Turbo??

[Heater]

How hard would it be to install a turbo on my 89 1.8l single port fuel injected EA82. I really don't want to do a motor swap for this motor has been tried and trued through the extreme abuse I have put it through.

[GeneralDisorder]

If you have to ask - too hard and too expensive. 

That engine was a pile of feces with the factory turbo and all the engineering Subaru could throw at it. Why do you suppose some dude in his garage that has no clue "how hard it is" to install one would have better luck? 

I would dismiss a customer with a laugh if they asked me to do such a thing and I actually could accomplish it and make it as safe as could be reasonably expected considering age and condition. 

An EJ22 swap by comparison is much simpler. 

GD

[Heater]

Well I was just looking for some ideas. I've done some looking into it and yes it will be a pain in the rump roast. The motor has the same compression ratio as the turbo gl10 model. As for your opinion I don't really care how you feel about the motor. You must be a wrx guy

[DaveT]

It would be less work and more reliable to do the EJ swap.

[el_freddo]

Do a search on the forum. Many have done it and from what I remember all of them crack the ring lands of the piston - I don’t know if this naturally happens over time with boost or if the builder got boost greed… 

GD isn’t a wrx guy per-sae, he runs a very successful Subaru specialist workshop and I believe he’s had loads of experience with the EA81 and EA82.

Personally I think the EA82 is possibly Subarus worst 4 cylinder engine. Box cams suggest a rush into the over head cam 80’s marketing catch cry. I’d take an EA81 over an EA82 any day. 

I’d recommend an EJ conversion. From factory the EJ has similar power figures to the factory EA82t - but with much less complication in its build/operation. 

All the best with your decision and whichever way you go. 

Cheers 

Bennie

[1 Lucky Texan]

daveT's suggestion is pretty good I think, get an engine from car-part.com , MLS headgaskets and new timing belt system components.

 

 

[ferp420]

On 5/26/2022 at 9:40 AM, Heater said:

Well I was just looking for some ideas. I've done some looking into it and yes it will be a pain in the rump roast. The motor has the same compression ratio as the turbo gl10 model. As for your opinion I don't really care how you feel about the motor. You must be a wrx guy

thats funny do it man its real easy just make sure to get a reeaaaalllly   big turdbo and take lots of pictures and some short video

lol i love watching engines go pop

why do images of twin turbos poking up though the hood being powered by electric motors keep poping in to my head

 

Edited May 28, 2022 by ferp420

[Steptoe's photos]

I have been running turbo EA82 since 2006 and still have a love for them. SPFI is only single intake port, where turbo uses the twin intake port mpfi heads. EA81T were single port inlet and they do OK from reports. You could do a suck-it-and-see approach on your spfi set up but what I have read of turbo on NA compression varies from, spun a bearing to 50,000 miles on high boost before it was toast. What makes my EA82 a little more robust in one of my cars is the twin core EA81 radiator (EA81 body with it too , mind you  ) Twin electric fans with a better user control is also a help in warmer climates. Give it a shot, no extra boost, pull the initial timing back a bit, like , I think set at 20 normally, try at 10.

 

If you look at the exhaust port you will see there are two threaded holes not in use where current exhaust bolts up. The EA82T exhaust manifold uses these. The EA82T head on the non dizzy side is an mpfi head and has flat cast faces tapped to supply oil to the turbo and a drain back to same head via 5/8" /16mm hose. An spfi head may also be adaptable to give and take oil to and from the turbo or run a T piece from oil pressure switch up front. The drain plug of each head, the non dizzy side is used to supply coolant to the turbo via long pitot style pick up banjo bolt that screws into the drain plug, steel, rottable pipe, then rubber hose to turbo. Coolant then returns to the underside of thermostat housing. I actually have a couple of EA82 spfi intake manifolds here in Australia. I started adapting one for a turbo EA81 idea - used the spfi ECU coolant temp sensor port for the coolant return. You will need to keep your coolant temp sensor, so will need to T in a return somewhere. I started the EA81 turbo idea and nearly got there before concentrating on EA82 for it's superior design and drivability over EA81. I guess people saw EJ having an advantage of EA82 too. I just didn't look that far

 

Edited May 28, 2022 by Steptoe's photos

[GeneralDisorder]

On 5/26/2022 at 9:40 AM, Heater said:

You must be a wrx guy

Not at all. Never owned one (other than a few dozen I've fixed/upgraded and sold). Build them all the time to 500+ HP though. Also junk and I wouldn't own one for keeps. 

