Rear Wheel Bearing Replacement 2001 Legacy

[Norm Shea]

I have the above mentioned vehicle and I recently noticed some squeaking from the driver-side, rear wheel.  I checked the hubs when I got home and the driver-side hub was substantially hotter than the passenger-side hub; really too hot to touch for more than an instant.  Having previously repacked/replaced wheel bearings on other vehicles (old Chevies and VWs), I dove in.  After getting the rotor off and looking at the emergency brake setup, I thought I'd better refer to YouTube.  This sobering video,

refers to pressing the bearings into the bore and hub into the bearings. 

This was a little more than I bargained for so I'd like to get some input.  I don't have a press so I'm wondering if this is something I should proceed with or if I should button it back up and take it to Suby Doctors?

Thanks for any input.

[ocei77]

Replace the hub. RockAuto.

Once you remove all the interfering bolt attachments ( lateral link, strut mount, sway bar link upper transverse link and axle nut)there are four bolts that mount it to the hub.

You won't need to remove the parking cable. A hard rap should dislodge the hub and if you want to replace a rusted backing plate, now is the time.

Of course you have to remove the caliper and bracket.

Once you look at it, it's not as hard as it sounds. Just time consuming.

Jack the car as high as you can and use stands.

Spray with pb the night before if you can. 

You really need an impact gun, but you could get by w/o it.

Definitely 1/2' drive

Need 19mm sockets and wrench, plus the 32mm for the axle nut. Break that loose before you raise it, unless you have a heavy duty impact.

Plus14, 17 ,10 and 12mm sockets. A long extension to pass through the outer part of the spindle to get to the caliper bolts.

Don't forget the anti sieze on install

O.

Edited May 23, 2021 by ocei77
add

[idosubaru]

heat and noise could also be seized caliper pins.  Need to diagnose it. 

2001 legacy/Outback is not press in.  90s legacy/ Outback or 2001 Impreza/Forster are press in.  But not 2001 legacy. buy a bearing assembly that includes the hub.  It unbolts, knock it out, bolt the new one on   

No special bolts or tools. Unbolt and bolt on.  Very quick and easy.....except the assembly can be hard to remove due to rust/corrosion. I live in the rust belt and torch the &’jk!$&’m out of it if needed.

If you’ve got attention to detail/intuitiveness and get creative with hammers and chisels and extensions with well placed blows it’ll also eventually come out. But torch is the way if it’s stuck or rust/corrosion.  

[Norm Shea]

@ocei77 and @idosubaru,

Thank you both for the input.  So, this is where I am now (first attachment).  To @idosubaru's comment, I did notice that the pads had a disparate amount of wear (second attachment).  Do you think it could be the caliper causing the problem?  Does it warrant investigating that first?  I will admit to not having actually spun the wheel when it was first jacked up (I did have the parking brake set until I realized that was making rotor removal more challenging).  Is there some amount of play in the hub that I should notice if it is indeed the bearings?

 

Edited May 23, 2021 by Norm Shea
photo wouldn't attach

[idosubaru]

Hard to say - all we have to go on is “some squeaking” - that’s about as little information as we could possibly have.

Check for play but many newer style bearings don’t exhibit play so a lack of play does not rule out a bad wheel bearing.  On the vehicle I only notice play in 1out of 5 bearings  

Rotate the bearing by hand now that you have it stripped down. Does it make noise or feel lumpy in a certain spot? If you have a stethoscope use it while rotating  

To rule out pads:

Clean up the inside of the rotor of rust/ridges and make sure the parking brake is properly adjusted and not rubbing.

clean the pad retaining clips where they touch the pad ears, and make sure the pad ears aren’t hanging in them and can freely slide. 

regrease the slide pins and throw away or replace any suspicious slide pin bushings (if equipped).  They swell and seize or impede the caliper movement and can cause squeaking like noises when the caliper “rocks” between one good pin and one problematic one.

make sure the rotor isn’t rubbing a bent portion of the dust shield. Not uncommon.  Make sure the rotor doesn’t have a rusty flaking lip at the edge that’s rubbing the pad abs causing noise.  I’ve had to turn rotors or run a grinder along the rust formed edge the last millimeter of the rotor diameter where it quits contacting the pad surface. It rusts there and usually causes no issues because it doesn’t touch the pad. But rarely that rust swells or expands or otherwise creeps over to interfere with the pads.  Happens with new pads too - if the new pad is a little bigger than the old ones and hits a previously untouched part of the rotor that’s now rusty. But it can rarely happen with old pads too  

reassemble your properly cleaned and adjusted brakes and see if the noise persists. 

