothing clogging the pickup screen.

 

 We also replaced the Banjo bolt/screen with a brand new one.  Although that was mostly just to satisfty Subaru for warranty.  The old one had no clog, and was perfectly clear and flowing.  

 

I also pulled the timing covers and verified timing CAM timing.  Pulled pass side AVCS solenoid and cleaned, but found no debris or clog.  Reinstalled with new O-ring.

[sparkyboy]

I am very interested as to what the shop thinks of this, they should have given you a nice refund or offer something for all the headaches

[GeneralDisorder]

Like I said - it's going to come down to cheap turbo parts. The shop should be made aware of the outcome of the repair. 

Edited March 14, 2018 by GeneralDisorder

[el_freddo]

Some awesome info in this thread!

 

I took interest as I've got a TD05-16G turbo to strip and rebuild on my Liberty RS project (Legacy SS). I'm only doing this as the engine had zero bearing left on no1 big end - piston was slapping the head, lots of shavings in the sump and on the pick up.

 

My thinking is that the turbo may have some metal in the bearings so thought it best to do a replacement job and learn a thing or two as I go.

 

Goyale, very interesting (although very frustrating) situation that seems to point at the replacement core. Glad you've finally got it sorted pending a decent run at speed/in general driving conditions.

 

GD, thanks for your input and knowledge on turbos through your experience, really awesome and something that money cannot buy.

 

Keep the good info flowing!

 

Cheers

 

Bennie

[Gloyale]

Just an update.

 

 

checked back in with the owners of the car.  It's still running like a top.  There is a little "slip" in the trans between the 1-2 shift sometimes still.  unrelated to the turbo i'm sure.

 

Ammco told her it needs a full trans rebuild for $2700!!!  One tiny bit of slip in the 1-2 shift......probably a seal at one of the solenoids.  I told her to run it and if it gets worse I can service it or replace with a good used.

 

Turbo shop returned our money, BUT NOT OUR CORE.........pissed about that.  they say we'll get it 'soon"

 

Anyhow, just an update to let all know that if yer "brand new" from somewhere trubo losses it's nut.....it's not always oil supply fault, sometimes it's rump roast hat service.

[idosubaru]

Thanks for the data here Gloyale. Too bad it was a pain but thanks for discussing the process candidly.

[jeryst]

I've been following this issue with a high degree of interest. I dont know anything about turbos, but the whole thing is very interesting. The facts are that two bargain turbos failed almost immediately, while an OE unit is working fine. On one side, you have an experienced builder saying that the bargain turbos are junk. The evidence points to that, and I have no reason at all to doubt his expert opinion. But, if the first shop is consistantly installing junk units that have a high failure rate, wouldnt he have a bad reputation by now? Surely if that were the case, either you would have heard about it before you went to him, or he would be out of bysiness by now. He returned your money, which indicates that he is somewhat of an honest person that could not continue to stay in business by doing this on a regular basis.

 

As usual, I suspect that the real answer lies somewhere in between. Perhaps some small extra thing you did before you installed the OE turbo was the key to the whole thing. I dont know. I'm just making an observation.

[idosubaru]

But, if the first shop is consistantly installing junk units that have a high failure rate, wouldnt he have a bad reputation by now?

Not at all, it happens all the time. You're attempting some good logical thinking, except it makes a huge universal assumption. That all shops are specializing in Subaru's. I don't know, but i highly doubt the supply shop specializes in Subarus. We haven't been told but more than likely Subaru is a blip on their radar screen.

 

A shop working on every year/make/model ever honda, cadillac, GM, truck, hyundai, diesel, kubota, commercial..they come up with more one-size-fits-all approaches to doing business because they have to and.may not even notice Subaru's. They may blow it off as a problem with the installer, driver, manufacturer, etc and miss the point. Happens *all the time*. Aftermarket axles and brakes are an obvious example.

 

Not one person that's been around 100's or thousands of subaru's over the decades would even blink an eye over two back to back "new" axle failures. An average shop seeing every possible vehicle simply won't see how it affects Subarus more often as it's homogenized with everything else they're doing.

 

A very specialized Subaru shop, like General Disorders, who is doing the exact thing over and over again and adjusting practices to suit experience and changes would have the more statistically relevant data specific to this exact application.

Edited April 6, 2018 by idosubaru

[Gloyale]

But, if the first shop is consistantly installing junk units that have a high failure rate, wouldnt he have a bad reputation by now? 

 

To be clear.  The other "shop" here is not a general automotive shop.  they do not work on cars.  They didn't install any of the turbos.

 

ALL they do is service the turbocharges themselves.  Nothing with tires goes into there shop.The shop has a stellar reputation.  

 

I think the issues lies in the fact that 98% of the turbos they service are large diesel turbos.  Workhorse stuff.  They do most of their own work for those units.

 

Very few little go fast bits for gassers.  And like in our case, when they do small turbos they farm out the major work......to bad results.

[GeneralDisorder]

The large diesel turbochargers are actually much easier to work on. The parts are larger, and the shaft speeds are slower - the larger the diameter of the turbine, the less RPM it takes before the blade tips cross the sound barrier and effectively stop moving air (compressor surge).

 

Tiny turbos have tiny parts, and tiny oil passages, and spin at ridiculously high speeds. 150,000 RPM on the smaller stuff. So balancing to a much higher precision is required - something the diesel turbo guys often don't have the equipment or expertise to perform. And typically these tiny units are not "rebuilt" but rather just replaced with a completely new rotating assembly. This moves the complex assembly and balancing process into a clean production environment with ISO standards.

 

Ultimately the shop bought a cheap junk Chinese CHRA. They need to contact their supplier and get reimbursed.

 

GD