still hunting the front end shake and lost as to where to go.

[sirtokesalot]

 ive almost replaced everything and dont know what im not seeing. front end has shaked at all speeds since i got it. starts off a slow wobble in the wheel gets faster as i go faster at highway speed is a vibration. ive had 3 sets of tires on the front using different wheels each time balanced each time removed corrosion from hubs and wheels new brakes rotors and calipers new inner and outer tie rods new lower ball joints new/used hubs because original bearings were bad new used axles from friends part car that were knows good when he stopped driving it. only thing i havent replaced in the front end is the shocks the a arm bushings and the steering rack. whats more likely to cause this shake? im getting tired of replacing parts. its a 2001 outback.

Edited March 22, 2020 by sirtokesalot

[el_freddo]

Well you’ve only got a short list of parts left before all replaceable parts new. 

It could be the rack bushes, or possibly a bearing, but that would usually be associated with noise. 

Cheers 

Bennie

[Mitchy]

As Bennie said, check  the rack bushes if you have not. There is not much else up front to fix...

Also, are you 100% certain that it is at the front of the car? Perhaps the driveshaft is wobbling, or there is a loose trans/diff/engine mount.

Good luck

[Mitchy]

Our silver Forester did all manner of peculiar wobbles, shakes and vibrations until I replaced the  transmission mount.

[sirtokesalot]

On 3/18/2020 at 3:46 AM, Mitchy said:

As Bennie said, check  the rack bushes if you have not. There is not much else up front to fix...

Also, are you 100% certain that it is at the front of the car? Perhaps the driveshaft is wobbling, or there is a loose trans/diff/engine mount.

Good luck

i think its the front. it causes the steering wheel to wobble left and right.

[1 Lucky Texan]

check hub/rotor/caliper temps with an infrared thermometer after a highway run.

is the wobble in sync with tire roation - or, 'about' 4 times faster?

if you lightly touch the brakes while wobbling, can you feel pulses in the brake pedal or, does it change the symptom?

did this begine gradually or after some work on the car?

[lmdew]

Do you feel it in the lower Driver's seat?  Rear Brake rotor.

[sirtokesalot]

15 hours ago, 1 Lucky Texan said:

check hub/rotor/caliper temps with an infrared thermometer after a highway run.

is the wobble in sync with tire roation - or, 'about' 4 times faster?

if you lightly touch the brakes while wobbling, can you feel pulses in the brake pedal or, does it change the symptom?

did this begine gradually or after some work on the car?

the wobble is in the steering wheel at low speeds as u speed up faster the steering wheel wobbles faster as u get to highway speeds it starts to become a vibration that resonates throgh the body of the car. it has always done this since i got the car. everything ive done has helped it but none of it has gotten it to go away.

[Mitchy]

 I would start again by checking all transmission/ motor/ subframe/ driveshaft/ half axle/ brake caliper bolts and bushes. 
If all of the rotating parts are known to be true and balanced, then it has to be their support which is loose.

Are the wheel studs too long for the nuts and the wheels are not on tight, even though the nuts are tight?

 Do you have alloy wheels with no hubcentric ring fitted? or a crushed ring stuck on the wheel/hub.

Or maybe the front differential is affecting the front wheels somehow, perhaps grabbing on each rotation of the half shafts?

 

[el_freddo]

2 hours ago, sirtokesalot said:

the wobble is in the steering wheel at low speeds as u speed up faster the steering wheel wobbles faster as u get to highway speeds it starts to become a vibration that resonates throgh the body of the car. it has always done this since i got the car. everything ive done has helped it but none of it has gotten it to go away.

This points to driveshafts for me. I realise you said you swapped them for known good ones, but this is what my thinking comes back to - particularly if it’s a big steering wheel wobble at lower speeds.

Cheers 

Bennie

[1 Lucky Texan]

EDITED;

have half-shaft/CV axle nuts been torqued with wheels on the ground? FSM says not to do that - no weight on the wheels.

Edited March 21, 2020 by 1 Lucky Texan

[sirtokesalot]

wait are u guys talking about the front axles or the center driveshaft? the center driveshaft was out when i changed the transmission.

[1 Lucky Texan]

I edited my last post, el freddo is talking about center drive shaft I think?

[Rampage]

You have changed the wheels and tires and that eliminates a bent wheel or a bump on the tire. You have changed the transmission, so I guess the axle stubs are fully inserted into the diff.

On 3/20/2020 at 7:21 AM, sirtokesalot said:

it has always done this since i got the car.

Check the control arm bushings you can see if they look off center. Check the frame that the front a arm bushings mount to. If the frame is bent inwards it will move the wheel bearing inward and cause binding on the axle joint and this will cause steering wheel wobble.