I'm a "things that make sense" guy. And my decisions in that regard have made me a successful business owner - one of which is that I work on Subaru's because they are plentiful in my area, often broken, and they have qualities that endear them to people who put way more money than they are worth into them - that equals profit. I don't actually drive the silly things other than test drives..... that would be silly. LoL. 

As to how I "feel" about the motor. I've been doing this probably longer than you have been alive and trust me it's not a "feeling" guy. These are hard-earned facts and statistics. 

That engine is absolute $hit. Wouldn't take one or a dozen of em if they were free.... I would have to be paid to remove them. 

GD

 

Edited May 30, 2022 by GeneralDisorder

[GeneralDisorder]

F

Edited May 30, 2022 by GeneralDisorder

[Steptoe's photos]

On 5/31/2022 at 8:11 AM, GeneralDisorder said:

Not at all. Never owned one (other than a few dozen I've fixed/upgraded and sold). Build them all the time to 500+ HP though. Also junk and I wouldn't own one for keeps. 

I'm a "things that make sense" guy. And my decisions in that regard have made me a successful business owner - one of which is that I work on Subaru's because they are plentiful in my area, often broken, and they have qualities that endear them to people who put way more money than they are worth into them - that equals profit. I don't actually drive the silly things other than test drives..... that would be silly. LoL. 

As to how I "feel" about the motor. I've been doing this probably longer than you have been alive and trust me it's not a "feeling" guy. These are hard-earned facts and statistics. 

That engine is absolute $hit. Wouldn't take one or a dozen of em if they were free.... I would have to be paid to remove them. 

GD

 

GD is correct and I agree that I have put more money into my EA82s than what they are worth, but it is all I have in my shed

[Numbchux]

On 5/26/2022 at 8:44 AM, Heater said:

this motor has been tried and trued through the extreme abuse I have put it through.

Must be your first car 

 

Or, maybe you got a reliable EA82. Thank every deity you can think of, and don't mess with it.

 

 

It will be more expensive, more work, slower, and less reliable than a non turbo EJ

 

Not a chance that it has the same compression ratio as a turbo.

Edited June 4, 2022 by Numbchux

[ferp420]

im one of the few who for the fun of it built a high performance ea82

ive spent hundreads or hours with rotary tools porting and polishing the heads and intake manifold

i shaved 1/8 inch off of each side of the block and each head

because i shaved so much off the block and heads i had to fab a spacer to transition the intake to the engine cause the engine is now a 1/2" shorter than stock and the intake wouldent match up 

custom ground the valves and laped them in polished the valve stems and ported the exhaust manifold its self

custom 2" cat back exhaust

 

all that work took thousands of hours even if i had to pay $1 a hour i couldent have afforded to pay some one else to do the work and in the end i got a engine on the edge it ran great untill it ate the bearings in the bottom end i got maybe 20k out of it

and for all that work it couldent match the ej22 although its vary vary close to my ej2.2 v2 in power the big differance is the ea82m lasted 20k miles while the ej2.2v2 has been make the same power in stock form for over 300k and still going strong 

the gl10 turbo couldent keep up with my ea82m i built it pulled away from that gl10 hard even after some mods the ea82t couldent keep up with the ea82m

now for a reality check even if you go though all the trouble to build something like this you cant get parts for it so its pointless spend thousands of dollers on something you might not even be able to get the parts to finnish building 

these parts were hard to find 10 years ago when i built my ea82m there 10 times harder to get now 

im all for going big and going boom but you might not make it to the boom part if you go that big but if you do get it on video from start to boom it would probably make a great you tube video series i would watch it lol

Edited June 10, 2022 by ferp420

[Steptoe's photos]

I wonder about Ferps timing belts after shaving so much off the heads. I know the tensioners take up the slack, but the cams must retard or advance the closer the cam gets to the block as the cam belt teeth dimensions do not change ?? There are others who have slapped a turbo on carb compression, and wound up the boost and say they got 50,000 miles before hurting the internals - I think this depends on the condition of the donor also. A Mt Isa, QLD, Australia fellow built an EA82T with better rods and pistons (forged) , wound up boost to about 20 psi, added nitrous oxide  and saw 400 HP on the engine dyno before something distorted and jambed things up inside. It ran afterwards I hear, so nothing actually broke or twisted, but he went off the scene after that.