[Norm Shea]

@idosubaru, again, thanks for the input.  I'll get back on it first thing in the AM and then provide an update.  Sorry, I know the squeaking was not that beneficial of a diagnostic.  To elaborate, the sound was an episodic, high-pitched noise that kind of pulsed with the rotation of the wheel, speeding up as the rotation speed increased.  It was not a consistent gravely noise.

[idosubaru]

23 minutes ago, Norm Shea said:

@idosubaru, again, thanks for the input.  I'll get back on it first thing in the AM and then provide an update.  Sorry, I know the squeaking was not that beneficial of a diagnostic.  To elaborate, the sound was an episodic, high-pitched noise that kind of pulsed with the rotation of the wheel, speeding up as the rotation speed increased.  It was not a consistent gravely noise.

No apology needed. I might be wasting your time on brakes.  I’d probably address and look over the brakes anyway even if I was sure it’s the bearings. so it’s no time loss to address the brakes first and I might diagnose or avoid bearings by doing so. 

Bearings usually are a low growl that disappears around very sharp turns (usually only one direction right or left, not both) at speed, and brakes more high pitched squeal.  But they can vary and overlap symptoms too.  
 

That inner pad is even low enough I wonder if it could be noisy depending on quality and what the other side of the pad looks like we can’t see - maybe it’s warn even more on the side opppsote the photo?

That’s not uncommon for the inner brake pad to wear more than the outer, but that is an excessive difference in thickness. I’d see if the pins are hanging, pin bushing condition, and pad movement in clips. 

It’s rarely the calipers, like almost never. Not impossible, but I’ve only seen one Subaru caliper failure and about 50 pin, bushing, clip, rotor rust, bent backing plate issues..  I’d be surprised if it’s the caliper and wouldnt suspect it until I rule out other things first. 

[Norm Shea]

@idosubaru, so I think I'm leaning more towards brakes.  I jacked the other side up and rotated the wheels (actually, my daughter provided the labor) and I listened.  There was absolutely no noise (I did not use a stethoscope, though) on the driver-side.  The only noise was a periodic sound that seemed to coincide with a dragging on the passenger-side now.  Not a squealing (I guess I meant that more than squeaking in my initial post) but just a low, light "scrape" from about 3 o'clock to 8 o'clock on every rotation (looks like I'll be pulling that apart next!).

I included some images of the brake shoes off of the driver-side.  The first two are the top and bottom of the inside pad, the one that had the least wear.  Then the next two are of the top and bottom of the outside pad, the one with the most wear.  Lastly, I have the mounting bracket.  The bushing on the top moves in and out freely but the one on the bottom will not move at all.  What impact does that have?

[idosubaru]

Are you saying the pin isn’t moving? If the pin isn’t moving in and out then it’s seized and very likely your issue.

Twist turn pound to get the pin to move - but sometimes they aren’t going to come out without a torch.  Get a used good one or buy a new caliper and use just the bracket.  Yes that’s crazy but an option.  I don’t trust aftermarket calipers in the rust belt. 

Some wheel bearings aren’t diagnosable on the vehicle. They will literally evade all methods - but then when removed you can feel the lumps or otherwise tell.  I don’t know what voodoo allows them to do that but a lack of easily found symptoms is no sure sign it is not the bearings.  But you’ve already seemed to find brake pin failure so it sounds like that’s the starting point. 

[Norm Shea]

1 minute ago, idosubaru said:

Are you saying the pin isn’t moving? If the pin isn’t moving in and out then it’s seized and very likely your issue.

