have a 1992 Subaru wagon. 2.2l What can I do to sup it up without dropping either tranny or engine?

[NuB33]

I bought a 92 wagon. I’d like to supe it up and lift it. 

 

Need ideas on how to do it the cheapest or at least where to start on a tight budget

[GeneralDisorder]

There is nothing you can do to "sup" it up. Not on a budget anyway, and definitely not without swapping the engine. The most common method is to replace the engine block with a 2.5 from a later model Outback/GT (97 to 99). 

You can lift it using 97 to 99 Outback struts and springs. 

GD

 

[Numbchux]

Yea, you'll have to elaborate beyond "sup". More power? Basically no.

It is possible to add boost, but this quickly falls under the category of "if you have to ask". It's in-depth, relatively high-risk to your engine, and certainly not cheap to do correctly.

 

This is the classic example of the phrase, "Fast, Reliable, Cheap. Pick 2". You've got heaps of reliable and cheap in that 2.2. You can get some Fast, but it won't be cheap (to build or maintain).

[GeneralDisorder]

If his budget for performance is at least $1000 then he could likely do a used 2.5 bottom end if he does it himself. But I'm guessing that's outside of his budget if he's rocking a 92. Probably outside his skill set also..... again - "if you have to ask.... you probably won't like the answer" Numbchux is dead on with that one. I get these questions all day long and I burst bubbles constantly. Every kid that walks through my door says he wants 500 WHP. Now I just LOL at them. They don't even understand what they are asking for - much less what it will cost. 

GD

[NuB33]

That’s what I’ve been reading and just needed to confirm from other sources. Thanks for the info. 

Now that that’s out of the way, I’m definitely interested in putting a new engine it. Over read to go with a wrx. Others say to go with an STI. Matching trannies for both. 

Ideas, opionions, best practices?

[GeneralDisorder]

Turbo swap is GOING to be at least $10k. Also not really conducive to a lifted wheeling application. Just do a high compression dual-cam 2.5. Can get up around 200 HP. We have a custom engine we do that gives around 200 HP out of the 25D heads using a 257 bottom end. I have a customer with one in a lifted Forester that gets 28 MPG. 

GD

[NuB33]

Nice! Definitely going to be a project. So this turno swap, can it be done in stages?

[db*****]

To lift it you could use Forester struts if you use your tophats.

[db*****]

As far as supping it up, handling upgrades are probably your best bet. 

[GeneralDisorder]

39 minutes ago, NuB33 said:

Nice! Definitely going to be a project. So this turno swap, can it be done in stages?

No. It's an all-or-nothing swap. Buy a wrecked donor car. 02 to 05 WRX/STi. Don't go past 2005 WRX or 2004 STi or you enter the no-mans-land of immobilizer keys. 

GD

[Numbchux]

1 hour ago, NuB33 said:

That’s what I’ve been reading and just needed to confirm from other sources. Thanks for the info. 

Now that that’s out of the way, I’m definitely interested in putting a new engine it. Over read to go with a wrx. Others say to go with an STI. Matching trannies for both. 

Ideas, opionions, best practices?

 

If you're ready to open the can of worms that is engine swaps. The sky is pretty much the limit. Almost any Subaru engine (as long as it's about the same vintage or newer) can be done relatively easily. There are dozens of turbo options (The WRX has been in production around the world for 25 years, STi for about 20, Legacies had twin turbo models in RHD cars etc. etc.), depending on the details. There are 6-cylinder options (I'm partial to a '01-'04 3.0 H6).  NONE of these are cheap to swap or maintain.

And that's just Subaru engines, with some creativity and knowledge (and frequently money) anything is possible.

 

$10k is probably a good rule of thumb. I know of a couple guys who did it for less, but it took a HUGE amount of work researching what parts to use, and patience waiting for just the right deal on just the right part (one was a coworker when I worked at a Subaru dealership, you can bet the employee discount helped on that project even though it was based on a jdm engine).

Then you have to think about the transmission. The 5-speeds are not exactly robust, and the STi 6-speed is expensive ($5k is probably a good rule of thumb on that). So if you're planning to make much more power and/or drive it really hard, you'll probably want to think about that.

[db*****]

Isn't this a tight budget project? Frankenmotor would be easier than swapping a turbo motor. 

[idosubaru]

We went from budget to high dollar/skillset turbo swap - this is probably just friendly wishful thinking that won’t go anywhere right?  How about a V8, LS1 swap

Honestly you’re better off appreciating the car for what it is than making it something it isn’t or will never be  and using it as a reliable daily driver while you plan and save for your future goals  

It is possible to do a turbo build in stages if you’re wise and obedient. Most aren’t. Myxyphylx turboed and tracked an EJ22 reliably for a couple years then removed the turbo bits and engine was in great shape. But he didn’t keep increasing boost and monitored it well.  Most people blow it up. 

[el_freddo]

3 hours ago, idosubaru said:

  How about a V8, LS1 swap?

It wouldn’t be the first one. There was a Gen1 done near me but I can’t find it on the web. I found this build though:

https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2393987

And I found another article about a turbo’d build where the author fairly flogged boosted Subaru and their fanatic owners.  He clearly didn’t know the ins and outs of Subaru life...

Back to the OP - you can also achieve lift with a subframe drop - aka a body lift.

Cheers 

Bennie

[Numbchux]

7 hours ago, el_freddo said:

It wouldn’t be the first one.

Not even close. A very good friend of mine has a turbo 6.0l LS in his '98 Legacy, and in that project found probably a dozen well-documented examples (which means there's probably several times more of them done that aren't documented). 

[db*****]

Depends on what you're going for. Ls swaps kinda defeat the purpose of having a Subaru. Flat engine makes up for what it lacks in power with handling benefits that are better than a v type engine. 

[Numbchux]

4 hours ago, db***** said:

Depends on what you're going for. Ls swaps kinda defeat the purpose of having a Subaru. Flat engine makes up for what it lacks in power with handling benefits that are better than a v type engine. 

Absolutely a completely different animal. My point is just that anything is possible, and most of it's been done.

 

Interestingly, looking at my buddies car, since the drive to the front axles isn't an issue, the engine can be mounted much further back and down than I would have thought. And the advantage of a pushrod engine is there isn't much weight up in the heads, and he's using an aluminum LS. I bet the weight distribution front to back is considerably better than with the Subaru engine, and only a little higher COG.

Of course, it's not built to be a handling machine, it's mostly built to ruin tires....

[GeneralDisorder]

COG isn't a problem for any of the LS equipped GM sports cars - Corvette and F body both handle very well. Even my gen-1 small block equipped F body will easily out handle a Subaru. 35mm front sway bar FTW. The engine design isn't a problem if it's designed and positioned correctly. 

GD