[Heater]

Frp420 i appreciate all the info. You are right about getting parts for this thing it is hard. Honestly I surprised that this car has held up through the things I have put it through. Its got 222013, it had around 209000 when I got it. My thoughts when I got this car was that it was ugly as sin and was just going to strip it run it hard on the old logging roads up here. Its a foreign made car and I have always owned, wrenched, and cussed at Fords. Now with the price of fuel cant afford to really drive the 84 Ford I have as a daily driver so looks like the old subaru will stay the way it is. Until it gives out then its heading to the junk yard. Thanks everybody appreciate it.

[el_freddo]

Before it heads to the junkyard drop an EJ22 into it. No joke you’ll probably get better fuel economy than what you’re getting now and it will “just run better all round”. Plus the maintenance side of things drops off a cliff with an EJ compared to an EA82! 

Cheers 

Bennie

[ferp420]

15 hours ago, Steptoe's photos said:

I wonder about Ferps timing belts after shaving so much off the heads. I know the tensioners take up the slack, but the cams must retard or advance the closer the cam gets to the block as the cam belt teeth dimensions do not change ?? There are others who have slapped a turbo on carb compression, and wound up the boost and say they got 50,000 miles before hurting the internals - I think this depends on the condition of the donor also. A Mt Isa, QLD, Australia fellow built an EA82T with better rods and pistons (forged) , wound up boost to about 20 psi, added nitrous oxide  and saw 400 HP on the engine dyno before something distorted and jambed things up inside. It ran afterwards I hear, so nothing actually broke or twisted, but he went off the scene after that.

timing belts are fine the number of teeth on the belt dident change so no timing change and there are 2 belts so each belt only had a small amount of slack to take up 

i can tell you a ea82 on nitrous making 400 hp only lasted one run he might have rebuilt it afterwards but it wasent right after he ripped the threads out of the block and cracked the pistons 

the turbo on a n/a block getting 50k wasent on a ea82 unless they were only pushing 2-3 lbs of boost

my 87 idi deisel was a n/a originaly its now pushing 20psi of boost  i can blow the oil seals out of the block if im not carfull and its alot more robust than a ea82

 

Edited June 11, 2022 by ferp420

[Steptoe's photos]

Yeah, QikRX did not share the autopsy from memory after the thing stopped on the engine dyno. Another RX fella simply slapped the turbo on an mpfi goer to get more torque down low. Next thing I read is the thing is for sale with a suspected spun bearing.

 

You may have missed my point on timing belts and massive shaved blocks and decks. The timing belt structure is a fixed dimension, so when you remove face material and reassemble valve train, in order for a new tight belt to fit, it is going to marginally cause the cam to crank timing to be out. Retarding one side, advancing the other side on a boxer - marginally. You may have to play physically to get what I am saying or chop 10mm out to exaggerate the effect of what I am getting at - of an old donk nobody really cares much about

[ferp420]

17 hours ago, Steptoe's photos said:

Yeah, QikRX did not share the autopsy from memory after the thing stopped on the engine dyno. Another RX fella simply slapped the turbo on an mpfi goer to get more torque down low. Next thing I read is the thing is for sale with a suspected spun bearing.

 

You may have missed my point on timing belts and massive shaved blocks and decks. The timing belt structure is a fixed dimension, so when you remove face material and reassemble valve train, in order for a new tight belt to fit, it is going to marginally cause the cam to crank timing to be out. Retarding one side, advancing the other side on a boxer - marginally. You may have to play physically to get what I am saying or chop 10mm out to exaggerate the effect of what I am getting at - of an old donk nobody really cares much about

nothings changed on the timing belts the tensioner more than takes up the slack and the number of teeth havent changed on any part of the system so there wouldent be any timing issues

if i used a smaller belt that would cause a issue depending on the number of teeth also if i used a differnt pulley anywere it.would.have but its all the same stuff so no timing issues

[el_freddo]

You’re not understanding what steptoe is saying. Move the cams closer to the crank like you did will change their timing as the cams are clocked more one way or the other, unless you moved them in so far that aligning to the next tooth kept the cams at 12 and 6 o’clock when the crank was on its mark. 