Yes, I guess I should have said the pin going through the bushing will not move.  So, how aggressive should I be?  Should I put the mounting bracket in the vice and tap on the pin with a hammer?  And, if you're talking about a torch, I'm assuming I'm cutting the bushing off first?  And is the pin and bushing something that is replaceable?  Sorry, for the newbie questions; my Dad and I did a lot on cars but this was not one of them, and he's not around to ask anymore.

[moosens]

Sorry about your dad. Spray some penetrant into that sliding bushing until it works free. Then re-grease it. 
 

Maybe take a few minutes to review some YouTube videos but of course we’ll help from here too. You want those calipers to slide freely. And the pads to slide freely too. 
 

Given the vehicle’s age and where you’re at right now I suggest getting new bearings , the ones set into the housing already , and of course fresh brakes. 
 

Thrifty guys like me will save the pads you have that don’t look so bad. As long as the wear isn’t drastically angled (pad surface beveled) you can keep those handy just in case. And you can square them up quickly and safely if they’re a little off. 
 

You can work that bushing free in many ways but I’m sure putting it in a vice is a very good idea. No heat needed yet. And of course be considerate to the rubber boots or be prepared to replace them. 
 

 

[idosubaru]

If it's stuck really bad you might just want to buy a used or new caliper bracket - brackets used to not be available but it seems like they're becoming more widely available. I like used if I can find it because the original factory materials are probably higher quality, more rust resistant and I've seen a couple anecdotal (statistically meaningless) examples to suggest that's the case. Either way - this looks like a really good deal if they're stuck and you don't have a torch.  This is not for your vehicle, just an example - you'll have to look.  I would order locally and take yours with you to make sure you get the right bracket - it's very easy to get the wrong bracket particularly on front 99-02 subaru's.  Rear should be easier but best to check...anyway, for illustration purposes only:

https://www.autozone.com/brakes-and-traction-control/brake-caliper-bracket-front/duralast-brake-caliper-bracket-14-1002/710461_0_0?cmpid=PLA:US:EN:AD:NL:1000000:HRD:71700000043798721&gclid=Cj0KCQjwna2FBhDPARIsACAEc_UsPXj_fc2_TsVcRpB2c45Zokhd_ASMi1-LZIe5cwl8t22tyVh_eoAaArIYEALw_wcB

17 hours ago, Norm Shea said:

Yes, I guess I should have said the pin going through the bushing will not move. 

The black rubber soft part under the head of the pin is the boot, not the bushing. 
The bushing isn't visible, it's inside on the shaft of the pin. 

Only 2000+ Subaru's have those bushings. So it's possible yours doesn't have one being so close to 2000 and Subaru's schizophrenic caliper bracket usage from 1999-2002.  
If equipped - only one pin per caliper has them.  Both of those pins wont' have it. 

And - the bushing doesn't matter right now anyway - we need to get that pin out first and worry about the bushing (if equipped) later. 

***You should be able to *stretch* the pin boot over the ears of the pin to remove it and get some penetrant down the shaft of the pin (PB Blaster, Liquid Wrench).  If it's bad enough that stuff won't end up getting down deep enough unless maybe you soak it in a bucket for 4 months.  Remove that before trying to extract it. 

16 hours ago, Norm Shea said:

So, how aggressive should I be?  

If it's not coming out you're not being aggressive enough. some are easy, some impossible without a torch, most in between.

16 hours ago, Norm Shea said:

Should I put the mounting bracket in the vice and tap on the pin with a hammer?

Absolutely - increase effort or weight of hammer and bash it until the pin ears starts to get damaged, bent. 

I prefer turning them back and forth with a large pipe wrench.  That works better than a hammer - the little movement you can get eventually works internally like sand paper crumbling piece by piece where the hammer can just pound tighter and tighter. depending how the rust formation is inside.

Eventually the hammer will deform or bend the pin ears or the pipe wrench will rip them/grind them badly if the pin is stuck bad enough. 

16 hours ago, Norm Shea said:

And, if you're talking about a torch, I'm assuming I'm cutting the bushing off first?  

