First EA82T , O2 sensor? Yes? No?

[Step-a-toe]

In my FSM for 85,86 turbos, flapper style, the part on the O2 sensor says "Australia Only" - as if to suggest all other markets did not use one

Am I correct? Don't seem right...

[skishop69]

Likely something to do with government rules or something else. Can't run a turbo with no O2 without creating issues in runability.

[naru2]

1 hour ago, skishop69 said:

Likely something to do with government rules or something else. Can't run a turbo with no O2 without creating issues in runability.

Not true.It is strictly an emissions thing.

Porsche turbos did not have O2 sensors until  required by emissions in 1980.They ran very well before then.

The BMW 2002 turbo had no O2 sensor either

Not to mention the 1000`s of Corvair turbos that preceded them.

 

Maybe 86 JDM turbo Subes did not use one.Kinda doubt it though.Anybody Know for sure?

Or maybe the FSM references a part difference for Australia?

[idosubaru]

7 hours ago, Step-a-toe said:

In my FSM for 85,86 turbos, flapper style, the part on the O2 sensor says "Australia Only" - as if to suggest all other markets did not use one

Am I correct? Don't seem right...

US EA82's have oxygen sensors, including 85 and 86 XT's and 85-87 turbo's I believe.  Subaru part number 22690AA000

 

4 hours ago, skishop69 said:

Can't run a turbo with no O2 without creating issues in runability.

These old ECU's are primitive and will run fine....but probably rich and foul the plugs and burn up the converter over time and turbo's don't really need extra running variables...but few people drive an old Subaru long enough to notice and those that do would just fix it proper. 

 

[naru2]

I think the ECU defaulting to Limp Mode would be the biggest concern with a missing O2 sensor for an ECU that expected to see one.

[idosubaru]

1 hour ago, naru2 said:

I think the ECU defaulting to Limp Mode would be the biggest concern with a missing O2 sensor for an ECU that expected to see one.

There's no need to "think" or make up concerns - just go unplug one and you'll see that they run and drive just fine and there's no "limp mode', depending what you mean.  "limp mode" is somewhat ambiguous in this case. 

without appropriate O2 sensor input the ECU simply like during warm up when it's not using the 02 sensor at all.  It'll run rich, except indefinitely which will likely foul the plugs or degrades the converter in 10's of thousands of miles depending on conditions.

[Step-a-toe]

Thought it odd. My manuals cater for LHD as well as RHD, Saudi Arabia, Switzerland etc

Here in Aus we saw Landcruisers and beasts in same category off roadable, rural property owner style run EFI without O2 sensor but I guess their thirst was a reason why many went to dual fuel with propane conversions - making the job one wire easier and not have to run electronic fuel adjustment controls

[naru2]

3 hours ago, idosubaru said:

There's no need to "think" or make up concerns - just go unplug one and you'll see that they run and drive just fine and there's no "limp mode', depending what you mean.  "limp mode" is somewhat ambiguous in this case. 

without appropriate O2 sensor input the ECU simply like during warm up when it's not using the 02 sensor at all.  It'll run rich, except indefinitely which will likely foul the plugs or degrades the converter in 10's of thousands of miles depending on conditions.

You seem to like to make up concerns about whether the plugs will foul.Why not follow your own advice and just go unplug one.

[naru2]

The real point is that an O2 sensor is not required just because a car has a turbo.so the possibility exists that Subaru did not use one in some markets.

Edited May 12, 2020 by naru2

[idosubaru]

1 hour ago, naru2 said:

You seem to like to make up concerns about whether the plugs will foul.Why not follow your own advice and just go unplug one.

????   I have done it. That’s how I know “limp mode” doesn’t exist. I was stating that as an illustration - anyone can go prove it in a matter of minutes, there’s no need to guess.

We arent disagreeing so much as addressing and cross communicating different parts and tangents of this thread.

you’re addressing another comment that was ambiguous.  It is 100% correct turbos in general don’t require an oxygen sensor. That comment was ambiguous though, he could have meant “a turbo equipped with an O2 can’t run without one” or “no turbo has ever been made without an O2 sensor”. He’s been around cars enough I wouldn’t think he meant the latter.

There’s also some ambiguity from the original post.  Maybe it’s just about clarifying documentation but often a post has underlying goals. maybe he’s trying to drive it or fix something?

Edited May 12, 2020 by idosubaru

[idosubaru]

There are quite a few odd EA82 fueling changes and differences from 86-88. Carb flapper MAF SPFI MPFI and wasnt there a weird mix oddball that had a carb but some kind of controller too one year? 

some with knock sensors and some without and some with O2 and some without.

and each model was sometimes treated differently across that spectrum. 

That’s a seriously confusing mess of 3 years!  And Plenty of room for some asterisks. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by idosubaru

[Step-a-toe]

And I reckon I fluked it in one respect, getting the Series One for transplant into propane recipient

Ditched all EFI stuff and just used the KCM for Dizzy's knock control

[skishop69]

Yes, I should have been more clear. Damage to the CAT. ECU cars can be mapped to run without one, but it is more complex mapping to get it to pass emission standards. Unplugging an O2 on an ECU car can lead to fouling of plugs or burning down pistons. It all depends on the car and conditions. I've seen it happen though. Carb'd turbos are jetted to run rich and are a bit of a different criiter.

[naru2]

The original question was whether  Subaru omitted O2 sensors on 85-86 EA82Ts  in some markets,NOT what happens if an O2 sensor is removed.

Given the worldwide FSM notes ,I am thinking yes.

Why have an O2 sensor if you don`t care about emissions?

I bet the ECUs for group A rally cars did not use one.Can`t  be 100% sure though even after looking at the rest of the rally prep manual.(exhaust gets replaced)

Edited May 12, 2020 by naru2