Snowman Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Hey everybody, it's story time. So a friend basically gave me his 89 RX this fall after it SEVERELY overheated and would not run afterward. I parked it until this last week, as I had to go off to school. Got back, pulled the engine, and stripped it down to the shortblock. What I've found so far that was fubared (in order of appearance): -Oil had no coolant in it. Smelled like it got hot but not really hot (at least for very long). -Timing belt covers melted from heat badly enough that I had to break some of them off. -Passenger side cam FROZEN! The crank pulley chewed the teeth off of the T-belt. I could not turn the cam with a large wrench and couldn't get the cam tower apart either. WTF? -Driver side cam turned fine but the sprocket was off a tooth or two (haven't looked at the bearings yet). -Head gaskets looked fine. They could have been leaking a little, but I couldn't find any evidence of it. -Heads slightly warped with cracks in exhaust ports that reached around the valve seats and joined with the usual cracks between the valves. Exhaust valves had white residue on them? -A tiny tiny bit of surface rust in cylinder #3 that looked more like it was caused by moisture in the air coming in through an open intake or exhaust valve than any coolant sitting in the cylinder. I also took the heads off of the spare turbo motor, which need two new valve guides and some minor resurfacing but are otherwise in good shape so I'll use them. They have the EA82 with a line underneath casting (which gen is that?) I'm also taking the cams and cam towers off of that engine as they are in good shape. So the first question is, what kind of shape do you think the shortblock is in? It turns fine by hand and it cranked over in the car without making any strange noises. Am I wasting my time if I don't rebuild this engine or is it reasonable to think that the rings and bearings are okay? The second question is about the EGR system. The engine that was in the car had an EGR valve, which took the exhaust gases from what I'm used to seeing (this is the first time I've worked on a turbo soob) as the ASV port underneath the driver's side head. The heads I am using do not have this hole drilled and tapped out as that engine had no EGR valve. Is it worthwhile to modify that head so that I can keep the EGR on there, or is it not needed? Also, will the computer be confused if it doesn't have a functional EGR valve? Your thoughts please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWX Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 I wouldn't. the EGR doesn't do much of anything. I mean if its on there leave if not don't worry about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrKrazy Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Those are gen 2 heads with the EA82 that's underlined. The shortblock sounds 50/50 but is hard to say, how many miles were on the shortblock when this happened? Too bad you weren't able to do compression tests because of the screwed up side before you yanked it apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebz Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 As has been stated, those are gen 2 heads.. The shortblock is really hard to tell..if the cylinders look good and there were no funny noises when cranking, I say go for it. I, from experience, recommend timeserting the headbolt threads.. especially if the block has seen some heat. Cam frozen? wow.. just wow. EGR.. I'm in the same boat.. my motor in its original car didn't have an EGR either.. somae motor now in another car, I had to use a diffferent intake manifold with the EGR stuff on it. I left everything in place and too the hard line that runs from the intake to the head... went down about 6 inches, cut it and plugged it off. I get no codes, inspectors see a stock EGR setup, it worked well for the remainder of that motor's life, and seeing how I am using the same heads and intake on the new motor, I expect it will be the same for quite a while yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 From what I know, the engine didn't have that many miles on it. It was a low-mileage Japanese pullout engine put in somewhere between 80k and 100k (can't remember exactly what the previous owner said) and the car has 130k on it now. Hrm.... If I have to rebuild it, I could use the carbed short block sitting in my garage right now, he he he. I think I'm probably going to roll the dice on this one though. Seems like no EGR is necessary, so I'm not gonna screw with it. Calebz, what is this timeserting that you speak of? Some way of reconditioning the threads? I remember you talking about stripping one out a while back... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebz Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Calebz, what is this timeserting that you speak of? Some way of reconditioning the threads? I remember you talking about stripping one out a while back... http://www.timesert.com/ I used them on my turbo motor. Haven't gotten it in the car yet, but after stripping more than one headbolt at less than OE torque specs, I did all 18 holes with these things... felt sooooo much better when I put the heads on this time. I seem to recall hearing that CCR uses them on their EA82T rebuilds as well. If you can't get them locally, let me know. Theres a place about 30 miles from me that has them for a decent price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyruss Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 yeah timeserts good. as for your EGR. it does serve a purpous. but as it seems it wont just bolt on to what you have I have to agree that you will probably be ok with out it. just make sure your timing is correct and the knock sensor works. from the damage described I would be afraid to reuse any parts off that old motor. start fresh with a good used or rebuilt motor. the lower end may be saveable but it would need to be torn down and inspected verry closely with mics and straigt edges ect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWX Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 calebz, did you use new head bolts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 