No - heat the body of the caliper bracket red hot where the bushing passes through.  The heat breaks the rust welded internal bond and then pull the pin out (with pliers to avoid burning yourself obviously).   Shops can do this for you in about 4 minutes - just ask and they'll extract the pin for you with a torch.  I've done this before when I'm working on something not at my house.  Pin can be reused afterwards...might not be pretty looking after beating, twisting, and getting red hot - but usable. 

17 hours ago, Norm Shea said:

And is the pin and bushing something that is replaceable? 

Yes. Disclaimer - dont' do what you read on the internet, but I throw away those pin bushings on my vehicles.  They're pointless, don't do anything, and Subaru's before 2000 never even used them.  They're nothing but a liability to me.  (But again remember there's a chance yours doesn't have them)

buying a used (or new but they're often not available without buying an entire caliper) bracket is an option too.  Even if you do free up the pin now - the inside of the bore and pin are prone to do this again in the future.  They need cleaned up well and regreased and checking periodically - every time you do the brakes or rotate/change tires. 

*** Grease:  Use SilGlyde or synthetic brake grease. It's waaaaaaay better than generic stuff.  Also if you do have pin bushings and keep them, regular pin grease causes them to swell and seize inside the bore. 

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/american-grease-stick-co-sil-glyde-silicone-brake-lubricant-tube-4-oz-bk-4/12024852-P

 

[Norm Shea]

@idosubaru and @moosens,

Thanks for the quick replies and sorry for the long delay in replying myselt.  It was a busy week of field work (I attached a couple of images) so the prep and the actual work made for some really long days.  Not a lot was able to be accomplished car-wise during the week.

I did get a chance to work on it over the last couple of days though (third attached image).  Given the condition of the driver side, I decided to do the passenger side, as well.  I was able to get all of the pins to come out of the mounting brackets on both without too much difficulty and without damaging anything in the process.  Even the rubber boots seemed to be in good condition once they were cleaned up a bit.  And, after wire brushing, the mounting brackets looked pretty respectable.  I bought new pads and some synthetic brake grease and got it all put back together earlier this evening.  I wasn't able to do a long drive to heat things up and check the hubs but the squealing is definitely gone.  So, things seem promising. 

@moosens, I didn't do the bearings because there just seemed to be conflicting information about them.  I found an electronic service manual for the car that I'd forgot I had and, from the bearing section, it still appeared like they needed to be pressed in.

Again, thanks @ocei77, @idosubaru, and @moosens for the assistance.  I'll update once I've had it on the road a bit more.

Edited May 31, 2021 by Norm Shea
grammar correction

[moosens]

Heck with Subarus , get back out there on the water ! 
 

I see you’re a biologist. And on a work boat. I’m a Shellfishing nut myself. Just never enough time with good tides. I’m a shore goer , no boat.   Enjoy !! 
 

 

[Norm Shea]

5 minutes ago, moosens said:

Heck with Subarus , get back out there on the water ! 
 

I see you’re a biologist. And on a work boat. I’m a Shellfishing nut myself. Just never enough time with good tides. I’m a shore goer , no boat.   Enjoy !! 
 

 

Well, the Subaru gets me back and forth to the boat, so it's kinda crucial. Yeah, I work for the South Carolina Department of Natural Resources.  The section I'm in is responsible for monitoring the health of the creeks, estuaries, and saltmarsh throughout the entire coast.  Here's an image of one of our sites that we visit.  Not a bad gig.

[idosubaru]

Hey success!  Good job knocking that out.  I thought it was brake pads but was hesitant without being able to see/hear myself. Nice refinish and paint  

Nifty. My cousin does the same in the Chesapeake bay for like 20 years now.  so next time I’m around Harbor Island or Sea Brooke, would I hit you up for fishing tips!?  

[Norm Shea]

@idosubaru, sure, I know them both well.  And I'm right down the hall from the Inshore Fisheries Section, they're the ones with the real inside scoop.  Let me know!

Took the car for a long trip today, checked the hubs and both were what I would consider a "normal" temperature, so I'm optimistic.  And, although it's probably just my imagination, it just feels like it drives more effortlessly.  I'll be interested to see what the gas mileage looks like.