bearbalu Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 I have both the Haynes manual and Subaru service manuals. 1. On water pump, Haynes manual recommends globbing the gasket with sealant, Subaru service manual says nothing of this sort. Does anyone know what the right thing to do is? If sealant is to be used, ultra grey okay? 99obw decided to use no sealant... http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2444&page=3&pp=10&highlight=water+pump+sealant+haynes 2. On oil pump, Haynes manual recommends anaerobic sealant, Subaru recommends three bond 1215/Permatex Ultra Grey. I am planning going with Ultra Grey based on following thread - this person called dealerships and they went with three bond 1215. Any reason to do otherwise? http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=12100&page=2&pp=10&highlight=Anaerobic+oil+pump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradosubarules Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 I used the ultra grey to do my oil pump and have gone many thousand miles with no problems. It is safe to say that it would be safe for your water pump as well. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99obw Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 We have about 50k miles on that water pump and not a drop has leaked, so I would not use a sealant. It comes from the factory with only the metal gasket and no sealant, so that's how I put it back together. I have used both the anerobic and ultra-black on suby oil pumps, never a leak with either. Ultra-gray should be even better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearbalu Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 99obw, thanks. That's what I noticed too on waterpump - no sealant from factory. Just curious, could using the sealant hurt - actually CAUSE a leak? Also, on oil pump, I used a gasket remover liquid. I am wondering if I need to clean out the gasket remover thorougly (with water) before putting oil pump. back. I don't want gasket remover to eat the new seal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99obw Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 99obw, thanks. That's what I noticed too on waterpump - no sealant from factory. Just curious, could using the sealant hurt - actually CAUSE a leak? Also, on oil pump, I used a gasket remover liquid. I am wondering if I need to clean out the gasket remover thorougly (with water) before putting oil pump. back. I don't want gasket remover to eat the new seal... Seeing how the old pump never leaked, and the new pump has never leaked, how could using sealant improve anything? I have never used gasket remover, so I really don't know, but in general you want things as clean as possible before assembly. I like to clean things with brake cleaner or acetone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearbalu Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 Thanks. BTW, when applying ultra grey to oil pump, should it be applied to both surfaces (oil pump and block) or just one? If only to one, is it oil pump or block or does it matter? Generically speaking, if two surfaces need to be sealed, should it be applied to both or one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99obw Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Make sure you get both surfaces free of dirt, sealant, etc, then wipe clean with acetone. I like to apply the sealant to the part that was removed, i.e. pump, pan, etc. I like to let the sealant set on the part for about 15 minutes before assembly. Be very careful not to use too much sealant, generally a 1/8" bead is adequate, making sure to encircle any bolt holes. If the mating surface is wider than about 1/2" I like to put a bead about 1/4" in from each edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradosubarules Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 If you use a quality sealent such as super grey it is just cheap insurance. The metal gasket is fine and dandy but everyone knows a little extra won't hurt. No matter what kind of gasket I am using I always use some some form of Permatex product with said gasket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearbalu Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 You mean you put permatex on other metal gaskets - HEAD GASKET (which I am doing!), intake and exaust manifold - Subaru doesn't talk about it either. BTW, THe overhaul gasket set includes item (15048AA001) , qty 2, called "SEALING-OIL PUMP" - do you know what that is? I can't find a seal that I need to replace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillip Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Install your head gaskets DRY! Carefully clean both surfaces, but do not scratch the aluminum and follow the torque-to-yield specifications in your manual EXACTLY and you'll have good results. We use a spray-on gasket remover on all aluminum surfaces with excellent results. I've always sealed the oil pump with Permatex Anaerobic sealer (Permatex part #51813) - never had one leak yet! You mean you put permatex on other metal gaskets - HEAD GASKET (which I am doing!), intake and exaust manifold - Subaru doesn't talk about it either. BTW, THe overhaul gasket set includes item (15048AA001) , qty 2, called "SEALING-OIL PUMP" - do you know what that is? I can't find a seal that I need to replace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillip Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 I neglected to address your question about the oil pump seals. If memory serves me correctly (don't bet on that!), they are referring to the two 'o' rings that sandwich between the block and the oil pump. You mean you put permatex on other metal gaskets - HEAD GASKET (which I am doing!), intake and exaust manifold - Subaru doesn't talk about it either. BTW, THe overhaul gasket set includes item (15048AA001) , qty 2, called "SEALING-OIL PUMP" - do you know what that is? I can't find a seal that I need to replace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradosubarules Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 If my memory serves me correct there is only one O-ring on the back side of the pump. I was lazy when re-installing my oil pump so I just put super grey on top of the o-ring and put it back on. Be sure to tigher the 3 screws on the back of the oil pump as they back out over time. Scange out the oil seal on the front of the oil pump too. Very important. I have never done a head gasket (nor have I needed to thank god) so I am not in the position to speak on the matter. When I watch The horsepower block on spike TV I always see them sticking on dry. Some use cork, some use copper...some use both stacked....I guess it is application specific. I hope you nor I ever have to replace a headgasket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenSisters Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 A little Permatex helps where there may not be a perfect mating surface, eg. some corrosion, baked on dirt you should have removed, a little scatch or ding you created when you took it apart, etc. I don't use it on my oil plug gasket, but like several people have said, it's cheap insurance for many other sealing needs, but don't go overboard. It's not for head gaskets or exhaust gaskets. Most other uses are OK, but the type you use has to have fluid resistance to what you are trying to seal. Gas or oil or coolant or vacuum or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearbalu Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 Thanks folks. I do need to replace head gasket too. I have used Permatex Gasket remover and a plastic putty knife on the cylinder block. BTW, what is clean surface supposed to look like for head gasket replacement? I still see fair amount of dark spots (it's not shiny silvery clean all the way through). Doesn't seem like they will come off with even a razor blade. Some gasket remover has slipped into coolant/oil passages. Should I hose it with water or just run the engine with water to clean it out? BTW, I removed carbon from piston tops and carbon ring at top of cylinder bore. Yeh, there is one oil pump O-ring that I am planning to replace and is obvious. What threw me off was the quantity of 2 in the packing list. Since the overhaul gasket set doesn't identify each of them with labels, I was wondering if I had missed out anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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