baccaruda Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 *update at bottom* well, this is what you get for not buying my wagon... a ton of questions from me about the engine problems! that'll teach you guys. Catch-up: engine has 12k on a rebuild by rguyver, his customer overheated it and had rguyver reseal it at one point during the 12k miles. then the ba$tard sold it to me without mentioning this occurrence. I have absolute confidence in rguyver's quality of work but as of now, after the overheat, the compression is 80-50-90-50 in no particular order. I have the cooling system in excellent condition, new water pump, new radiator, new thermostat (napa), etc. the car does not overheat and did not run abnormally hot last summer. The car gets crap for gas mileage. earlier this summer i removed the crossover pipe and examined the bottom ports in the heads and they were uncracked, so I suspect that the compression problem doesn't lie in the heads. Would I be reasonable to suspect the rings as the cause of the power/compression loss? The car uses some oil but when the RPMS are high enough for the turbo to wake up, it runs much stronger. I don't know enough about bad valve/lifter symptoms to know how/if they would affect this problem but I have to think that with the loss in all 4 cylinders and the oil usage, and no weird noises coming from the engine (doesn't even have much of the standard lifter tick), that it probably isn't the lifters/valves. I would appreciate any and all opinions regarding this. My plan to fix it at this point involves getting a carby short block (easier to find than a good turbo short block) and milling the heads true, and reassembling with new head gaskets. thanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Are the heads yours or from rguyver? It almost sounds like the valves are bent. Or you could be right and the rings are toast. What about the DP? Is it gutted? Maybe plugged, but that doesnt explain the bad compression. Your also right about the carby short block, alot easier to find Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XSNRG Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Maybe the compression would be higher if it was crammed up rguyvers as**hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nug Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Haha. IBTL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 1, 2004 Author Share Posted November 1, 2004 rob, if there's one thing that's not a problem on this car, it's restrictive exhaust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Hey Andy Could be cam timing, one or both cams could be off buy a tooth, I’ve never done it but I bet it would still run (just not well). Or like you said, bad rings. Here’s an old school trick to figure out where you are losing compression, do a regular compression check (warmed up, all plugs out, full battery, throttle fully open, crank 3 or 4 times tell pressure stops building), then put about a teaspoon of oil (one good squirt from an oil can) in a cylinder at a time and immediately check again. If the compression goes up its bad rings (oil fills the piston to wall gap), if the compression is unchanged its valves. Just some thoughts Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 he's got a point.i remember my dad doing that old trick erl thru the sperk plog hull.........we should try that drew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petersubaru Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 leak-down test together with a compression test will pin point the trouble...rings or valves or maybe both....that is, if there is a problem there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Hey Andy Could be cam timing, one or both cams could be off buy a tooth, I’ve never done it but I bet it would still run (just not well). Or like you said, bad rings. Here’s an old school trick to figure out where you are losing compression, do a regular compression check (warmed up, all plugs out, full battery, throttle fully open, crank 3 or 4 times tell pressure stops building), then put about a teaspoon of oil (one good squirt from an oil can) in a cylinder at a time and immediately check again. If the compression goes up its bad rings (oil fills the piston to wall gap), if the compression is unchanged its valves. Just some thoughts Gary In my experience, It will run with the belt a tooth or so off. The engine will actually start and run with the non-disty-side belt broken... just not very well. And the oil "trick" works a whole lot better on an upright-cylindered engine. A little harder to be sure the oil spread to the top side of rings on our boxers. Also, might just as easily help to seal the valves... The "no particular order" on compression makes one thing difficult for me to tell: Are the extra low cylinders on same side? (BTW, does the compression gauge show "normal" pressures on some other engine?) Anyway, I would seriously look at t-belt timing. Free Advice Day!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 1, 2004 Author Share Posted November 1, 2004 thanks for the inputs, guys. i guess the first/easiest thing to do would be to double check the timing belts..and distributor timing. 22-25 BTDC right? i will need to come up with an adapter to do a leakdown test so i will do ANOTHER compression test and the leakdown test at the same time later... i recall that I tried the teaspoon of oil trick earlier with no notable effect.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 12, 2004 Author Share Posted November 12, 2004 OK, I checked the timing belts. they appear to be on. the dots on the cam gears are each about 1/8" to the inside of the notches in the plastic case. This is equivalent at the most to about a half a tooth each and I would guess that it is within allowable specs? ... there are no funny noises like a slappy distributor.. I didn't check the distributor timing as I had done that a while ago, and the distributor being off doesn't affect the compression anyway... ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Do you have equipment to do a leakdown test? Or at least a compressor and fitting to pressurize the cylinders (one at a time) and listen for the hiss and/or looking for other signs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 12, 2004 Author Share Posted November 12, 2004 i have access to an air compressor but i need to come up with a fitting for the spark plug holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Maybe the compression would be higher if it was crammed up rguyvers as**hole. Just a thought but maybe Mark's idea might work? Like I said, just a thought:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanislru Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 i have access to an air compressor but i need to come up with a fitting for the spark plug holes. There is a thread about unsiezing a motor by drilling out the bottom of a spark plug, removeing the porcelain and welding a nipple on it so you can pump grease into the cylinder and force it free. Couldn't you weld a male compressor fitting to a plug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 There is a thread about unsiezing a motor by drilling out the bottom of a spark plug, removeing the porcelain and welding a nipple on it so you can pump grease into the cylinder and force it free. Couldn't you weld a male compressor fitting to a plug? Ummm... seems like a lot of work. I am pretty sure that my Craftsman compression tester can un-couple from its gauge head and connect to any standard quick release air coupler. Probably other similar solutions available at NAPA or wherever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 12, 2004 Author Share Posted November 12, 2004 yeah, i need to come up with something. what's this about rguyver? i suspect the cause is the fact that rguyver's customer, tyrel, drove it at boost and overheated it once and didn't tell me. is there something about rguyver that i need to know here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 yeah, i need to come up with something. what's this about rguyver? i suspect the cause is the fact that rguyver's customer, tyrel, drove it at boost and overheated it once and didn't tell me. is there something about rguyver that i need to know here? Just that English can be a tricky language. From your original post: engine has 12k on a rebuild by rguyver, his customer overheated it and had rguyver reseal it at one point during the 12k miles. then the ba$tard sold it to me without mentioning this occurrence. The assumption by myself, and seems like some others, was that the "ba$tard" referred to rguyver, not the customer. Like I said, tricky language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted November 12, 2004 Author Share Posted November 12, 2004 Just that English can be a tricky language. ...engine has 12k on a rebuild by rguyver, his customer overheated it and had rguyver reseal it at one point during the 12k miles. then the ba$tard sold it to me without mentioning this occurrence. I have absolute confidence in rguyver's quality of work... yeah, i tried to avoid giving that impression.. here: -engine has 12k on a rebuild by rguyver, his customer overheated it and had rguyver reseal it at one point during the 12k miles. -then the ba$tard ... confusion because rguyver was the last person i mentioned.. but i meant for it to read that "the customer had rguyver reseal it for him at one point and then the customer sold it to me without mentioning this occurrence." -I have absolute confidence in rguyver's quality of work this was there all along! no worries though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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