Measure the distance between the left and right ball joint nuts and compare it to another car that uses the same front axles. Measure both the same, wheels on the ground or on ramps.

Does this car set lower in the front than normal, like weak or bent coil springs? In the FSM the ride height measurement is top of the wheel to the edge of the fender.

Take the car to a big parking lot. Do not hold the steering wheel. Let the car move forward. Does the steering wheel move in one direction in jerks? If it continuously turns clockwise, there is a problem with the right front axel. If it continuously turns counterclockwise there is a problem with the left front axel.

If the steering wheel just wobbles back and forth that is a sign of a bent rim, but you have replaced them and the hubs, so I am at a loss.

[1197sts]

I've been chasing front end vibrations on a '01 Outback for a while now, I finally have it smoothed out. The primary problems were aftermarket CV Axles and bushings on the brake caliper pins. BTW, I have found the NAPA CV Axles to be ok, but I would prefer used OEM as a first choice if the boots aren't torn. Of course, there are lots of other things that could be causing your problem.

[idosubaru]

On 3/18/2020 at 12:08 AM, sirtokesalot said:

 whats more likely to cause this shake?

You never said what year or model? 

front control arm bushing.

or I guess since you don't want to guess any more - jack it up and pry REALLY hard from a bunch of different angles, trying to get all the bushings to budge.  Sometimes they're hard to tell if they're bad or not. 

The front ones can be bad too but it's often the rear:

00-04 it's usually the front control rear bushing that can be bought separate and replaced easily as a housing/unit.  or you can just replace the bushing too.  i can mail you a new entire bolt on aftermarket part for like $30. 

https://www.partsgeek.com/gbproducts/WC/18998-01044604.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=ff&utm_content=YN&utm_campaign=PartsGeek+Google+Base&utm_term=2000-2004+Subaru+Outback+Control+Arm+Bushing+Genuine+W0133-1652598+Front+Left+Rearward+00-04+Subaru+Control+Arm+Bushing+2001&fp=pp&gbm=a&utm_source=google&utm_medium=ff&utm_campaign=PartsGeek+Google+Basecid=6774379819&aid=79287199093&keyword=412523790879%3A%3Apla-412523790879&kid=412523790879&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqNOAt7ms6AIVCZ2zCh3RXgRQEAQYASABEgIYmPD_BwE

05+ the rear is pressed into the control arm.  

 

Edited March 21, 2020 by idosubaru

[1 Lucky Texan]

is it less noticeable on wet roads by any chance? or on gravel?

[sirtokesalot]

you are correct i did not notice that. it is a 2001 outback it does not seem different on wet roads i dont really drive much dirt roads.

[1 Lucky Texan]

could an observer in another car 'pacing' you perhaps see something? video the front corners, etc.

[el_freddo]

On 3/22/2020 at 2:40 AM, 1 Lucky Texan said:

I edited my last post, el freddo is talking about center drive shaft I think?

Nope, drive shafts here are what you guys call half shafts. Sorry for the confusion! 

That centre drive shaft is known as a tail shaft or prop shaft over here! 

Cheers 

Bennie

[idosubaru]

22 hours ago, sirtokesalot said:

you are correct i did not notice that. it is a 2001 outback it does not seem different on wet roads i dont really drive much dirt roads.

check that front control arm rear bushing i mentioned above. 

and tie rods. 

 

[sirtokesalot]

hey sorry guys i have been looking at the advice just haven't had a chance to get out and look at it. currently cold as all hell outside and got sent home early today from lack of customers. my jobs still open so trying to find time when its not raining or still cold is hard. i will get to it soon and check this stuff out any other ideas to look at when i get into it is greatly appreciated

[CNY_Dave]

Well it could be a bent hub. Never have seen one, but is possible.

 

With wheels in the air has anyone run it so the wheels rotated and done a visual check nothing is rotating wobbly?

[idosubaru]

6 hours ago, CNY_Dave said:

Well it could be a bent hub. Never have seen one, but is possible.

 

With wheels in the air has anyone run it so the wheels rotated and done a visual check nothing is rotating wobbly?

That’s a good point. Count how many wheel weights, or Markings from previous weights, are on them. I’ve seen bent rims with like 8 weights on them. Rotate them front to back or have a tire shop balance and tell you. 

Ive never seen a bent rim cause a shake that was problematic or seemed like something other than a wheel but haven’t seen many bent rims either. 

[1 Lucky Texan]

On 3/17/2020 at 11:08 PM, sirtokesalot said:

...snip...ll joints new/used hubs because original be....snip...

looks like hubs were done