Cheers 

Bennie

[ferp420]

no because the only thing conecting the cam to the crank is the belt so nothings changed

it wouldent matter were the cams are as long as the belt and pullies havent chaged

the belt travals the same distance no matter were the physical placement is

the timing marks dont clock one way or another because the belts the same size what your missing is the tensioner pully moves to a new location instead of the timing mark skewing or moving or what ever

it all comes down to the number of teeth in the system

if it was a push rod motor like on a ea81 what step toe is saying would be relivent but on a belt driven motor its a non issue 

Edited June 13, 2022 by ferp420

[ferp420]

i do get what is being sead if a stright line is drawn from the top of cam pullie to the crank pully it would be a shorter distance the teeth on the belt wont make it skew enuff to make any kind of differance now im sure a engine engineer could regrind the cam for more power change the cam timing just a degree or 2

if anything it might have caused a bit of belt ware but not enuff to change the timing enuff to change the performance

 

it is posable that im in left feild and elfredo isent i could have moved enuff to jump 1 tooth and thats why everything lines up but i dont think so

i think theres just so much slop in the timing belts that it just sucked it up

if the alternator and ac belts werent in the way it would be a no tool belt change the belts would slide on and off with almost no effert on both the stock ea82 and the ea82m

i can grab ether one of the head pullies and move the pully with out moving the belt sontheres definitly enuff slop

ether way the ea82m was in the ej2.2 v2 power range and i have both a lifted ea and a lifted ej although the ej2.2 has alittle more torque than the ea in high range it also has smaller tires 28s vs 30s than the ea so its kinda a wash 

Edited June 13, 2022 by ferp420

[Steptoe's photos]

Well, I see it differently

If you set the cam and crank cogs up on a theoretical engine as a boxer and measured say 300mm from two points, one of crank, one of cam, then shave a mm off

Your belt is a fixed dimension in new state, so when all is buttoned up after the shave, the EA82 dizzy side cam is going to be turned about one mm clockwise off perfect cam to crank timing and the turbo side head once shaved is going back one mm anti clockwise, altering your degreeing of the cams different to each other !

I used to work with a very clever engine builder a long time ago, and got much lectures and instruction on these sort of things. A straight engine would be adjustable to compensate but not a flat boxer. So much difference you really won't notice a thing

[ferp420]

9

On 6/15/2022 at 11:26 PM, Steptoe's photos said:

Well, I see it differently

If you set the cam and crank cogs up on a theoretical engine as a boxer and measured say 300mm from two points, one of crank, one of cam, then shave a mm off

Your belt is a fixed dimension in new state, so when all is buttoned up after the shave, the EA82 dizzy side cam is going to be turned about one mm clockwise off perfect cam to crank timing and the turbo side head once shaved is going back one mm anti clockwise, altering your degreeing of the cams different to each other !

I used to work with a very clever engine builder a long time ago, and got much lectures and instruction on these sort of things. A straight engine would be adjustable to compensate but not a flat boxer. So much difference you really won't notice a thing

i do agree with you but the belt isent a stright line it has atleast 1 90 in it wich will eat up most of the slop minimizing that effect to almost nothing and like you sead a degree or 2 wont effect the performance of a ea82 enuff to be noticable and with the huge power gained way outways the performance lost is there more on the table yes ask ram engins they used to make one hell of a ea82 and reliable too

ram has a full machine shop they make there own parts they have engineers i use hand tools and best guesses and my parts arent neer the quality of theres but i did steel some of there ideas like the intake spacers trying to build a ea82 is like polishing a turd even when shinny its still a turd but if you enjoy building engines theres a fun platform to play with cause subaru left so much on the table it gives us something to play with

[ferp420]

i wonder if anyone has tryed ceracoating the pistons and exhaust ports to help with the extra heat

there caracoating diesel pistons to stop piston melt down on n/a diesels with big turdbos like mine lol

i know it wont help with the ringlands but might help stop the head from cracking

maybe lol