After worrying about the condition of the internals for most of today, I went ahead and ordered rings and bearings as well as a new oil pump. Checked the mating surfaces on the block with a "precision straight edge" I borrowed from work and the block is still true. Hopefully I can get all the parts here in time to get it together before I have to leave again. Checked out that Timesert website. Looks pretty cool. Is installation similar to a Heli-coil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WJM Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Hey everybody, it's story time. Ok, tell away! So a friend basically gave me his 89 RX this fall after it SEVERELY overheated and would not run afterward. I parked it until this last week, as I had to go off to school. Got back, pulled the engine, and stripped it down to the shortblock. Cool, RX's are great...especially free ones. Do you get to keep this one? What I've found so far that was fubared (in order of appearance):-Oil had no coolant in it. Smelled like it got hot but not really hot (at least for very long). -Timing belt covers melted from heat badly enough that I had to break some of them off. -Passenger side cam FROZEN! The crank pulley chewed the teeth off of the T-belt. I could not turn the cam with a large wrench and couldn't get the cam tower apart either. WTF? -Driver side cam turned fine but the sprocket was off a tooth or two (haven't looked at the bearings yet). -Head gaskets looked fine. They could have been leaking a little, but I couldn't find any evidence of it. -Heads slightly warped with cracks in exhaust ports that reached around the valve seats and joined with the usual cracks between the valves. Exhaust valves had white residue on them? -A tiny tiny bit of surface rust in cylinder #3 that looked more like it was caused by moisture in the air coming in through an open intake or exhaust valve than any coolant sitting in the cylinder. Hot oil smell=BAD. Melted T-belt covers=BAD. Frozen Cam=BAD. is there a stuck valve making the camnot want to turn? And explain by not getting the cam tower off...the cam 'case' wont ome off the head? Heads sound fu-bared.... Rust=no issue really. I also took the heads off of the spare turbo motor, which need two new valve guides and some minor resurfacing but are otherwise in good shape so I'll use them. They have the EA82 with a line underneath casting (which gen is that?) I'm also taking the cams and cam towers off of that engine as they are in good shape. Gen 2 heads. Gen 3 has a box around the EA82 casting. So the first question is, what kind of shape do you think the shortblock is in? It turns fine by hand and it cranked over in the car without making any strange noises. Am I wasting my time if I don't rebuild this engine or is it reasonable to think that the rings and bearings are okay? I would not trust the SB..im sure it can be used, but i would be cautious. I personally have used worse with good results....as experimental engines. They performed great until the final demise of the NAPA head gaskets...or too much boost/fuel. The second question is about the EGR system. The engine that was in the car had an EGR valve, which took the exhaust gases from what I'm used to seeing (this is the first time I've worked on a turbo soob) as the ASV port underneath the driver's side head. The heads I am using do not have this hole drilled and tapped out as that engine had no EGR valve. Is it worthwhile to modify that head so that I can keep the EGR on there, or is it not needed? Also, will the computer be confused if it doesn't have a functional EGR valve? I would not mess with the EGR...i's take the pipe off the EGR valve and dis connect it from the vac sourse and leave it at that. Ive had several combos on non egr heads to egr manifolds and vice versa...and i've always done away with the EGRs. Your thoughts please. You got 'em! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 I'm not sure what's going to happen with the car. I might keep it, but that's kind of a tough decision. I can make at least several hundred dollars selling it (pretty good market up here if they're in decent shape), or the previous owner might want to get it back after paying me for my time. I really don't want to pay to insure two cars right now either, but I suppose I could switch back and fourth with my current Subaru on that. Yup, those heads are TOAST! Any ideas of something cool I could make with them? As to the cam being frozen, for clarification the cam tower unbolted from the head fine, I just can't get the little piece out of the front that holds the cam seal, and the cam still wouldn't turn after putting penetrating oil on it. I think that it starved for oil during the overheat, as the oil pressure probably went way down when it got hot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WJM Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 sounds like the case is toast too.... :-\ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archemitis Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 yar melted stuff is bad. id buy a junkyard motor before i stuck spensive stuff like rings and bearings into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 yar melted stuff is bad. id buy a junkyard motor before i stuck spensive stuff like rings and bearings into it.He he, that's a bit of a problem in AK where we don't have ANY good yards. Also, since aside from two cities that do I.M., there are no inspections here, cars don't end up in yards until they are absolutely worthless (you should see some of the stuff running around up here, it's hilarious). I'd be better off putting it together with the old rings and bearings than trying to find a motor for it at the nearest junkyard, which is 750 miles away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tizzle Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Well, just discovered tonight that I'm in the same boat as you. My heads are cracked, and this leaves me unsure about the condition of the block. So I should check those with a precision straight edge? Anything else? --Todd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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